Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
Page 4 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Quote:

Quote:


c) a clear sense that we may have created a self-righteous self-serving religious culture that blames those who can't achieve or adapt to society's demands for personal achievement on account of their supposed spiritual or moral shortcomings rather than do something to addresss the conditions of hopelessless fear and failure that come down heavily on anyone who falls behind. Does anyone think that some people aren't cut out for individualism and their 'inabilties' may only be apparent under conditions that compel them to think purely in those terms.?





Please cite some actual examples of this, Alan.


--Mac




I can't speak for religious INSTITUTIONS, but the mind of Christ will never influence anyone to accumulate money and leave others destitute. many scriptures come to mind instantly:

Mark 8:36
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

1 Timothy 6:10
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Ephesians 4:28
Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.


James 1:27
Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.


but even in the spirit-filled time after pentecost, there were those who had a sense of entitlement, and Paul wrote this as his judgment:

2 Thessalonians 3:10
For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
The number of people as a percentage of all welfare claimants who choose to get by on meagre benefits in the UK is relatively small as the money isn't nearly enough to live on. Besides that there are strict rules about using the money to look for work which are enforced by successive cuts in money for non-compliance. The hardened 'can -work -wont- work ' cases are used to tar everyone else with the same brush no matter how different their situation/attitude is. The public perception of benefit cheats sponging off the working tax payer becomes a rallying cry of the right wing media here looking to stir up a scapegoat mentality for larger problems of structural unemployment and looking also to influence goverment cut backs in expenditure in favour of tax cuts.

What's missing is an honest appraisal of the totally depersonalising effects of long term unemployment on the majority of people who's self perception is such that they come to feel unworthy of even being considered for recruitment. They are not strong savvy and cynical, endlessly playing the system. They are scared depressed and pushed around by beaurocrats who treat them as scum, who fob them off with totally inadequate training courses and 'self-assertiveness ' programs that lead nowhere.

A recent TV documantary here put four big media personalities from rich backgrounds through a month long exposure to life on welfare and jobseeking in four differnt unemployment blackspots. Before embarking on their ordeal their attitude was one of haughty disapproval of the 'work shy' and people living it large on benefits. By the end of their four week trial they were reduced to quivering nervous wrecks even when they knew they could return to their old lives soon. They emerged with not just a greater respect for the unemployed but a heightened sense of their own dependence on their perosnal social networks for giving them strength and motivation, something the unemployed often lack.


There's always an agenda at work to produce a downward pressure on benefit claimants. The fear that dependency culture will take hold deflects from any meaningful discussion about the role of government in mitigating the brutal effects of capricious free markets, corporations looking to cut and run to the cheapest labour force in China.
No mention is made of the free hand-outs given to these corporations when they first located here. the rent- free premesis , the grants, the tax exemptions, the promises to get tough on worker rights and unions, the ability of companies to reneague on pension obligations by 'restructuring'. The entire edifice of company law is nothing short of a massive freeloading scam at the expense of the taxpayer and no one thinks to chide or rebuke this state of affairs.

Regards

Alan

Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
M
Mac Offline
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
M
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
That's not what I was after, Pat. Although, of course, I agree.

Alan S. is making the case that "we may have created a self-righteous self-serving religious culture that blames those who can't achieve or adapt to society's demands for personal achievement on account of their supposed spiritual or moral shortcomings" -- and I would like him to state some actual realworld examples of where he has witnessed such occurring.


--Mac

Off-Topic
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 22
Enthusiast
Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 22
How do you handle the following situation?

You are standing behind a person [note no description of said person] in line at the grocery store. "Person" is a dollar or so short of meeting the tab for their items. The items appear to be of subsistence nature (is that important? Yes, for the sake of this argument). You have a couple extra bucks or coins in your wallet.

Do you
(1) Avoid any involvement in the situation.
(2) Say, "Buddy, I got it." and fork over what s/he owes.
(3) Roll your eyes, consult your watch, and huff while the cashier backs out a couple items so that Person can afford the tab.
(4) Try to engage others in a political conversation about immigrants, socialism, deviants or wastrels of any ilk?

I bring up this situation in an attempt to humanize "excellence", "equality" and all that jazz.

In our day-to-day lives, we happen upon others who may have needs, temporary or otherwise. Sometimes we're in a position to help, because we have a few extra coins, and we know they are in need.

Can't we look at these bigger questions with a more local focus?

And by the way, I think this forum has handled this initial post beautifully, all in all.

Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Alan, I can relate to your example of the TV hosts going on welfare. It did affect my outlook and personal self-worth while I collected unemployment.
However it had the extreme effect of making me want to change it.
That is a point of character. There ARE a certain amount of people who are are complacent (not so much content) and will ride a free handout for the duration. This is also blatant not only in welfare, but also in disablility. We have all seen the guys who are collecting disability from a company where they can no longer perform their job function they had previously performed, but ARE capable of performing work. However the free money has turned into an entitlement.

Also, there is a disporportionate amount of wealth going to the upper levels of most large corporations. I DO think they intend to make workers dependant in certain instances (see WalMart).

Also remember, while a doctor's job is to save your life, which is an important job, the guy that is doing your brake job also has your life in his hands.


Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Quote:

That's not what I was after, Pat. Although, of course, I agree.

Alan S. is making the case that "we may have created a self-righteous self-serving religious culture that blames those who can't achieve or adapt to society's demands for personal achievement on account of their supposed spiritual or moral shortcomings" -- and I would like him to state some actual realworld examples of where he has witnessed such occurring.


--Mac





Gotcha. I'd like to see that too.

I realize that what I posted wasn't an answer to the question you had asked , but there was a corollary there that I wanted to capture because the theme of Christianity-as-villain seems to recur in all kinds of discussions. And the answer to that allegation is to show what Christianity DOES teach. If we make a distinction between what religious organizations do and what the bible teaches, the bible never ends up in the wrong.

Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Are we lumping welfare benefits and unemployment benefits into the same group? Because here in the USA they are not the same. Welfare has become a lifestyle for some. And even in some cases, unemployment benefits are abused.

I work in power generation. After the Enron scandal in 2002, the industry went belly up and I lost my job. A lot of my friends whose wives work made no effort to find a job until their benefits ran out. They could have worked, but they didn't want to. I remember hearing some of my friends' job search stories.. in which they sneered at the offer the employer made, and turned it down. THen they complaied about "oh how cruel this life is to me, that I can't find a job that pays what I'm worth "

The day after I was laid off, I had two jobs (granted, they were both really crummy jobs... jobs nobody else wanted.) I have often wondered whether it was stupid to do that.. to work to earn barely more money than I could have collected for nothing. But at least I got to keep my dignity. What price tag goes with dignity? Also in subsequent job interviews, that portion of my work history has always raised eyebrows. Employers say they don't see that very often. Hmmmm

My point is that desperation is relative. We are not usually talking about TOTAL lack of opportunity... we are talking about people who have options, but despise them. In so doing, they have chosen to be helpless rather than choosing to help themselves.

And THAT is where I divide the line between misfortune and missed opportunity

Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Quote:

Can't we look at these bigger questions with a more local focus?

And by the way, I think this forum has handled this initial post beautifully, all in all.




Hopefully that's exactly what the discussion will do. But the scenic route is always interesting...

;-)

Regarding forum participation: I agree. As internet forums go, this one is uncommonly civil, well-spoken, respectful, and full of well-considered discussion points. I haven't heard ANY points made yet that haven't crossed my own mind at one time or another.

Regarding your supermarket checkout line scenarion: I've acted out most of the options you mention at one time or another in my life, except for the one about starting a stage-whispered conversation about immigrants. Doing that seems like a bad idea to me on many levels.

Last edited by Pat Marr; 03/15/10 07:16 AM.
Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Quote:

The equality talked about in the Declaration of Independence is meant to be equality under the law. It does not make any statement about financial equality, or social equality, etc.
(posted by AxeGrinder01)




Very clarifying statement! Thanks for the participation!

Would you say that our system of government successfully provides equality under the law?

How do the various observations about welfare and unemployment benefit indiscretions fit what you're saying? Or do they?

Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
interesting link, regarding employment and the shape of things to come

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayolRcUXC8o&feature=related

Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,058
W
Expert
Offline
Expert
W
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,058
I read somewhere the brain is wired for symbolic recognition, such as the brain does not need to read "STOP" on a stop sign to instantly know to stop when in a vehicle.
Stereotypical responses may allow us to deal with a complex daily life that otherwise we could not cope with.
This also has a downside. Certain images evoke a automatic response that may condemn other, in our eyes that don't deserve the stigma we label them with.
Welfare, deadbeat, drug pusher, religion, rich, poor, and many more ; all evoke images of symbolic response but does the person symbolized deserve the label.
If we take the time to "see" the person or the institution , is the threat symbol real or imagined?
Do we turn away from need because of the fear we too, may touch "Failure" and contract the condition and use harsh criticisms to hide our fear of that contagion. Fear is real, the threat is either real or imagined.
No answers, just another POV.
Wyndham

Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Quote:


Very clarifying statement! Thanks for the participation!

Would you say that our system of government successfully provides equality under the law?






Read up on 'profiling'. Is it right or wrong?
Are they using statistics to be more efficient, or abusing it as an excuse?

Much discussion on this topic alone. Belonging to a 'profiled' group will definately affect your opinion, so try to look at it from outside, considering both sides. I happen to look a little darker than most in my area (probably due to some Native American in me) and have had situations I noticed. Example - I pumped gas at a station, then got into my Jeep and drove across the street to a big box store parking lot with lots of cars in it. An officer sitting in the gas station lot followed me over, and followed me down a few parling aisles until I parked, at which point I got out with my daughter (who is very white) and the officer then proceeded along and waved as he passed me, then took off toward the highway.
This officer was a state police and really didn't belong in the neighborhood (patrolled by city police) but he felt compelled to follow me.
Was I profiled?
Was it wrong?
This was at 10AM, so I doubt there was much suspicion of anything else! No 'suspected intoxication' or anything would make reasonable sense to me.
On the other hand I live in a very small city and the locals know every car and who it belongs too (pretty much). I have seen them drive past local people speeding to pull over a non-citizen of the city. This is obviously not 'equal', but nobody in town is complaining!

Just another couple points to ponder.


Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,687
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,687
As human beings, we are all born pretty much equal barring a rare anomaly either to the good or bad. There's plenty of cases of infants being placed with foster families with all sorts of different cultural and economic backgrounds and the kids wind up being integrated with that group. If the parents are Phd's so are the kids regardless of the fact they happened to be born in some third world hell hole. I believe the so called "nature vs nurture" argument is over. Nurture all the way. This is why virtually every political group in the world wants to control their education system. Equality under the law is the best we can hope for and our President is a good example of this. I don't agree with him politically but his is a very inspiring story personally.

Bob


Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
Couldn't agree more with that Bob, nurture over nature any time. When we're young we absorb so much from those around us without really trying as it were and it makes you think what would be possible if there wasn't such inequality in education and families ability to be supportive and enabling.

Which gets back to the original point made that somehow 'excellence' would somehow be diminished by greater equality brought about by redistribution of wealth. The theory being that the more you give people the less they want to achieve. I think it's far more complex than that. 'Excellence ' can come from almost anywhere at any time as raw talent often has a way of overcoming any adverse circumstances and there are many 'rags to riches' stories to prove that. What we should be thinking about is how to encourage not just excellence but a more dignified productive life for all where work is seen as a right, and promoted as rewarding in and of itself rather than tied to only to individual gain, the profit motive or otherwise seen as just a means to a wholly 'individual' end. It's this kind of instrumental rationality thats the problem where people know 'the price of everything but the value of nothing'.


Firstly inequality of wealth is so great now that any move towards some targeted redistribution would only benefit society as a whole. Giving people back greater local control over their own environments and communites, encouraging collaborative projects that involve everyone in the effort to rebuild the infrastructure of run down areas inspires a sense of pride and purpose in those that take part. As an example look at the efforts to rehabilitate drug criminals in Detroit by rebuilding the inner city areas left destitute by big corporations. It's a long term project and not enough of this happens when left to the 'free market'. That requires government programs based on higher taxes from those further up the social ladder. There is no other way to get it started. If you give money to private agencies to get things going they end up eating up the funds in profits and management fees.
Maybe then you will see the kind of self reliance and pride you hope for. Its not goiug to happen if you simply coerce people with therats of total annihilation financially; a 'stick' rather than ;'carrott' approach. That just breeds anxiety acts of desperation, crime, resentment towards authority and completely disregards human nature. It's the reason why USA society is unsafe and guns are 'needed'.


If that were the case then all those who inherit wealth from rich and privileged backgrounds would have equally no incentive to achieve and yet we know that people from such origins do achieve much more than they strictly 'need' to probably on account from being born in to families that not only have a greater aspirational ethic but also the ability to be truly encouraging rather than just demanding. We've all seen examples of well off families with overly high expectations of their children who go on to underachieve because of the harsh and judgemental attitude with which this ethic was imparted.


Which also takes me back to the point that Mac and Pat wanted me to expand on about how religion can often inadvertently be judgemental depending on the personal nature(s) of those who impart the message.
Coming from Scotland and dealing as a Psychologist with the fall out from the cultural warping caused by the residue of our Calvinst past I see many lives more blighted than they otherwise might be because the individual has thought that they are 'getting what they deserve' for being a 'bad' or 'undeserving' person. Rather than a spur to action these 'black and white' self-definitions perpetuate the problem of their lack of self worth. It works both ways. The individual tries to project that lack of worth on to the 'bad' environment/parent/society in an attempt to rid themselves of the feeling of worthlessness, to pass the buck as it were. They end up alternating between over-assertiveness and extreme crushing guilt and remorse that far outweighs any redemptive quality that may have otherwise possessed. In short the very picture of manic-depression. This is clearly the down side of such a pressured upbringing that emphasised the pitfalls as a way of getting pepole to achieve or conform.

Attending one of the many Pentesostal churches here I see the kind of appeals to guilt and the need for redemption couched in terms of Pauline theology. I see the 'prosperity gospel' being used to coerce people into believing that the corollary must be that our lack of prosperity must be down to our unfaithful unbelieving selves. I see pastor harping on about self-made wealthy Christian men being an example of spiritual superiority, partaking of God's 'richest blessings'. I see sermons that preach the idea that if you're not with God then you must be against Him. I see in short people being punched in the eye with one hand and offered a band aid with the other.

This of course stands in contrast to a more moderate form of Christianity which whilst i do not take literally in any sense, nevertheless have much sympathy with. It's good to see that many churches in the states have gone about their role as providers of welfare in a non-coercive way with due regard for separation of church and state. Many churches here are now adopting a similar role and as long as the focus is humanitarian rther than theological it can only be for the good.

Regards

Alan

Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Alan,

much as I would love to reply, this thread apparently does not conform to forum rules. Thanks to all who participated ! I enjoyed hearing everyone's keen personal insights and well-considered thoughts. It was fun while it lasted.

Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 484
R
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
R
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 484
Hi Pat,
I like your analogy of grass. I like to think that I set my mower to 3 inches. There may be some that gets cut and others that may not. My thought is I set the standard as to what height my mower will start to cut. My thought is these two words are not mutually exclusive terms. Excellence has no fear of equality. Instead, it is determined by who establishes the standard. With our children we have the authority to set the standard where we believe challenges them. Taking your point on the olympians. Their parents put a determination in them, whether positive or negative, that motivated that athlete to excellence. I am sure as they worked their way to the olympics they passed a lot of people that were content with the manadated standards of equality. Yet, it did not hinder their growth; only gave rise to it by making the playing field all the more advantageous for them to make it.

The end point of my logic is every generation in every society there has and will continue to be those who exceed and those who do not. You cannot mandate the human spirit. Even if government tries to suppress it by engineering mandated equality, it still cannot stop those who have greatness in them. It still is up to the individual to pursue it.

Thanks,
RickeG

Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 484
R
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
R
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 484
rharv,

you are right. It is the church, and families that God continues to use to sustain the society. Both may have been bludgeoned by media and the like. A brief departure from Pat's subject. I am in awe over just how my family in Christ where I attend have responded to crises. I started attending there back in 2005 just before Hurricane Katrina and have seen several like catastrophes since. Yet, this prayerfilled body gets up, many them of worldly wealth that are either retired or have more free time, put themselves in harms way to offer aid at the center of the ground zero point of the location. Everything from passing food and water to reconstruction projects building back the homes and businesses shattered by the event. Plus there were even a few doctors that shut down their practices for a couple of weeks to give of their talents.

God is at work. If it were not so, church and families would have ceased to exist.

Off-Topic
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
M
Expert
Offline
Expert
M
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
i feel compelled as a human being to comment bout certain topics in this thread.
(post is not addressed to anyone in particular.)
1. here in canada several hundred thousand manufacturing jobs have
been lost. ive talked to some of these people.
theyve worked hard all their lives and been "excellent"
and committed in their jobs. but thru no fault of their own they
have lost their jobs. and many are probably looking at welfare.
dont you think they deserve help when they need it ??
and have paid and paid all their lives ??
with their sweat and their taxes ??
why did canada loose so many manufacturing jobs ??
answer, cos our daft government has never implemented
a proper industrial strategy.
as i told my mp recently...
"no wonder you have a jobs problem..
everything is imported".
i perceive the USA and britain have the same problem.
2. lets talk about welfare for a moment.
the way some people talk , its like welfare folks receive a fortune.
it could be argued that certain european countries are quite generous.
but here in canada rates are paltry and hardly cover rent for example.
thus here in canada are lots of examples of homeless people.
a sorry state of affairs if you ask me in a supposedly advanced
country like canada. in the uk where i was born ..
there is a basic rule "everyone gets housing".
thus as i said in some ways europe is more generous in its social programs.
ive heard switzerland for example.
in summary nobody gets rich off welfare.
3. think on this...have you ever thought that some governments
purposely like high unemployment rates ??.
economists ive talked to have told me its to keep the
masses "malleable" and "undemanding".
govts are quite capable of creating low unemployment
rates ..IF THEY WISH TO. but some dont.

all i'm saying is..step back a bit before ragging on people
on welfare or the poor. cos there are many reasons why it might not be their fault.
(eg the manufacturing losses mentioned in point 1.)
the USA i'm reading about has had loads of job losses too.
(and britain also.)
ask any tecchie...and the answers as to why are simple...
britain, canada, and the USA have lots of what i would term
"old victorian style industry" plus currencies held too high
vis a vis some other currencies. all 3 countries need nothing less
than a top to bottom implementation strategically of what i might term
"future world beating industries". untill that happens the current
deplorable situation will continue.
for example the only jobs our crazy federal govt here in
canada can seem to create is low wage coffee shop jobs..
dotted across the country at 8 buks an hour.
none of the three countries mentioned seems to have a
strategy for building decent wage paying jobs.

frankly i'm just glad my wife n i are retired..
even tho the pensions arent rich.
just adequate.


retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 716
The defining narrative of the last 30 years is the way the world has been dominated by the free market ideology of of Milton Friedman and the 'Chicago School' of economics.

The loss of manufacturing and the move to financial and service 'industries' (for want of a better term) is the result and it reveals the hollow way of trying to generate wealth without adding very much to the real economy of a country. It's a rapacious and short sighted model with the idea of generating quick profits for shareholders or to fund mergers and empire building; hence the inexorable rise of the corporation.
To all the Americans here who deplore 'big government' I say this: your corporations are your government, pure and simple, as they are in all the supposed 'free' world. You do not have a democracy, you have a plutocracy as we do in the UK and most of the capitalist world. Accept that as the problem and you can begin to deal with it.

But lets address for one last time the idea first put forward, that redistribution of wealth harms or penalizes the strong, the different, the talented and the achievers and favours only the weak, the dependent and those who willfully do not contribute. (with the emphasis on the wilful non-contributors as if they defined the classification a whole and as if the deserving poor should have to lose out because of them).

I cant but see this idea as anything other than the social/philosophcal equivalent of the very sort of Darwinist 'survival of the fittest' imperative you as a Christian country would surely deny even exists let alone encourage. But there you are, perhaps in denying its existence in the natural order you inadvertently allow it greater hold over your subconcious than if you were to acknowledge that without due diligence it can account for much selfish human behaviour. I would say the proper place of religion is to act as such a tempering force with the full knowledge of our tendencies towards partisan 'group selection'.

The biologist Richard Dawkins , who is Darwins self-appointed 'enforcer' of course, has stated that ...'There is nothing in natural selection and Darwinism for any of us, only pain and suffering. We should not seek to build our socities on those principles'

If he can state that then think about what you're saying here in the context of your avowed Christian ethic. If Jesus were here now what would he say to the original hypothesis posed here? I think that just as he surprised the self-appointed guardians of the faith in his time, so he would rebuke those who thought this way in the strongest possible terms.

To which you'd perhaps reply ... 'but Jesus they are the lowest of the low, the least amongst us, the sinners, ..why do you bother with them......' or words to that effect.

And you know of course, or should do, what his next line would be.


Regards


Alan

Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
M
Mac Offline
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
M
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Funny thing, all of that -- and more -- is prophesied in the Gospel.

Alan, there certainly are those who stand in pulpits and pervert the Gospel of Christ. Thanks for clarifying how you were meaning what you said.

I do invite you to take the time to do some actual study of what is said in the bible itself, though, for I fear that you, like many others, make assumptions about that based on certain actions and statements by others.

Discover the true meaning behind the *grace* of Christ.

I know it was an unknown to myself at one time, for the church I grew up in did not preach the Gospel in entirety. So many fall victim to this. As it is written, and as it has come to pass.


--Mac

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To
Page 4 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!

The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!

There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.

If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.

We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!

Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.

Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed!

Video: Volume Automation in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created a video to help you learn more about the Volume Automation options in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows.

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Volume Automation

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#volume-automation

Video: Audio Input Monitoring with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created this short video to explain Audio Input Monitoring within Band-in-a-Box® 2024, and included some tips & troubleshooting details too!

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Audio Input Monitoring

3:17: Tips
5:10: Troubleshooting

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#audio-input-monitoring

Video: Enhanced Melodists in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®!

We've enhanced the Melodists feature included in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows!

Access the Melodist feature by pressing F7 in the program to open the new MultiPicker Library and locate the [Melodist] tab.

You can now generate a melody on any track in the program - very handy! Plus, you select how much of the melody you want generated - specify a range, or apply it to the whole track.

See the Melodist in action with our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2024: The Melodist Window.

Learn even more about the enhancements to the Melodist feature in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024upgrade/chapter3.htm#enhanced-melodist

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®

New with the DAW Plugin Version 6.0, released with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows: the Reaper® Panel!

This new panel offers built-in specific support for the Reaper® DAW API allowing direct transfer of Band-in-a-Box® files to/from Reaper® tracks!

When you run the Plugin from Reaper®, there is a panel to set the following options:
-BB Track(s) to send: This allows you to select the Plugin tracks that will be sent Reaper.
-Destination Reaper Track: This lets you select the destination Reaper track to receive media content from the Plugin.
-At Bar: You can select a bar in Reaper where the Plugin tracks should be placed.
-Start Below Selected Track: This allows you to place the Plugin tracks below the destination Reaper track.
-Overwrite Reaper Track: You can overwrite previous content on the destination Reaper track.
-Move to Project Folder: With this option, you can move the Plugin tracks to the Reaper project folder.
-Send Reaper Instructions Enable this option to send the Reaper Instructions instead of rendering audio tracks, which is faster.
-Render Audio & Instructions: Enable this option to generate audio files and the Reaper instructions.
-Send Tracks After Generating: This allows the Plugin to automatically send tracks to Reaper after generating.
-Send Audio for MIDI Track: Enable this option to send rendered audio for MIDI tracks.
-Send RealCharts with Audio: If this option is enabled, Enable this option to send RealCharts with audio.

Check out this video highlighting the new Reaper®-specific features: Band-in-a-Box® DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Video

The new Band-in-a-Box VST DAW Plugin Verion 6 adds over 20 new features!

Watch the new features video to learn more: Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2024 - DAW Plugin Version 6 New Features

We also list these new features at www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.plugin.htm.

Forum Statistics
Forums66
Topics81,390
Posts732,456
Members38,441
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
Newest Members
Ernest J, ingridguerci94, Izzy, BenChaz, Csofi
38,440 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 195
Al-David 124
DC Ron 113
dcuny 87
rsdean 83
Today's Birthdays
CeeDee, SethMould
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5