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#665958 - 07/27/21 05:55 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
Registered: 06/25/12
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JohnJohnJohn Offline
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Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.

Dan, if you get this figured out lemme know how you do it! I bought one of their loop packs about 6 years ago and could never really figure out how to use it. smile I installed it in Kontakt and I can play around with the loops but never really ever figured out how to use these in a song. There doesn't seem to be any real documentation on how to use them so I'd love some tips!

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#665966 - 07/27/21 06:48 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
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MusicStudent Offline
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Will do.

I actually am not looking to purchase more loop packages. I am sure if I look around my hard drives I will find loop collections which I already have. So I am hoping this will work with what I have. What caught my attention here was a statement that "...just insert loops and they fit themselves into your arrangement within the DAW. So I am hoping this is that missing tool I need to make loops work for me.
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#666017 - 07/28/21 11:33 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 08/20/11
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Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Momentum is a sampler that can be used instead of Kontakt. Plus, it is free.

Samples and loops have many different features. The biggest is some loops have embedded pitch, tempo and key signature meta data and some don't. Those that do typically identify as "Acidized Waves". You'll also find loops with features specific to a certain program like FL Studio, Halion, Rex and Reaktor.

Loops and samples that take advantage of all the features Momentum offers will be identified as KLI or Momentum compatible.

Big Fish has multiple free loop sampler packages available for download. You will find them +++ HERE +++. Free loops is a great way to practice and learn how to use.

Just like Kontakt has a free library, Momentum has 3.8 GB of available content to practice and learn on.

+++ THIS +++ webpage has Windows and Mac download links as well as tutorial videos to help get you started.
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#666018 - 07/28/21 11:41 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: 90 dB]
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Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Originally Posted By: 90 dB
So, the resolution to the points made in this thread is that after paying $569.00 for the program, one would need to purchase some loop libraries. grin This is if you want to have a "modern" sound. cool


No new players, no new styles. It's a disappointment.


Regards,

Bob



Not really. PG Music provides 2,000 loops with Band-in-a-Box so we know loops work inside Band-in-a-Box. Where do you go if you want more loops or a specific loop (cowbell anyone?). I suggested a source for loops.

I haven't seen any program advertised as the only music source you'll ever need. Of course there will be new styles. There are new styles every year. There are new RealTracks every year. What we don't know is who will be the musicians playing on the RealTracks.

Maybe PG Music should avoid controversy and revert back to the alias or pseudonym of "PG Artist" that performed many of the guitar and mandolin RealTracks.

I agree new artists creating new sounds would be nice. But I haven't heard much new music that I like so I'm like a child in a candy store; I know I want something different but I don't know what it is I want. I just know that when I hear it I'll like it and will be inspired.
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#666023 - 07/28/21 12:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 5134
Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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"Not really. PG Music provides 2,000 loops with Band-in-a-Box so we know loops work inside Band-in-a-Box. Where do you go if you want more loops or a specific loop (cowbell anyone?). I suggested a source for loops."


It's called "Band In A Box", not "Loops In a Box". grin


"I haven't seen any program advertised as the only music source you'll ever need."

When did I make that statement? Never, actually.


"What we don't know is who will be the musicians playing on the RealTracks."

Really? In my experience it will be the SAME OLD PLAYERS.


"Maybe PG Music should avoid controversy and revert back to the alias or pseudonym of "PG Artist" that performed many of the guitar and mandolin RealTracks."


'...avoid controversy...'? They named the artists to cash in on their notoriety in the first place. laugh


"I agree new artists creating new sounds would be nice."

Finally; something we agree on! I would edit your statement (since you have chosen to quote a statement I never made); I would say "new artists creating new sounds would be expected for my $569.00".


Regards,

Bob

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#666031 - 07/28/21 02:18 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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I am pretty happy with BIAB just like it is. I can think of many things I would like them to do.
I really like Brent Mason for country tracks. I think he is very over used on other styles and is certainly not my favorite blues player.

The price of a audiophile disk is pretty cheap for what it does, then again I don't have to consider refinancing my house to pay for it.

It's called BIAB not "live professional studio musicians will show up at your house and play for you.

The biggest complaint I have with BIAB is the difficulty in learning to use it.

Billy
_________________________
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#666032 - 07/28/21 02:32 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 04/20/10
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Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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"It's called BIAB not "live professional studio musicians will show up at your house and play for you."

Really? This is from the PG Home Page:


1. What is Band-in-a-Box?
Band-in-a-Box is an intelligent automatic accompaniment program. You can hear and play along to many song ideas and go from "nothing" to "something" in a very short period of time with Band-in-a-Box as your "on demand" backup band. Just type in the chords for any song using standard chord symbols (like C, Fm7 or C13b9), choose the style you'd like, and Band-in-a-Box does the rest. Band-in-a-Box automatically generates a complete professional quality arrangement of piano, bass, drums, guitar and strings in a wide variety of styles.


Seems to me that's exactly what the program is promising.


Regards,

Bob




Edited by 90 dB (07/28/21 02:32 PM)

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#666035 - 07/28/21 03:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666042 - 07/28/21 04:13 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Planobilly]
Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 5134
Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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Originally Posted By: Planobilly
Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy




Well, Billy,

As a customer, and a long-time proponent of BIAB, I think I've earned the right to comment. You may disagree....whatever.


"Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital."


I lived in LA for 15 years. In the music scene. You take a lot for granted.


Regards,


Bob

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#666067 - 07/28/21 06:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Planobilly]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 23450
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Offline
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Posts: 23450
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Originally Posted By: Planobilly
--- By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. ---
There's stock?
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#666083 - 07/28/21 09:31 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Originally Posted By: Planobilly
--- By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. ---
There's stock?


Sorry Matt, I misspelled that. I don't own any socks. I live in the tropics and find no need for them.

Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666086 - 07/28/21 10:39 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 2752
Loc: South Africa
JoanneCooper Online   content
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Loc: South Africa
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
Momentum is a sampler that can be used instead of Kontakt. Plus, it is free.

Samples and loops have many different features. The biggest is some loops have embedded pitch, tempo and key signature meta data and some don't. Those that do typically identify as "Acidized Waves". You'll also find loops with features specific to a certain program like FL Studio, Halion, Rex and Reaktor.

Loops and samples that take advantage of all the features Momentum offers will be identified as KLI or Momentum compatible.

Big Fish has multiple free loop sampler packages available for download. You will find them +++ HERE +++. Free loops is a great way to practice and learn how to use.

Just like Kontakt has a free library, Momentum has 3.8 GB of available content to practice and learn on.

+++ THIS +++ webpage has Windows and Mac download links as well as tutorial videos to help get you started.

Hi Jim
I’m keen to give this a go! I have only ever used percussion type loops where pitch is not important. How do these loops from big fish transpose to the right key?
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#666088 - 07/28/21 10:55 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: 90 dB]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Originally Posted By: 90 dB
Originally Posted By: Planobilly
Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy




Well, Billy,

As a customer, and a long-time proponent of BIAB, I think I've earned the right to comment. You may disagree....whatever.


"Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital."


I lived in LA for 15 years. In the music scene. You take a lot for granted.


Regards,


Bob


First you have the right to say anything you like. We agree on a lot of things, Brent Mason for one. I also lived in La for many years and worked in the music business for Universal Studios and played in my band there and in Europe.
If you lived, played, and recorded in LA you know exactly what the quality of things are there and how difficult it is to get what you want even in LA with plenty of money.
No software program is going to replace that.
That is not to say BIAB has no value because it dose.

I took the time to go to Band Camp and listen to a good bit of your songs. You have some pretty nice songs. Some sound like they were created in BIAB. That is not necessary a bad thing, it is also not pro studio.

I liked 100 Miles From Austin how ever it got put together. There are people here who do excellent work. Jane Floyd comes to mind but I can assure BIAB is not the only tool he uses.

Not everything has to come our of Abbey Road Studio in London to sound good.
I have a couple of really good songs that a very well professionally recorded using top session players in LA that no one seems to have a interest in except me and a few friends.
Thake a listen,

https://soundcloud.com/planobillydfw/three-long-years

There are no guitar players on BIAB that can play like Lewis.

Cheers,

Billy


Edited by Planobilly (07/28/21 11:13 PM)
_________________________
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"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666137 - 07/29/21 08:04 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 9255
Loc: Wauconda
MusicStudent Offline
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Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.


Downloaded and worked with this for about an hour this morning. Doesn't seem like it is for me, but I did not delete it. I will put a little more time in later to see if I can get over the learning curve of momentum. So far it don't sound musical to me.
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#666156 - 07/29/21 09:30 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
Registered: 11/01/09
Posts: 1131
Loc: Southeast USA
bloc-head Offline
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Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.


Downloaded and worked with this for about an hour this morning. Doesn't seem like it is for me, but I did not delete it. I will put a little more time in later to see if I can get over the learning curve of momentum. So far it don't sound musical to me.

I watched the "Momentum Trailer" and I thought it was lame at best... The background "music" sucked (IMHO). I recently purchased Komplete Kontrol, and am currently at the bottom of the learning curve.
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#666170 - 07/29/21 11:25 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 06/25/12
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JohnJohnJohn Offline
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I checked my download links for the loops I bought from them in 2015, and while they say these loops are compatible with Momentum, the links for those versions are grayed out. Dunno if I would have to buy them again to get them but I won't do that in any case.

I just don't understand what to do with them unless it is to simply build a track from scratch in my DAW by copy/pasting the slices. And if that's the case this seems like more work than I'd like unless I just really need something I can't get another way.

I wish they provided a step-by-step walkthrough of creating a track using their loops. Maybe Dan will do that? laugh

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#666177 - 07/29/21 12:22 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 05/16/17
Posts: 1663
beatmaster Offline
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Demo some of the loop packs they sound excellent tho pricey, but I guess you get what you pay for !
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https://beatmaster1.bandcamp.com/releases


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#666180 - 07/29/21 12:37 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 08/20/11
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Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Posts: 8590
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JohnJohnJohn,
Quote:
build a track from scratch in my DAW by copy/pasting the slices
That's exactly how song construction kits works.

Here are some notes from a song construction kit I purchased:
Quote:
301 Loops

30 bass loops (5 loops in 6 pitches)
36 brass loops (6 loops in 6 pitches)
10 drum kits with variations
36 guitar loops (6 loops in 6 pitches)
24 keys loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
24 pad loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
24 piano loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
18 Rhodes loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)
24 sequence loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
18 synth loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)
18 vocals loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)

[Tempo] BPM=90 [Harmony Table] Scale=C

Sample1=C
Sample2=d
Sample3=e
Sample4=F
Sample5=G
Sample6=a


The website page for this set includes two songs that demonstrate multiple ways these loops can be mixed together. I recorded the demo songs and placed the recordings in the construction kit folder so I can remember how the loops sound in context.

I've included some screen shots to illustrate my comments.

This construction kit was purchased from +++ Producer Planet +++. Producer Planet was Sony's original website to demonstrate and sell their Acidized loops and the site has a limited number of kits. +++ Big Fish Audio +++ also has construction kits.

Band-in-a-Box typically has one loop per track. There are ways around that limitation but one loop per track is the norm. That works well with percussion tracks. It also works well when you want a singular riff played in a section or throughout a song. Construction kits such as the one I've included screen shots from give you more instruments to use in your songs


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Jim Fogle - 2022 BiaB (922) RB (Build 4) Ultra+ PAK
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Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 21H2, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#666182 - 07/29/21 01:02 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 05/16/17
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beatmaster Offline
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Getting the hang of the loops, well that helps Jim A picture paints a thousand words, How would you know the Construction kits from normal loops ?.

Im trying to get as much info for a buy a loops pack at 129.00 so the more the merrier !! (info).
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https://beatmaster1.bandcamp.com/releases


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#666184 - 07/29/21 01:08 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 04/07/13
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Charlie Fogle Offline
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<< I wish they provided a step-by-step walkthrough of creating a track using their loops. Maybe Dan will do that? >>

Also, Forum member, Mr. Henry Clarke, has put out two tutorials, one using BIAB specifically and one using a DAW.

Country Song from Samples

and

How to use use BIAB Loops to create an infectious Disco Beat Tutorial" Henry Clarke
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PG Music News
Holiday Hours - Monday, May 23, 2022

We are celebrating Victoria Day on Monday, May 23th! Our hours this weekend are:

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Regular Hours resume Tuesday, May 24th.
www.pgmusic.com/contact.htm

Fun with Band-in-a-Box® - A Reunion Event: "Life Is Hard"

Getting together and playing music and writing songs is a wonderful way to spend some free time!

Recently, a few of our Forum members did just that... and they made a video to prove it!

Check out what Charlie Fogle, Eddie, Herb, Pat Marr, David Snyder got up to - and how they did it: Fun with Band-in-a-Box® - A Reunion Event: "Life Is Hard"

...hopefully it inspires you to keep the fun in making music!

How to: Replace a RealTrack with a MIDI Track in Band-in-a-Box®

Starting with a RealStyle in Band-in-a-Box®, and want to make one of your tracks a MIDI track? See how this is done using the MIDI Track Picker dialog with our video How to Replace a RealTrack with a MIDI Track in Band-in-a-Box®.

Want to see a quick video tutorial that's not on our Tips & Tricks list? You can post your request to our I want a video that shows me how to .... forum.

Band-in-a-Box® Tuba RealTracks

Today (May 6) is International Tuba Day!

Celebrate your love for the Tuba today - add one of our Tuba RealTracks (available in Sets 143, 162, and 248) played by either Brad Muirhead or Philip Santner.

Already have a Band-in-a-Box® song with a Tuba? Share it here!

How to: Search for RealTracks in Band-in-a-Box®

Looking for a specific RealTrack for your song? See how easy it is to search by keyword or file name when you watch our latest video, How to Search for RealTracks in Band-in-a-Box®.

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Update Your Band-in-a-Box® 2022 for Windows Today!

Using Band-in-a-Box 2022 for Windows? Great news! We've released a free update that enhances many of the MIDI features and Drum Stems tracks, updates the program manual and documentation, and resolves a few user reported issues.

This free update includes additional enhancements to the DAW Plugin, and updates it to version 4.5.33.

Make sure you download this free update today!

Learn more...

How to: Capturing and Adding a Screenshot to the PG Music Forums

The PG Music Forums is packed with an incredibly active community, always happy to discuss and share Band-in-a-Box tips, help with any questions other users have, and of course share their songs!

Want to know how to add a screenshot to your forum post? Follow the steps in our helpful video tutorial.

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