|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867 |
Let's talk complex chords.
Today I encountered a song, Renata Maria. It was written by Ivan Lins, whom I consider Brazil's greatest living composer, and it has chords I could not enter as-is into BIAB. In some cases, I found a substitute, but others are just not supported. So this is a "would be nice to have" list.
Chord in the song leadsheet: Am(b6)
Chord I typed into BIAB: Am#5
Result: just fine; enharmonically the same, and I was surprised BIAB supported this
Chord in the song leadsheet: BmMaj9
Chord I typed into BIAB: BmMaj7
Result: OK, not quite right but plays the important notes (minor third & major seven); it would be nice to support mMaj9
Chord in the song leadsheet: Em9(b6)
Chord I typed into BIAB: not possible; I gave up and typed Em9, but I could have used Em#5 or Em7#5
Result: I think no combination of b6 or #5 or b13 will work in BIAB with a minor nine chord. You have to decide which is more important: the nine or the sharp five.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,355
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,355 |
Certainly it would be a great improvement if all known chords were supported.
Definitely +1
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,814
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,814 |
Certainly it would be a great improvement if all known chords were supported.
Definitely +1
Yes +1
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 913
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 913 |
In my estimation, it is difficult to support all known/possible/thinkable chords in Band in a Box - this would fail due to the concept of RealTracks. For this, real musicians would have to play all chords and even more so chord changes in advance – what would be countless. This would simply not make sense - even if a clever program logic would find chord substitutions. The second problem: Band in a Box still uses (at least currently and to be backward compatible with older song files) a character addressing with an address space for a maximum of 256 displayable combinations of a chord letter plus extensions. This space is already pretty much exhausted.
Biab/RB latest build, German Language Pak, Win 10/64 Pro, 1 TB SSD, 32 GB RAM. Notation SW Finale, StaffPad, SmartsScore – Playing Double Bass, Guitar, Piano
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,355
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,355 |
I previously wasn't aware of the second problem that you mentioned, but this can easily be worked around. If the version is less than 'x' then use the 256 algorithm. If it is >= 'x' then treat it as having a broader range capability.
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867 |
Thanks, everyone.
I fully realize this discussion appears to affect very few, but I think it has some broader implications.
I posted in the User Tracks Forum a few years ago, asking for a template with the more complex chords I need for my Brazilian jazz compositions. The question was never answered.
BIAB should be able to be programmed to play in MIDI any chord imaginable. The problem arises with RealTracks, as Brille mentioned.
Of course, even with MIDI, some common chords are supported only by equivalencies. For example, an add2 and add9 are treated as a 2 chord. This is not right, but it gets by.
In the case of the chords I mentioned, I could create shortcuts for the first two, so at least I could type them and get something reasonable. The third example, though, just doesn’t give me a workable solution.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,129
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,129 |
+1
If complex chords were supported in MIDI that would be a start at least.
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 738
Journeyman
|
|
Journeyman
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 738 |
I agree with Brille, this could be infinite for a "Real" guitarist.
On a piano just about any chord can be laid out nice and pretty, as long as it has less than 11 notes in it.
One can often push a variety of inversions of the chord without making fingering difficult.
The piano can be wonderful in that way.
Chords on the guitar seem an exercise in compromise, especially more complex chords.
Aside from certain musical genres, 6 notes are rarely played when voicing complex chords.
I believe most Guitarist rely on 3 or 4 note chords when comping. Sometimes 5 and sometimes 2.
Example: Consider a b9b13 chord, you need 1,3,5,b7,b9,b13 (i believe) to construct on a piano.
It may be physically impossible for most (any) players to play that in root position on a guitar. I don't know.
I'm guessing it would sound like mud if you could play it.
So which ones do you leave out on a guitar. Typically the 5th goes first, then probably the 1.
So you end up with a playable 4 note chord of 3,b7,b9,b13.
It may sound great played that way or you may have to move it around (invert)to make it playable
Add the 1 if you like (or can) for 5 notes. A lot of guitar players might just leave it out.
Likewise the b7 may disappear and be replaced by the 1 in the 4 note construction.
Put the b9 in the bass? Sure, if it sounds ok.
Imagine all the enharmonic names for those little gems.
How would you ask for them in BIAB?
I could go on an on. The more I think about it (melody, bass lines, voice leading, cadences,next chords,other comping players in the band) the more I realize the requirements and solutions on the guitar are large, possibly infinite.
Back to the shed. I need to work on my comping skills
biab2023(Mac)
Logic Pro X
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867
Veteran
|
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,867 |
Yes, I was taught much the same by Romero Lubambo when he played on my record. It’s challenging to decide which notes to play. He definitely had fun playing my compositions.
But when you write a complex chord in BIAB and both a guitar and piano track are present, the program should (at least in MIDI) be able to sound every chord tone (except the root, if there is also a bass track).
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,610
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,610 |
Cheers, Mike My Music * Asus ROG Strix G15CF 32 GB DDR4 4TB HDD + 1 TB SSD NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 8GB Win 11 AKAI EIE PRO Sound Interface. BIAB/RB 2024 UltraPak Build - Latest
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
|
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 299
Apprentice
|
|
Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 299 |
+1
Sure thing.
The Jjazzlab guy “solved” the problem by using the Cm11 chord as a base for the midi and has underlying scales. That means you would not need hundreds of chords, only about 20, be it with different chord tones as specified by the way you notate the chord (Amb6 or Am9b6).
There’s only the major scales (7 chords), melodic minor (7 chords), harmonic minor (7 chords), diminished, wholetone and augmented.
With those 6 scales and their modes you can play anything from Ellington to Dewey Redman… and back.
If you listen to how Jjazzlab works, really sounds good, even with complex harmony. Lydian, phrygian and sus13b9 (II-chord from melodic minor)? No prob.
Biab should step up their game, definitely, to accomodate complex harmony.
Biab, Kontakt, Sampletank and lots of nice libraries, from Fluffy audio to Abbey Road drums. Check out these great contemporary Jazz Styles: www.jazzstylezz.com
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!
If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums66
Topics81,620
Posts735,175
Members38,517
| |
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean