PG Music Home Forums PG Music Product Forums Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh UltraPAK installation question [Resolved]

I bought the Ultrapak upgrade. I have BIAB 2021 installed on my main drive, and I am downloading and installing Ultrapack upgrade on an external SSD drive.

The installer indicates: ''The installer is downloading and installing 'Band in a box 2024 Full. This is the main installer'.

Does that means that I'll be able to delete the other installation on the other drive? or do I have to keep both?

there we go with the dumb stuff already.....first it said I need 435 gb of space, so I made more than that, and after 25 minutes of downloading and failing to install, now it says there's not enough space. The only reason I bought it is because of the 30 days warranty....I won't have much patience with the nonsense

I always install a new update over the older program on the same drive, this keeps all content like styles and realtracks in the proper folders. If you purchased the new version on an external drive, you could run it there with a minimal install. If you purchased a download only then you need to install of course.

As i said in the other thread BiaB is a deep and rich program it is not easy to learn Sure to do the very simplest functions it is not too bad, but it takes a lot of time and effort to learn it. As far as downloads go i have not had a lot of success with the download manager especially on my Mac. So, i download it carefully. one reason for installing to the same folder is there are Gigabites if content that you may already have from previous years, Styles and RTs so a new install either ignores them or overwrites them (not sure which) So now you are installing them again in a new place, so it takes more space.

Bottom line is this program is a powerful and capable tool, but it does take patience to use and learn. I have only seen a few of your posts so far but they all seem frustrated and angry. That is not going to help you learn to use this program. Friendly respectful post will get you a ton of help. There are users here with decades of experience and are willing to help you get things sorted out. Tap into this and we hope you get stuff sorted out.

''I always install a new update over the older program on the same drive''.

What's new? If I had enough space there, I would have done the same, hence the question. Further, the user is given the option to install anywhere, and it's an upgrade, so I don't see any problems, but if PG Music has a problem with any of that, they should make us aware of this: I don't read minds.

''BiaB is a deep and rich program''.

In my experience, about as rich as a beggar, and as deep as a donkey.

''Sure to do the very simplest functions it is not too bad''.

Your argument seems to attribute my issues with the program, with my lack of knowledge about it: 'if it doesn't work for you, it's because you don't know the more advanced functions'. It's ironic that you seem to indicate that simpler things should work less well than less simple ones.But if the task is simpler, the program should carry it out more successfully, not less. And for simplest functions, no advanced knowledge is required, otherwise the functions would not be simple.

Or else, you indicate that I must be somewhat retarded and that I just start the program, click 'play' and think 'Ok BIAB, now you go'. For your information, I have been a musician on more than one instrument, for close to 30 years, and I am pretty happy with my musical skills. So I am probably not that retarded.

The only reason why I bought the Ultrapak is to test the program and the multistyles, hoping that the never ending bugs have been fixed. Years ago I was running it on that pig's house called Windows, now I use only Macs, and it's better (as anything else I use, is better on the Mac), but even on a Mac, it still does stupid things.

A great program, but only in theory. It has a million features, but very few work without problems. This has been true for me for over a decade. Currently I have 2021, so once again, I am hopeful that the new versions will work well, but I am not holding my breath.

BIAB is a great work, I said this other times. But it's buggy. It might work for some people, but it doesn't for me. If you want to punch in a few chords and leave it as that, and not do a lot more, it should work.

But that's not what I do. I could give dozens of examples, but who has the time.

But I commend PG Music's for the excellent warranty. Can't really fault it. This is why I am giving it a try again, otherwise I would not part with the cash that easily. I am thrifty. As an old Japanese proverb says: 'Earning money is difficult, and spending them is easy.'. (I am not Japanese)

So for anyone reading my rants, as I have said other times: try it for yourself, it might work and do what you need to do with it. Buy it directly, you have a great warranty there, so no problem, PG Music is a credible company. If you don't like the program, you are covered, and if you like it, then keep it.

I kept the 2021 basic version because I had older projects and ideas started on old Biab versions. I am not a newcomer, though I never cared to be a 'BIAB expert'. To me it's a tool, I am not wed to any computer programs, I try to use what works so that my real objective is carried out, which is to create and record music. You don't have to know everything about a program to do what you need to do.

In Biab's defense, I also shoot down most other computer programs, such as those made by Steinberg, and many others. Most of them suck. Let's face it, computers never took over real musical instruments.

Anyways, I guess the answer to my question was: 'I don't know'. I'll just email support instead of writing lengthy monologues here.

so after I've read your piece of wisdom about installing all on same drive, I decided to uninstall BIAB 2021 and to install it on the same external drive where I'll install, anew, the upgrade. Good idea, right? No it isn't: DIAB (Devil in a Box) now says that the realtracks pro 2. or whatever they are called, can ONLY be installed on the drive where MacOs is running. That's why realtrack pro 1 was stuck, in true DIAB fashion, so I had to force quit.

With the result that this was all a big waste of time, since I am none the wiser. Fortunately I have a backup on another external SSD drive, so I can just plug in and have the old DIAB working, at least, along with all else.

''Deep and rich'', uh?

Hi - if you're having trouble, please ask your question. I don't completely understand what you are asking.

If you are download and installing a full UltraPAK - absolutely that is a huge install. You can install that either on an internal drive or external drive - either way will work. If you are using the Install Manager, you can choose your install location under the "Select Destination" drop-down menu. You also need to pay attention to where the installer packages are downloaded to, which is on the left side (Download folder). That can be an internal or external location as well. There is a tutorial and FAQ section here:
https://www.pgmusic.com/download-manager-mac-help.htm

If you are installing an individual package and it says you need to install it on the macOS system, that is an Apple installer.app issue, and it should be resolved by simply running the package again, only running one installer package at a time,or if that doesn't fix it you might need to reboot. You should be able to select any volume.

How about just reading and trying to understand the install instructions?????
Btw, the install manager works faultlessly if you are just a little bit computer savy.

Sorry, the issue is not patience and, frankly, most of us are not concerned with how much or how little you have.

Is your external an HDD (mechanical hard drive)? If so, erasing and overwriting data is pretty straightforward but if you do not have at least 10% more space than you need (recommendation is 15%), there will be problems. The OS must have overhead to work. If an HDD, ignore the rest of this post

If, however, your external is an SSD (solid state drives). then the problem is that you do not understand how they work. It is not at all like an HDD where erasing clears a directory and the blocks are overwritten by new data.

In an SSD, when a file is erased. TRIM (in the OS for Mac/Win/Linux) and GarbageCollection (contained in the drive's firmware) must prepare the cells to accept new data. This can take anywhere from ten minutes to 72 hours depending on how much drive space must be prepared. After you erase data, you can run GetInfo on your drive and under the amount of space you will see something like (XX.XX GB purgeable) — this is space that you will not become available until after TRIM/GarbageCollection have done their thing.

This process is even slower depending on how an external drive connected and what type of enclosure contains the drive. On a Mac, TRIM does not work over USB 2–3 or Ethernet — Period. In this case, you have the GarbageCollection Utility only to do this work.

The SSD must be connected by eSATA, Thunderbolt, PCIe over Thunderbolt 3/4 or USB 4 for TRIM to be enabled.

If an NVMe 3 x4 (blade) connected by PCIe over Thunderbolt 3/4 or USB 4, TRIM is enabled automatically — nothing more to do.

If, however, your SSD is a 2.5" form and it is connected via eSATA or Thunderbolt, then TRIM must be enabled manually with the following Terminal Command:

sudo trimforce enable <return> or <enter> key. You will then enter your Admin password before you are presented with some yes/no questions — Yes, you want to do this; No, you do not want to stop the process. TRIM is already part of the macOS, you are just giving it permission to run on 2.5" drives (no Mac ever had these installed by Apple).

When done, you will be able to verify this in your System Report — About this Mac. Navigate to the bus containing the drive to find TRIM - Yes. Often, after an OS update, you will need to do this again.

As Andrew said ask a legitimate question. I have used the program for almost 2 decades and have been recording on hard disk for better than 25 years. BiaB is not perfect but if you put in the effort to learn it and to always get help when stumped it works well. I have completed many projects. The user showcase forum there are thousands of songs created in at least in part if not completely in BiaB. There are professionals in recording, teaching, Live music that use this every day. Some use it to create for live orchestras and bands. They did not get to that point by throwing up their hands and slamming the program. They rolled up their sleeves and got to work. You can find fault in every piece of software out there. Not one is perfect, and all have bugs. I have found bugs in this program, but i will say most of the time i did not dig deep enough to find the answer. Most often it was pilot error. Many times, a simple detailed question and other users gave some good advice or help.

After reading your post again i am beginning to see the issue, you simple don't have the patience to do this stuff. Everything is someone else's fault! Windows is a pig's house, really! come on i have both Windows and Mac BiaB both run flawlessly I have been running on both platforms for 4 years and windows since 2003 from window xt to 11 they have always run flawlessly. You said may work for others but not you! Hhmm well you might be on to something. Maybe the issue is you or your equipment. It speaks to the common denominator theory. Look you may be a smart guy, but this stuff is not easy to master. it takes hard work. I would suggest dialing it back a notch and maybe some of us might be willing to help. Remember you have to meet folks halfway.

I am sure you can come along after me and pick my words to pieces and try to prove your point, but it would make more sense to use that time to type a well detailed post about exactly what you need to know or what is not working to make sure you get better results. Or you can complain and whine some more and accomplish nothing. Your choice! Without giving details and allowing knowledgeable people to help it just seems like you do not know what you are doing. Yeah, at this point you try to tell me how much you know and i don't get it, but believe me this in not my first rodeo, and i know when people have issues with the very basic of problems like a download or a simple task, one of two things is at play. Either they don't know what they are doing and are embarrassed to say so or they are not willing to put any effort into it.

I don't have time for this anymore. After trying this and that, I managed to install the whole ultrapak through the night. A couple of hours into testing to see what it can do for me. I see it is as buggy as ever. It crashed once, that is nothing new. Then the multistyle I used started to superimpose sounds.

I was hoping that at least with the Multistyles I could build a drum track quickly because of all the variations. I can't do it with this program, it's not reliable. I have EZ Drummer 3 which takes a little work, but works extremely well. I'll keep using that.

Let alone hoping to create keyboard tracks quickly.... the voice leading problems are too noticeable to ignore. I can play bass and keyboards myself well, and more, but since I have a lot of tracks to record, I was hoping I could get Band in a Box to help with some of the material. Nah, forget it. It's all failed expectations for me.

I want to get stuff done. I have no use for BB. I'll have to unfortunately get my money back and uninstall the new version. I'll probably sell the old one too, which is boxed. I am getting too old to waste my time with stuff that doesn't really work for me.

No bad feelings toward PG Music, though. And to other customers, as I always say, try it for yourself, you get an excellent warranty if you buy directly, and if you don't like the program, you lose nothing other than a bit of time, and if you like it, you keep it. It might be useful to you for some things or others. To me it's not, unfortunately, but we aren't all the same.

one last thing I'd say to others: if you have the patience, it might be that BB will be of use to you. If you get a problem you can always email support or write in these forums. I am not a patient person, but this needs not necessarily be a flaw. I don't want to spend time writing emails to a support team or any of that. And I am no forum person either.

So all I am saying is, don't let my conclusions necessarily influence yours. Peace.