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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Dec 2020
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I have been trying to find an All-In-One application/workflow that allows me to:
1) Take an existing music file (MP3, WAV, Mp4, etc.) that has all lyrics, instruments, drums, bass, etc. and
2) Decompose it into each "STEM" or instrument, vocals, etc.
3) Create a Chord File with tempo, time signature, key, and lyrics
4) Allows me to modify the style with BIAB
5) Create a backing track with lyrics (minus the instrument I play) and chords
6) Add a click track
7) Store file as MP3/WAV with metadata that has the full fields you would find for MP3 meta data
And do this all within one application, or with an easy workflow that let's the computer do the work, not me!
My goal is to go to a gig with my playlist of songs (on an iPAD or computer) that have been created, hopefully using BIAB (only) and sound like the original (except with my selected Styles), but the lead (melody or rhythms) played and sung by me.
I think a reasonable time to create this per song should be between 15 to 30 min max.
Please advise.
Thanks, DJLu
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15 - 30 minutes is a little unrealistic. and as for splitting an mp3 into different instruments that's not possible in BIAB and RB as far as i know - or indded in any program the way you describe. try this post for a way of splitting audio tracks https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=605070#Post605070but the results may not be of the quality you want to use as backing tracks for a live performance. this thread shows you how to add tracks to an imported mp3 https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=629469#Post629469but that is just a solo performance needing added backing tracks. maybe the best way forward is high quality midi tracks which you can easily import and split the instruments in RealBand. here's a thread on high quality midis. https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=631081&gonew=1#UNREADget a high quality midi import it into RB so the instruments appear on separate tracks. mute the instrument you play and mute the melody if you are going to sing it. add realtracks if you like. export to a wav file, open in audacity and then export as an mp3 (that's how i get metadata to appear on the file - i'm not sure how it can be done in simple mp3 export from RB). alternatively, you can open the mp3 in BIAB and detect the chords and tempo. then you can vary the style in BIAB but as far as i know you can't split the instruments as you want from the mp3. you'll have the mp3 as the audio track and BIAB tracks - midi or Real will sound strange if played alongside the original mix. and please be aware that if you use midi as i suggest you will need a good quality soft synth or the sound will not be good enough for backing tracks. BIAB and RB are great programs but they can't circumnavigate the physics of audio recording so for backing tracks why not stick to commercial high quality midis on which you can mute tracks as you like and change keys if necessary.
Last edited by Bob Calver; 12/19/20 12:30 PM.
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I have been trying to find an All-In-One application/workflow that allows me to:
1) Take an existing music file (MP3, WAV, Mp4, etc.) that has all lyrics, instruments, drums, bass, etc. and
2) Decompose it into each "STEM" or instrument, vocals, etc.
3) Create a Chord File with tempo, time signature, key, and lyrics
4) Allows me to modify the style with BIAB
5) Create a backing track with lyrics (minus the instrument I play) and chords
6) Add a click track
7) Store file as MP3/WAV with metadata that has the full fields you would find for MP3 meta data
And do this all within one application, or with an easy workflow that let's the computer do the work, not me!
My goal is to go to a gig with my playlist of songs (on an iPAD or computer) that have been created, hopefully using BIAB (only) and sound like the original (except with my selected Styles), but the lead (melody or rhythms) played and sung by me.
I think a reasonable time to create this per song should be between 15 to 30 min max.
Please advise.
Thanks, DJLu A good way to think of this is like a cake. Once you mix it and bake it (existing music track) it is not very easy to extract the eggs, flour, etc. (individual stems)! And 15-30 minutes doesn't sound like enough time even if you find a magic software that can split everything cleanly into stems.
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Forum member Henry Clarke has a YouTube channel that he presents BIAB tutorials how he uses BIAB to create backing tracks from audio files and midi files. You may enjoy looking at those and get a few pointers.
BIAB Ultra Pak+ 2024:RB 2024, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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I suggest 3 days and then it often won't sound that much like the original - unless you rebuild them completely in midi. A much better idea would be to buy professional copy songs with the minus 1 for your instrument and voice. I think they're a few $US each - especially if bulk bought. Then work on your presentation.
This concept is the 'Holy Grail' of BIAB. I prefer to think of BIAB as a great tool to produce songs 'in the style of...' or originals and then go perform them in your own spectacular way.
Anyway, most of the public don't care / won't notice how close the copy is especially if alcohol is added. People just want to have fun and be the centre of attention. You'll get more loyal fans by knowing their names and letting them come up and wreck their favourite song live...
Thoughts others.
Last edited by lambada; 12/19/20 08:11 PM.
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487
BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
Intel(R) Core(TM), i3-4160, CPU @3.60 GHz RAM 16 GB, 64 Bit X64-based processor
Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi)
VoiceLive 3 Extreme, Sputnik Valve Condenser Mic
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I have been trying to find an All-In-One application/workflow that allows me to:
1) Take an existing music file (MP3, WAV, Mp4, etc.) that has all lyrics, instruments, drums, bass, etc. and
2) Decompose it into each "STEM" or instrument, vocals, etc.
3) Create a Chord File with tempo, time signature, key, and lyrics
4) Allows me to modify the style with BIAB
5) Create a backing track with lyrics (minus the instrument I play) and chords
6) Add a click track
7) Store file as MP3/WAV with metadata that has the full fields you would find for MP3 meta data
And do this all within one application, or with an easy workflow that let's the computer do the work, not me!
My goal is to go to a gig with my playlist of songs (on an iPAD or computer) that have been created, hopefully using BIAB (only) and sound like the original (except with my selected Styles), but the lead (melody or rhythms) played and sung by me.
I think a reasonable time to create this per song should be between 15 to 30 min max.
Please advise.
Thanks, DJLu What you are proposing is possible, but not with audio files. Find a good MIDI version of the song(s) you want to do; there are many good free and ones for purchase out there. Bring them into your DAW, RB, or BiaB. Assign a MIDI sound source to each track. Note there are better sounds out there than in BiaB's GM. Some of the free Soundfonts (SF2) are better. Delete or mute the tracks that you want to do and save as an audio file. With everything you need on hand the total time would be around 15-30 minutes. I know as I have been there and done that. YMMV.
Last edited by MarioD; 12/20/20 06:16 AM.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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+1 to lambadas comments.
As far as I know there is no software that will do what you want in 15-30 minutes. I know there are some out there selling some of that capability. My experience using some of it has been underwhelming. Interesting technology, but I'm not taking those tracks out on a gig.
I play instrumental tunes over backing tracks using a guitar, an ipad and a small pa. 95% of the tracks I created using BIAB and a DAW.
Truthfully, note for note is not for me.
I don't care much for purchased backing tracks or stems. I feel I can do better using biab in my workflow. I don't have much experience yet with midi, purchased or free.
BIAB affords you a lot of power to develop arrangements that fit you. Its not a perfect tool but it will help get you out and gigging with a solid "band" behind you. Assuming we get to gig again.
For me a new track simple 4 part track takes a good 4-5 hours to be ready for audition live at a club. Sometimes it takes a day, sometimes more. Lots of decisions need making. Your ideas don't always pan out first attempt. I suggest you start simple with easy song forms, changes and rhythms. Learn the tool a bit before you tackle something tough. After you make them, you have to practice them regularly. That adds to the workload.
Good Luck.
biab2023(Mac)
Logic Pro X
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Thanks for your response. I will research those sites you mentioned. I have long looked for "high quality MIDIs" as you described, but these are hard to come by. I was hoping to use BIAB to dissect an existing MP3 and create the separate tracks like you mentioned so that I can manipulate these and add the styles. The big issue is that ACW is very time consuming to find the chords since you have to create the timing reference for each measure. My 30 minute timeframe is based on actual time spent using Ableton Live 10 where I downloaded a KAR file and produced a backing track in similar fashion to what you described. However, I find some real value in BIAB if I would be able to do the same, but change the styles in real time. What would be really good is for this forum or similar website to actually create the BIAB song files for all popular music the same way that the MIDI libraries exist everywhere. If you take a look at iREALPro forum ( https://irealb.com/forums/), they have actually done this for the iRealPro app. It works great, and is very simple to use. The problem is that it uses the MIDI styles and not the real styles like BIAB. So, maybe this forum can fill that gap! Let all forum users upload their BIAB songs to this forum and share with everyone. These can be input into the Song Picker in BIAB. Maybe this exists and I don't know about it. Any thoughts?
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Thanks for your response. I will research those sites you mentioned. I have long looked for "high quality MIDIs" as you described, but these are hard to come by. I was hoping to use BIAB to dissect an existing MP3 and create the separate tracks like you mentioned so that I can manipulate these and add the styles. The big issue is that ACW is very time consuming to find the chords since you have to create the timing reference for each measure.
My 30 minute timeframe is based on actual time spent using Ableton Live 10 where I downloaded a KAR file and produced a backing track in similar fashion to what you described. However, I find some real value in BIAB if I would be able to do the same, but change the styles in real time. What would be really good is for this forum or similar website to actually create the BIAB song files for all popular music the same way that the MIDI libraries exist everywhere. If you take a look at iREALPro forum ( https://irealb.com/forums/), they have actually done this for the iRealPro app. It works great, and is very simple to use. The problem is that it uses the MIDI styles and not the real styles like BIAB. So, maybe this forum can fill that gap! Let all forum users upload their BIAB songs to this forum and share with everyone. These can be input into the Song Picker in BIAB. Maybe this exists and I don't know about it.
Any thoughts?
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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The site Karaoke Version is pretty good place to get kind of what you are looking for. You can choose to customize the MP3 backing track exactly as you want it. You can even adjust the key within limits. I have used it once or twice and the results were what I was expecting and at a cost of 2 to 3 dollars per file, it is not too expensive. visit the site, pick a song, choose if you want guitar backing tracks, etc. you can experiment for free with a snippet of any song they have. Not exactly what you were talking about but could be a resource for you. Otherwise the Norton fake disks are good, midi styles will allow you to adjust as you see fit and create very good reasonable facsimiles of any song you wish.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
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Download the app to a mac, ipad, or Android tablet called Jamzone I use it a lot and it is very capable. https://www.jamzone.com/Thousands of song titles and the ability to add in an instrument channel to the mix. I Bluetooth it to my PA and connect my mike and guitar to the PA. You can turn off any instrument that you plan to play. each song file comes with a scratch lead vocal, and most have backing vocals as well a some pretty realistic instruments both tempo, and key are changeable.
Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2022, Realband, Harrison Mixbus 32c version 9.1324, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
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My 30 minute timeframe is based on actual time spent using Ableton Live 10 where I downloaded a KAR file and produced a backing track in similar fashion to what you described. However, I find some real value in BIAB if I would be able to do the same, but change the styles in real time. I'm curious which you find better for composing: Ableton or BIAB?
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you'll have to refer to your other post to see an answer
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Honestly, it sounds you want to take someone else's work and use it as your own, but you don't want to work very hard at it. So you're asking other people to donate the files they've created to you instead. I mean, seriously - what you're asking for it at the edge of what's technically possible. But on top of that, you want to happen in one easy workflow, and in fifteen minutes?
Last edited by dcuny; 12/26/20 09:36 PM.
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Don't underestimate the value of something like TCHelicon's tools for autotuen, audio harmonies, effects etc. I've got both the VoiceLive 2 and the VoiceLive 3Ext. I'm sure that eventually they'll be a 4 which will be mind blowing. Only been waiting 5 years!
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487
BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
Intel(R) Core(TM), i3-4160, CPU @3.60 GHz RAM 16 GB, 64 Bit X64-based processor
Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi)
VoiceLive 3 Extreme, Sputnik Valve Condenser Mic
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<< I have been trying to find an All-In-One application/workflow that allows me to: 1) Take an existing music file (MP3, WAV, Mp4, etc.) that has all lyrics, instruments, drums, bass, etc. and 2) Decompose it into each "STEM" or instrument, vocals, etc. 3) Create a Chord File with tempo, time signature, key, and lyrics 4) Allows me to modify the style with BIAB 5) Create a backing track with lyrics (minus the instrument I play) and chords 6) Add a click track 7) Store file as MP3/WAV with metadata that has the full fields you would find for MP3 meta data And do this all within one application, or with an easy workflow that let's the computer do the work, not me! >> There's an easy workflow that completes this task but there's quite a bit of tedious user work and time involved as well. Meaning, the workflow is easy, straightforward and quite effective but the task itself is difficult. I've attached a video that's condensed steps one and two down to just over an hour for one song... Steps 3-7 can all be done using BIAB after steps one and two have been completed to prep an MP3 that will be used in BIAB. Mixing Masterclass with Michael Brauer
BIAB Ultra Pak+ 2024:RB 2024, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
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Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
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Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
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With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
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If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
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Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
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