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#672442 - 09/10/21 04:57 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] problem with guitar user track
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
I followed the instructions to create a user track. When I modify a .sgu file to user the track, it usually works fine. But, some of the time, the user track doesn't start to play for a couple of measures. ????? The MIDI instruments play, then the user track comes in later.
I am running BIAB 2019 on a 2017 iMac running macOS 11.5.2 (Big Sur).
Thanks,
Alan Shank

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#672451 - 09/10/21 05:29 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7648
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Are you accounting that the first two bars of the audio for the UserTrack should remain blank? The blank two bars allow for the two bar count-in. While the chord sheet and the other tracks start with bar 1 the audio for the Usertrack begins with the two bars of blank before bar 1.
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#672461 - 09/10/21 06:19 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 02/05/15
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Pipeline Offline
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Yes what Jim said about 2 bars.
It might be easier doing it in a DAW.
Make sure you have the Ending bars set in the F5 > UserTracks Development settings.
This script will load a UserTrack template SGU into Reaper
Right click Save Link/Target As then Load script into Reaper
ReaTrak Biab SGU MGU.. to regions.lua


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#672595 - 09/11/21 05:56 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
I created this user track in Logic X. I rendered the User Track template .SGU into .wav files and imported them into audio tracks in Logic X. We added an audio track, and our guitar player played along with the other tracks. The drums played the - - ---- 2-bar lead-in and he started playing, in sync with the other tracks. Then we exported the guitar track into a .wav file and put it in the user track folder. I was able to modify other .sgu files to use the user track instead of the MIDI guitar.

It works fine in some .SGU files, but not in others. That is what is so weird.

Any idea what could cause that?
Thanks,
Alan Shank

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#672635 - 09/12/21 05:39 AM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6453
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Loc: South Carolina
<< It works fine in some .SGU files, but not in others. That is what is so weird. Any idea what could cause that? >>
Timing and playing pattern immediately come to mind. User Tracks are just as prone to clash with some styles and not play to a style's groove as normal RealTracks are. BIAB provides hundreds of guitar RealTracks and users constantly struggle to find one to play in their project correctly.

Two things with your User Track process I don't fully follow are:

1. Why you choose to render the individual User Track Template instruments and export them into the DAW rather than a single stereo mix?

2. Why you're using live drums rather than select a BIAB style drums?

Charlie
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#672704 - 09/12/21 01:08 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: Charlie Fogle]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Originally Posted By: Charlie Fogle
<< It works fine in some .SGU files, but not in others. That is what is so weird. Any idea what could cause that? >>
Timing and playing pattern immediately come to mind. User Tracks are just as prone to clash with some styles and not play to a style's groove as normal RealTracks are. BIAB provides hundreds of guitar RealTracks and users constantly struggle to find one to play in their project correctly.


All the songs I have tried it with use the same style.

Originally Posted By: Charlie Fogle

Two things with your User Track process I don't fully follow are:

1. Why you choose to render the individual User Track Template instruments and export them into the DAW rather than a single stereo mix?


I didn't want the MIDI guitar to be heard while the guy was recording the live guitar.

Originally Posted By: Charlie Fogle

2. Why you're using live drums rather than select a BIAB style drums?


I'm not using any drums. When I rendered the .sgu, the drums were muted; that way, only the - - ---- counting is imported into Logic X.

Thanks for your reply, Charlie.
Alan

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#672715 - 09/12/21 03:26 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6453
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Registered: 04/07/13
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Loc: South Carolina
Thanks for your quick reply. I'm always curious to the various workflows and how people approach using BIAB tracks with their DAW.

Regarding that all of the various SGU files react to your User Track differently although they all are the same style, that's a bit of mystery. RealTracks will sound different and play differently to different chord charts as well as different styles and it may be that User Tracks are the same.

The best idea I can give is to examine whatever differences are between the various SGU files may be. If your User Track sometimes works in an SGU and then again it doesn't, that's an issue that should not be occurring and it's best to discuss with PG Staff.

And I'm sure you know you can mute the midi guitar just as did the drums and not have to get rid of the midi guitar by exporting the tracks individually.

Thanks again for posting about your process. It's interesting to learn new processes.

Charlie
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#672719 - 09/12/21 03:37 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Pipeline Offline
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Registered: 02/05/15
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Can you upload the UserTrack (.SGU .wav) then we can try and work out what's wrong.
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#673009 - 09/14/21 01:06 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Here's more weirdness! If the user track is delayed in a particular .SGU, if I close BIAB and re-open it, it sometimes will work. I've also noticed another weirdness: in one of my .SGUs, the user track will be going along OK, then will stop for a measure, then resume playing.
Thanks,
Alan

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#673010 - 09/14/21 01:12 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: Pipeline]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Can you upload the UserTrack (.SGU .wav) then we can try and work out what's wrong.


How do I do that?

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#673012 - 09/14/21 01:16 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Originally Posted By: goatcabin
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Can you upload the UserTrack (.SGU .wav) then we can try and work out what's wrong.


How do I do that?


I asked "Chat" and she said to e-mail to support@PGmusic.com, which I've just done.
Thanks,
Alan Shank

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#673014 - 09/14/21 01:29 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
More info. Today I started BIAB, loaded my.DK file and a .SGU file. Yesterday, I loaded that file after some others, and the user track not only didn't start "on time", but also dropped out here and there for a measure. Today, with a "fresh" BIAB, it worked perfectly, starting along with the realTrack bass and continuing.

Cheers,
Alan

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#673018 - 09/14/21 02:12 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Pipeline Offline
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Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Originally Posted By: goatcabin
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Can you upload the UserTrack (.SGU .wav) then we can try and work out what's wrong.


How do I do that?

You can use a free www.DropBox.com account, upload the zipped UserTrack folder then post the link here.
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#673021 - 09/14/21 02:17 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Here's another question about this process. In BIAB 2019 for Mac, you can't record your user track in BIAB itself; only the Windows version allows this. (It seems the Mac version is somewhat "behind" the Windows version. The 2019 doesn't have the Style Maker option, either.

Question: does the Mac version 2021 allow recording in BIAB?

BTW, the reason I'm even doing this is that the RealTrack bluegrass guitar does not sound like Bluegrass; it's just strumming. Bluegrass rhythm guitar is played bass-strum, bass-strum, alternating root,fifth bass with a back-and-forth strum, sometimes connecting chords with walkups, walkdowns, an occasion "Flatt" run, etc. You can hear that on the .wav file I sent.
Cheers,
Alan

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#673025 - 09/14/21 02:42 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Pipeline Offline
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Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Originally Posted By: goatcabin
...You can hear that on the .wav file I sent.
Cheers,..

Didn't get that wav that's why I gave you the www.DropBox.com link.
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#673026 - 09/14/21 02:56 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
I sent them in an e-mail to support@pgmusic.com, as "Chat" asked. Then I got an e-mail asking for the URL for the forum topic, and I sent that. That was before I saw your post with the DropBox link.
Thanks,
Alan

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#673053 - 09/14/21 06:00 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6453
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6453
Loc: South Carolina
<< In BIAB 2019 for Mac, you can't record your user track in BIAB itself; only the Windows version allows this. >>

Your 2019 Mac BIAB version should be able to record UserTracks. Mac BIAB has had audio recording capability since version 2015. I've attached a screen shot of the Mac 2019 Toolbar with the Record Audio Icon.


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#673166 - Yesterday at 01:07 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: Charlie Fogle]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
Originally Posted By: Charlie Fogle
<< In BIAB 2019 for Mac, you can't record your user track in BIAB itself; only the Windows version allows this. >>

Your 2019 Mac BIAB version should be able to record UserTracks. Mac BIAB has had audio recording capability since version 2015. I've attached a screen shot of the Mac 2019 Toolbar with the Record Audio Icon.


I tried that over and over. The input level on the Mac sound settings reacted to input, but inside BIAB -- NOTHING. The VU meter inside BIAB did not register anything, and when I tried to record, I got a file with no sound.

I don't think your picture of BIAB is even the Mac version; on my 2019 BIAB-for-Mac, you have to click the Audio tab and select "record audio".

Not only that, but the instruction that come with BIAB specifically state:

"2. Play and record your instrument. For Windows, you can record right in Band-in-a-Box on the audio track by pressing the "Record Audio" button (if you're using RealBand, you can record your audio on any unused audio track). You can also use any other DAW by dragging the backing tracks into the other DAW, and you can then do your recording there. For Mac, this is the only option, so for example you could drag the individual backing tracks into Garageband. "

Thanks,
Alan Shank

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#673167 - Yesterday at 01:19 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: Pipeline]
Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
goatcabin Offline
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Registered: 09/10/21
Posts: 11
I got an e-mail from support@pgmusic.com saying they were unable to get the files to Pipeline. So, here is a link to the zipped folder in DropBox:

https://www.dropbox.com/preview/Al%20Guitar%20user%20track.zip?context=browse&role=personal

Thanks,
Alan

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#673171 - Yesterday at 01:49 PM [UserTracks (and other add-ons)] Re: problem with guitar user track [Re: goatcabin]
Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
Pipeline Offline
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Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 6649
In your dropbox click Share > Create Link > Copy Link
then paste that link in the post.
You can Edit your previous post to the new link.

A 0 on the end will take the link to the dropbox site
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wx83pccx098efcr/Acidizer.zip?dl=0

If you put a 1 on the end it will download direct from here
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wx83pccx098efcr/Acidizer.zip?dl=1


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