|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,058
Expert
|
Expert
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,058 |
To be equal one to another, one needs to earn the equality. What I mean by this is if I asked to join any of you here as a fellow musician and play with a group I must prove I am equal to the task. You may let me try out but it would quickly become apparent that my skills are lacking. If this were a paying gig and I caused us not to get paid because of my lack of ability, we would all be equally poor but that would not be fair.
Knowing that I have no musical talent, why would you allow me to both screw up your earning a living and inflict pain on the audience., what good purpose would that serve.
One should have the opportunity to learn the skills, but this does not mean I'm entitled to a college education. in many areas of interest, a person can learn from the knowledge around them. Many successful people learn from digging and doing, not sitting and being spoon feed drivel.
We have to discern the difference between fact and opinion and not confuse the two.
Fact:I can not play a musical instrument well enough to join anyone else in this endeavor Opinion: I think I do well for what I know.
Where have we gone to loose sight of earning our way and accomplishing great things is wrong.
John, don't be angry at Christ, He gave us all life and paid for all of our debts and did not give me the ability to play an instrument, be very thankful of that.
Folks if you want help, help someone, if love, love others; fairness, be fair. We are the other fellow we talk about.
Wyndham
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
I think the comments offered so far have been excellent and very well-considered... yet all different!
An emerging pattern is that the way we define equality has a lot to do with how we think it should be accommodated in society.
If you define it as spiritual equality, then you see the the implications as pertaining to equal access to God, and of being in the same spirit, and not about secular life at all.
If you see it as meaning equal in terms of opportunity, then you will tend to advocate social programs to make opportunity available for everybody
if you see it as meaning equal according to any concrete definition of equality, you will tend to dismiss the idea entirely based on visual evidence
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
george orwells statement is rather interesting in animal farm.
"all men are created equal but some more so than others".
twas ever thus and ever will be.
Generally speaking:
People with education, money, influential families, good looks, nice physique etc have more opportunities in life than those without those things. None of that is distributed equally at birth. Yet many people without them manage to be successful anyway. And many people with them manage to be unsuccessful.
As is true in a game of cards, a lot is determined by how well you play the hand you've been dealt
But there are limits to how much you can overcome even with diligence and determination. It has been said that "The battle is not always to the strong, nor the race to the swift... but that's generally the way to bet"
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
regarding the effects of how we interpret the idea of equality influencing how we expect it to be implemented:
A worst case would be to create a society that believes in a misplaced notion of equality. Such a society would produce people who believe they are entitled to the same standard of living as someone else who is willing to endure a great deal of work and inconvenience to arrive at that state of comfort.
Nature shows us that diligence generally leads to a life less filled with unsolvable problems, and lack of it generally leads to... problems
Yet , the whole time people are screaming that they are underprivileged, and the government needs to help them, there are immigrants coming to the same country who work 2 jobs, share their house with relatives, and manage to become relatively affluent in a single generation.
If you look at the cause and effect, I have to wonder if government is reinforcing the wrong things. Here is the golden rule of human behavior:"Behavior that is rewarded gets repeated. Behavior that is not rewarded tends to stop being repeated as people continue to look for something that works"
If we enact a policy of rewarding a lack of diligence, and punishing those who are truly generating revenue (I'm not talking about wall street weasels who don't generate anything except profits for themselves.. I'm talking about people who inconvenience themselves to add value) then it won't be long before the diligent stop doing what they do, and eveyone is standing in the "take care of me" line
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
I know a lot of you pray a lot. Jesus will fix it. As I said before, show me a church that prays and people live longer than the national average and I'm joining the next day. But we all know that won't happen. Sorry.
John,
there are a lot of different CHristian denominations, and not all of them believe in divine intervention /healing in this life. I'm kind of like you.. show me the church full of old people who never died, and then I'll believe that way. But there remains a 100% mortality rate. Based on that, my conclusion is that God makes no PROMISE to intervene in the way we would like to see intervention. But the bible DOES say to pray :
"Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God." Phillippians 4: 6
I see prayer not as being a vehicle for me to boss God around, but rather as a vehicle for surrendering my will to His. The rest of the passage I quoted above continues as follows:
Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God. And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.
The function of prayer is peace and surrender. I would bet that not everybody here sees it that way, but I lay that on the table because it isn't that much different from what you already believe. I dare say, it is downright compatible.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
Seriously, this statement shows a failure to understand the basic premise that "equality" has nothing to do with a man's abilities, rather it is a recognition of our INabilities. <snip>
The premise you offer begs to create an aristocracy of the so-called learned class.
No thanks.
--Mac
Mac,
Much of what I'm saying here is for the sake of portraying the various points of view on the subject. I have yet to state my own. I agree with what you say here. Thanks for your input. I wanted somebody to say out loud that EQUALITY is not equality of human ability, as some would suggest.
However, the fact remains that lots of people DO interpret it in the very way you just rejected it. Part of what I hope this discussion accomplishes is to really examine the reasoning behind our opinions so we can see why intelligent people can come to such varied conclusions given the same set of information.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
now heres whats interesting from a social standpoint. according to many social scientists ive had discussions with..poverty breeds crime n anti social behaviour. yet..interestingly enough at the school some of the most sadistic and bullying types were from the wealthy end of the spectrum. and some of the nicest from the poor end of the spectrum. thus i often have pondered whether in fact ones "goodness"
or "evil" is based on ones genes rather than ones surroundings one has been brought up in.
I don't think this is a rich/poor thing.. I see it as an entitlement thing. When people start to feel a sense of entitlement, then problems begin.. whether it is rich punks who think they are entitled to be seen as better than others, or poor punks who think they're entitled to your wallet.
Which is why a policy of encouraging entitlement is the wrong way to go IMHO
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,629
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,629 |
I agree with the entitlement issue, I'll leave it at that.
If we are to decipher how equal we are (or how we are equal), we must decide how we will measure.
I guess how you measure it says a lot..in and of itself.
Last edited by rharv; 03/14/10 12:57 PM.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502 |
Never make the mistake of assuming that a certain level of intelligence equates to a certain level of humanitarianism.
History has proven time and again that it does not.
--Mac
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Historically, when diligence is encouraged, more people become diligent, and everyone benefits from the resulting boom.
When you have enough, because you took action and earned it, nobody has to give you anything. Better to be a fox who can always catch his next meal than a dog who has to wait to be fed at somebody else's discretion..
When you have enough, you are free to decide how to distribute your largesse. You can decide to spend it all on necessities or on luxuries or on insurance, or not
One difference between the poor and the rich is that the rich tend to spend money on things that generate more income, whereas the poor tend to spend money on consumables. Which is why yard sales are so common in suburbia. People need to sell what they couldn't live without last year so they can afford to buy what they can't live without this year.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,333
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,333 |
On the issue of 'family' helping, Quebec has a fairly new unique way of doing that. If the family is functional, and an adult child has no job, that person, be they 18 to 50, must return and live with the family. Here, they just get welfare and health care. The same goes for their seniors, if they can be cared for at home, one of the children must take them, and the others pay some of the cost.
If there are issues with needing a home nurse or whatever, the province provides that assistance in the home.
They look at each situation. If you don't want the kid back, you pay within your means and the government then tops that up. But you have to have a really good reason.
In my family, I am really only 1 generation from the farm. And all the seniors stayed at the farm until they passed away. I can see my Great Aunts sitting in a rocker, covered with a blanket, knarled hands holding a paring knife, working on vegetables. The 3 of them, all on 100 acre farms about 2 miles apart, all of them kin of their father who came with his father from Scotland, McDonalds of the Isles. All that generation lived to be over 95.
As for myself, I have just finished the 'apartment' for my parents. They are both 83. The have a nice condo. Paid for by my father's surrogate mother. But my mother is having trouble walking, and my Dad can no longer cope well. I was there all afternoon, helping clean, do laundry and my wife dusted.
We don't see eye to eye on religion, my eye is more cast on your dollar bill, and theirs on an altar.
For me family comes first. My mother remembered that when I was 17 we had a group, my girlfriend on a 12 string, me on the piano, and an elderly concert violinist from Switzerland who's husband was a swiss watchmaker. Julie and I sang Old Rugged Cross at a 'fireside', and my Mom wants me to remake it into a video for her funeral. You don't say no to my Mom. I've almost got it down, but I end up emotional, not over the words or the religious part, but because she wants to hear it, and she says then she will just go to heaven...
On the other hand she's losing it and you have to be careful not to take her where people don't understand, because she can come out with ANYTHING. I mean ANYTHING. It just comes out and she grins and says, I'm a bad woman!
Et alors.
John Conley
Musica est vita
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,629
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,629 |
Quote:
Never make the mistake of assuming that a certain level of intelligence equates to a certain level of humanitarianism.
History has proven time and again that it does not.
--Mac
Ain't that the truth..
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
On the issue of 'family' helping, Quebec has a fairly new unique way of doing that. If the family is functional, and an adult child has no job, that person, be they 18 to 50, must return and live with the family. Here, they just get welfare and health care. The same goes for their seniors, if they can be cared for at home, one of the children must take them, and the others pay some of the cost.
If there are issues with needing a home nurse or whatever, the province provides that assistance in the home.
Ideologically I like the approach of families dealing with their children and older parents instead of turning them over to institutions.
I figure that by the time I am that age, and theres no pension money left, some slick poilitician will make a very eloquent law stating that old people have the right to die, and they'll gather us all up and make sure we do. The movement will probably be funded by Soylent GreenPeace.
;-)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 98
Enthusiast
|
|
Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 98 |
The equality talked about in the Declaration of Independence is meant to be equality under the law. It does not make any statement about financial equality, or social equality, etc. The term 'men' means males who are not slaves, as slaves were considered property, and women certainly had to fight to eventually get the rights that the original 'men' had from the get-go. The Declaration goes on the say these rights include 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happeness' but it's obvious that those are not all-inclusive.
We consider slavery to be horrendous nowadays, but in 1775 it was common and accepted by virually all societies everywhere with few exceptions. We have come a long way on that.
Nothing in the universe is really equal, unless it's atomic particles. Humans are obviously not equal, and are simply not born equal, unless it's under the law in civilized countries. Even that concept is not practiced in reality--just look at the celebities who go to 'rehab' instead of jail like the rest of us, etc.
To narrow the topic a bit: Canadians are pretty happy with their form of national health care--surveys all attest to that. About 85% of American are also pretty content with the system here -- again surveys back this up. Note that in either system the users must pay one way or the other, by taxes or by insurance premiums, so there isn't a free lunch in any system.
Now note this: "The first and foremost duty of any nation is to look after its citizens." I read that with some trepidation. I don't believe that 'look after' means the same thing as 'protect'.
Personally, I do not want the Government to look after me, as I prefer to do that for myself. However, I do want the government to protect me from all enemies, foreign and domestic. For that I will willingly pay my taxes. The US military is consistently the most respected and admired government enity in America by the citizens. The US Congess ranks a bit above child-molesting murderers, and is still sinking.
National philosophies change over time. America has about 30 million uninsured folks who would like coverage. Of course, they get treatment if they need it -- that's a simple fact. Thet can go into any ER and get attention. How they are treated there varies, but the uninsured are not without medical help and treatment, albeit rather expensive treatment, as ERs are high-bucks operations.
Full circle -- is health care a new right? Not yet in the USA, but it's getting there. My feeling is that aside from the military, the US Government is bloated and wasteful and generally incompetent. Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security are all going broke in the not-too-distant future, just as examples. I feel a great unease with these same incompetent people getting their paws into the health care system.
I may be wrong about this, and if so, I will stand corrected, but it seems to me that Canadians generally have a higher regard and more faith in their national Government than most Americans do. This may well be because they have a more efficient and responsive national Government, or it may be because they are [it seems to me anyway] a more respectful and polite people.
In any event, I don't trust the US Government to oversee any part of the national health care system. I believe that may be the real crux of the argument. Until the US Government can prove to the citizens of the US that it's smart and competent enough to oversee the health system in America, I want them to stay away from it. Expensive and complex as it is, it isn't broken yet, and I for one would like to keep it that way.
Fire, the wheel, and the I IV V -- foundations of civilization.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,687
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,687 |
Quote:
Your commercial for the same thing says "may cause deafness, exploding head syndrome, you legs to fall off..." reminds of the old Ktel commercials..50 bad things in 20 seconds. We don't have that, because we don't let lawyers run our country.
This is so true, John. I did a search a few months ago and found a Canadian Supreme Court case that came down I believe within the last 10 years but I'm not sure, that caps malpractice awards at $300,000 with certain exceptions depending on the exact circumstances. Is that true? This alone is a big reason why so many of us don't want the current health care bill to pass, not because the system doesn't need reforming but because of no caps on the lawyers who happen to be the single largest contributors to the Democratic party.
My comment about you getting a free ride on our defense spending is true without it being any kind of attack on the tremendous contributions you guys have made over the years and are making now. It's simply a fact that if you don't have to really, seriously look after your own defense because we're here backing you up is one of the things that allows you to afford a lot of the social programs you currently enjoy. The figures are here defense spending by country Canada is 14th by gdp sandwiched between Brazil and Spain. Brazil ahead of Canada? Who's threatening them? Chavez in Venezuela, I guess. Nothing against your heroism, sacrifice and all that but man, you don't think that has an impact on your ability to afford all this other stuff? Where would your health care be if you had a neighbor who posed a serious threat and your defense spending doubled to 2 or even 3%? Still, you don't have any threats, the Cold War is over, ICBM's are not coming over the North Pole so you don't have anything to worry about and you're taking advantage of it and good for you. I'm not complaining and I don't resent it, don't get me wrong here. When I lived in Calgary, I played a bunch of Canadian Legions and since I'm a US Air Force vet, I got along with the Canadian Forces guys very well. In those days CFB Calgary was still open so Calgary was a military town and I would see them in various venues. I usually went out of my way to say hello.
My point is pure economics, nothing against Canada and I'm still a landed immigrant, I've got family there and could go back any time. If I ever make it out East I may even look your cranky ass up 
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992 |
jazzmammal
just a comical aside to a serious thread..
(every thread needs some levity.)
as your an air force vet..my dad once told me
in ww2 the english air force blokes got cheesed off
always loosing women in england to american forces personnel
(many of whom were good drinkin buddies/mates of my dad)
cos you blokes could afford the silk stockings for the english women
n the english blokes couldnt..lol.
theres a song there somewhere.
please be aware in kent uk where my family is from..
there is tremendous respect for the americans that came across
the pond in that conflict.
and mebe ..to keep on topic with this thread...
many of your countrymen showed amazeing bravery n excellence above and beyond
by a wide margin in that conflict.
my dad had nothing but praise for you folks.
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
Journeyman
|
|
Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716 |
It's very noticeable from the way the question was posed that the 'excellence' side of the coin is uppermost in the questioners mind. But what if we posed the question the other way round?; does the promotion of difference and excellence and the whole emphasis on individual achievement in the west create a problem for notions of equality? ....or to put it differently notions of a less punitive attitude to 'not having' or 'not having enough to get by'.?
To see the problem from that direction would assume that one might believe there is :
a) a limit to the benefits of individual achievement if that doesnt take place in a context where the other less well endowed members of society share in that benefit in one sense or another.
B) a clear sense that in our advanced capitalist economy we have reached a point where its all too likely that the egoism that comes with personal achievement has all but obliterated any sense of proportion in terms of rewards and also any sense of humility or responsibility to those who don't possess the necessary qualities of drive ambition talent etc to get ahead.
c) a clear sense that we may have created a self-righteous self-serving religious culture that blames those who can't achieve or adapt to society's demands for personal achievement on account of their supposed spiritual or moral shortcomings rather than do something to addresss the conditions of hopelessless fear and failure that come down heavily on anyone who falls behind. Does anyone think that some people aren't cut out for individualism and their 'inabilties' may only be apparent under conditions that compel them to think purely in those terms.?
d) that perhaps the reason we blame the non-achievers is to justify the excessive rewards that accrue to the successful and to make sure that wealth isn't more equally spread than it is now. The justification being that there must be no limit set on individual wealth in case the would-be achiever decides it isn't worth getting up in the morning to try in the first place. Why? is there no other motivation than personal advancement and making yourself as noticeably distinct and superior to others as you possibly can? is there no other motivation than wealth to the point of total invulnerability and total control over the political process in your own favour?
e) that there may be something wrong with the idea that you must motivate the poor with threats of having what little they have taken away on the grounds that it's good for their character and , while you must motivate the rich and the talented by heaping more and more adulation and rewards on to them, even if their success wasn't so much earned as merely the result of chance: of being in the right place at the right time. Or even built on the labour of others who were underpaid or unrecognized for their part in the achievement. The oppsoite is true in our culture; we dont recognize the true meaning of dependence and interdependence as a given.
I don't think there is anything like the kind of popular support for any redistribution of wealth and resources in the west even in the face of atrocious and unwarranted monopolies of same in the hands of the very few. it seems aas long as the dream of untold riches is alive any privation and degradation is seen as worth enduring for that to be made possible for just a few. Especially if you have a head start, help write the rule book and make sure other people do the suffering.
The idea that prevails in capitalism it seems is one that takes it as read that the best motivator of people is not that of a secure and nurturing social environment that one is grateful for having the basics of life guaranteed and where that gratitude inspires a desire to give back. Instead it's a sense that dependency and interdependency is to be feared and denied. That the constant fear of failure and the consequent abandonment and isolation and desperation that will bring is the best guarantor of ensuring that the individual contributes.
Regards
Alan
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
It's very noticeable from the way the question was posed that the 'excellence' side of the coin is uppermost in the questioners mind. But what if we posed the question the other way round?; does the promotion of difference and excellence and the whole emphasis on individual achievement in the west create a problem for notions of equality? ....or to put it differently notions of a less punitive attitude to 'not having' or 'not having enough to get by'.?
Alan
Alan,
you make quite a few very good points. Regarding this first one, I'd have to agree that the western world's infatuation with excellence leads to disdain for anything less.
In times past, cultures reinforced the value of "making do", and of learning contentment.
It is interesting to compare CONTENTMENT to SATISFACTION. Some see them as being the same, but they aren't at all.
Contentment means that your needs aren't fulfilled, but you are OK with that. It is the companion of patience.
Satisfaction means that your needs ARE met.
Both contentment and satisfaction squelch motivation. (if your hunger is satisfied you don't keep looking for food). But the difference is that satisfaction is temporary. You will be hungry again later, or sleepy again later or horny again later.
Contentment, on the other hand, is a decision. It doesn't have to go away, ever. But the world generally considers contentment to be a trait of unmotivated losers. Which raises the bar considerably for anyone who is trying to be "equal enough" to fit in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Quote:
d) that perhaps the reason we blame the non-achievers is to justify the excessive rewards that accrue to the successful and to make sure that wealth isn't more equally spread than it is now. The justification being that there must be no limit set on individual wealth in case the would-be achiever decides it isn't worth getting up in the morning to try in the first place. Why? is there no other motivation than personal advancement and making yourself as noticeably distinct and superior to others as you possibly can? is there no other motivation than wealth to the point of total invulnerability and total control over the political process in your own favour?
There are many different reasons why some people do not prosper. And I have rarely seen any criticism made toward people who are clearly at a disadvantage for reasons of health, age, intellect or othjer similar reason that cannot be easily changed.
When I see blame placed, it is nearly always on the able-bodied people who have everything they need to succeed, except they are not willing to work that hard. My son has several friends like that. They are young, strong, smart as a whip, persuasive... everything you could hope for to help you through life.. but they can collect enough money on welfare to "get by", and so they do.
If they had learned to be content with a bad situation, I would admire them. But they are learning to be incompetent, which is different. Why? Because their incompetence forces others who are also struggling, to pay for their lifestyle, however small it may be.
And there's more: They're also learning NOT TO BE CONTENT with the free money they already collect. So its the worst of both worlds. Lack of contentment and lack of productivity.
Perhaps I have taken your observation in a direction you did not intend.. but if you have a defense for people like I just described, I would be interested in hearing it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502 |
Quote:
c) a clear sense that we may have created a self-righteous self-serving religious culture that blames those who can't achieve or adapt to society's demands for personal achievement on account of their supposed spiritual or moral shortcomings rather than do something to addresss the conditions of hopelessless fear and failure that come down heavily on anyone who falls behind. Does anyone think that some people aren't cut out for individualism and their 'inabilties' may only be apparent under conditions that compel them to think purely in those terms.?
Please cite some actual examples of this, Alan.
--Mac
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!
If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums66
Topics81,577
Posts734,594
Members38,497
| |
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean