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As the subject title suggests, when I render a song, just the drum part for now, the wave file plays, but slows down a bit, gets stuck (hiccups) plays correctly then gets stuck again etc etc.
First time it's happened.
Using BIAB 2011 Dec version. Is this a known bug?
I rarely use this program, so when I need to use it (now) it's frustrating when all hell starts to break loose.
BIABguy
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BIABguy,
What are you computer specs? (operating system, processor speed, RAM)
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Pentium-M 1.86G 2G RAM
WinXP
If anyone wants to listen to this weird .wav file I'll be happy to send it to you!
I thought 'Merge in Audio track' was the culprit, but I unchecked the box now and still got the same results.
BIABguy
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Hi again,
Something that often fixes problems with the older, slower computer processors is to turn off the fast regeneration of Realtracks. It sounds like your computer is trying to generate RTs and to render a wav file at the same time.
Go to Opt | Preferences | Realtracks and on the right side of the pop-up menu, disable "Speed up generation of Realtracks".
When you render a song with this diabled, it will take around 20 seconds before anything happens. This is because BIAB will now wait until the whole song is completely generated before it starts to play. Fast generation of RTs works the processor to the maximum and this is sometimes beyond the ability of older processors.
Hope this helps,
Noel
P.S. Make sure that you generate the song completely before you render it to a wav file.
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Quote:
Hi again,
Something that often fixes problems with the older, slower computer processors is to turn off the fast regeneration of Realtracks. It sounds like your computer is trying to generate RTs and to render a wav file at the same time.
Go to Opt | Preferences | Realtracks and on the right side of the pop-up menu, disable "Speed up generation of Realtracks".
When you render a song with this diabled, it will take around 20 seconds before anything happens. This is because BIAB will now wait until the whole song is completely generated before it starts to play. Fast generation of RTs works the processor to the maximum and this is sometimes beyond the ability of older processors.
Hope this helps,
Noel
P.S. Make sure that you generate the song completely before you render it to a wav file.
Thanks for helping out Noel!
I tried everything you suggested above but it didn't work unfortunately. So my 'slow computer' isn't the
problem. 
Even before the song play, just the count-in itself starts to lag/stick.
There is no 20 second delay before anything happens.
Immediately there is writing to disk and then the rendering to disk. Two quick processes that take just a few seconds each.
BIABguy
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Does this happen with other songs or just a particular one?
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Quote:
Does this happen with other songs or just a particular one?
Well I just tested it out with a couple other songs and it's doing the same thing with them.
This is really disconcerting, because it used to work just fine before (prior to BIAB 2011). 
BIABguy
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I sympathize with your frustration.
I'm quite puzzled because the behavior you describe is identical to the behavior experienced by people who use fast generation of RTs on machines that find it difficult to keep up with processing demands.
When you disabled the "Fast Generation of Realtracks" as I suggested above, did you exit BIAB and restart?
Some people have found that once changes are made it's necessary to physically shut down the computer for changes to kick in.
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2024
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Whenever BiaB stops doing something that it has already done in the past, there are two things to try, in this order:
1) Reboot the machine. Sometimes long edit sessions or the like can chew up resources and a reboot can get all those ducks back in a row.
2) If the reboot doesn't restore proper operation, inside BiaB, go to Options and pick Return to Factory Settings. Try the first button there first. If no joy with that button, try the second button, which also resets soundcard and MIDI synth choices, etc.
--Mac
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Check out the -> FAQ for more potential clues ...
Martin
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Quote:
Whenever BiaB stops doing something that it has already done in the past, there are two things to try, in this order:
1) Reboot the machine. Sometimes long edit sessions or the like can chew up resources and a reboot can get all those ducks back in a row.
2) If the reboot doesn't restore proper operation, inside BiaB, go to Options and pick Return to Factory Settings. Try the first button there first. If no joy with that button, try the second button, which also resets soundcard and MIDI synth choices, etc.
--Mac
Thanks for helping Mac.
I tried the reboot but it didn't make a difference.
I've done the factory reset many times for other issues. In all cases, it didn't fix the problem and I lost all of my previous settings that took hours to get set up just right.
This is not a system resource type problem.
I play the song in BIAB and it plays just fine. I render the track I want, and the render gets stuck/lags.
It has something to do with the rendering process.
I opened a fresh BIAB file, copied the chords to it and the same results happened.
BIABguy
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Tell us again which synth you are using for the render.
Double check which one is being used in the MIDI devices dialogue. Then the DXi synth selection.
Note that even if you use a DXi/VSTi synth for rendering, support has recommended selecting the GSWavetabe synth in the device window as default (not MIDImapper or such).
Last edited by rharv; 03/13/11 12:57 PM.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Quote:
Tell us again which synth you are using for the render.
Double check which one is being used in the MIDI devices dialogue. Then the DXi synth selection.
Note that even if you use a DXi/VSTi synth for rendering, support has recommended selecting the GSWavetabe synth in the device window as default (not MIDImapper or such).
OK, this is very complicated now.
Anyone who isn't comfortable with complex things should probably just avoid reading this post altogether
I was using the DXI synth but turned it off now.
Now there was a strange situation.
I could hear the midi file being played because sound was coming of my speakers, thus my internal sound card was being used.
When I tried to render, it went through the process, but nothing was heard when the wave file was played.
This is because it was trying to record through my Logitech camera mic, and I had set it to mute as I didn't want to record live sounds from it.
I didn't have any option to record the midi that I was hearing through my speakers.
(my internal sound card drivers don't load 99% of the time)
So I plugged in my UA-25EX Edirol once again.
Now it was showing up as a Midi option in BIAB.
I selected it for Midi In and Midi Out in BIAB.
Here is where I discovered something weird from another thread (How to force a Part B section to play? ).
I tried to change Substyle marker at the begininng of the song from 1a to 1b and although it showed 1b on screen, when the song was played (or replayed) it played substyle 1a !!!
But then I selected Audio, top right of screen and then mute and tried to play the file.
Nothing was heard at all!
This meant that what I was hearing was audio and not any Midi after all !!!
Not Midi from my sound card, not midi from my UA-25EX.
I confirmed this by changing Substyle 17b to 17a (bar 17) and replayed the song. Sure enough bar 17 played Substyle b, despite it showing Substyle a.
So it was definitely playing an audio file, there was no midi. But why wasn't I hearing midi from the UA-25EX now?
I was using an all-Midi quintet style (BOS_250 Bossa) after all.
Simple, I didn't know how to set up my UA-25EX properly. No one ever showed me how!
I thought, naively that if you plugged in the USB cable to the unit, everything would work automatically. All the sound would come out of the USB cable!
I thought it had a built-in Midi module (like most internal soundcards do). It just has Midi (ins and outs), that's all!
So I connected the Ins and Outs to my Roland SC 55mkII and turned on my external amplifier and replayed the BIAB song. Now I could hear the midi!
I tried once again to render the drum track.
It recorded, but when I played back the track was empty again!
Changed Midi Output from UA-25EX to MS wavetable.
It recorded, but when I played back the track was empty again!
This is where I currently stand....
BIABguy
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Automatic "Rendering" can only happen if you are using a DXi or VSTi software synthesizer.
When using an external hardware MIDI synth, the only way to make an audio file of that "performance" is to hook up the Audio L & R outputs of the MIDI synth to the L & R Line Inputs of your sound device and then play back the MIDI performance while simultaneously recording it in stereo to the Audio track.
Audio tracks recorded in BiaB will be given the same filename as the songfile that is currently loaded, just changing the suffix from .mgu/.sgu etc to .wav. When there is a .wav file of the same filename as the BiaB songfile, it will load automatically onto the BiaB Audio track and will play back along with the BiaB backing traks. To hear only the Audio file, you can either disable the Style by rightclicking on the Stylename window and choosing Disable, or you can Solo the Audio track by rightclickin on the Audio trackname. You can also change the filename of the .wav file to prevent it from autoloading with the song.
As for the Return to Factory Settings changing your settings, take the time to read what's going on there and when things are working correctly in BiaB, do what it tells you to take a snapshot of your settings so that the next time you have reason to Return to Factory Settings you can return to YOUR personal settings instead.
--Mac
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Quote:
Automatic "Rendering" can only happen if you are using a DXi or VSTi software synthesizer.
Thanks Mac, I learned this eventually yesterday. I paid my dues to learn about it!
In my case, it was suggested that the hiccups in my song were due to rendering with DXi software.
This is why I started experimenting with my UA-25EX last night. But I could never play back the rendered song with sound so at this present moment, don't know if it will cure the hiccups.
Quote:
When using an external hardware MIDI synth, the only way to make an audio file of that "performance" is to hook up the Audio L & R outputs of the MIDI synth to the L & R Line Inputs of your sound device and then play back the MIDI performance while simultaneously recording it in stereo to the Audio track.
I did not know this, thanks Mac! I will try this shortly.
Quote:
To hear only the Audio file, you can either disable the Style by rightclicking on the Stylename window and choosing Disable, or you can Solo the Audio track by rightclickin on the Audio trackname. You can also change the filename of the .wav file to prevent it from autoloading with the song.
Thanks again Mac this is also very helpful!
Quote:
As for the Return to Factory Settings changing your settings, take the time to read what's going on there and when things are working correctly in BiaB, do what it tells you to take a snapshot of your settings so that the next time you have reason to Return to Factory Settings you can return to YOUR personal settings instead.
Thanks Mac, I didn't know about taking snapshots of your settings.
That should prove very helpful as well!
BIABguy
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Quote:
Thanks Mac, I learned this eventually yesterday. I paid my dues to learn about it!
In my case, it was suggested that the hiccups in my song were due to rendering with DXi software.
This is why I started experimenting with my UA-25EX last night. But I could never play back the rendered song with sound so at this present moment, don't know if it will cure the hiccups.
Tonight I'm continuing to experiment with the song.
I have hooked up my external midi module as Mac suggested (sound out to my Edirol sound card ins).
I have gone into BIAB and tried to set my UA-25EX as my external MIDI module but it won't accept it!
It shows the following on Midi Output Driver Wizard Page:
- Use my internal sound card
- MS GS Wavetable
- Use my external midi module
- UA 25-EX
I check off the second (external and 25-EX)
but when I go back it reverts back to the internal sound card!
I don't remember what I did differently last night, but I was able to get sound from my UA-25EX + my external midi module!
Any ideas?
TIA
BIABguy
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Quote:
It shows the following on Midi Output Driver Wizard Page:
- Use my internal sound card
- MS GS Wavetable
- Use my external midi module
- UA 25-EX
I check off the second (external and 25-EX)
but when I go back it reverts back to the internal sound card!
I don't remember what I did differently last night, but I was able to get sound from my UA-25EX + my external midi module!
Any ideas?
TIA
Well I continue to be more than a bit confused.
I got the sound to happen again with my UA-25EX.
I had to change the hookup a bit from what Mac was suggesting though.
He suggested I take the out from my external midi device to the input of my sound device.
I tried that but didn't get any sound.
Here's what worked:
I took the out from my external midi device to the input of my mixer.
I then took the tape output of my mixer to the input of my sound device.
Of course my sound device was connected to my computer via a USB cable so the chain was complete.
With this setup (sorry it's not intuitive for a novice like me) I was able not only to play the BIAB song, but also render a .wav file.
And here's the best part.
The hiccups were gone!
So this proved that the hiccups were coming from the DXi software synth.
That's both good and bad news. It's good that I found out what the problem was.
It's bad that I now have to hook up all of this external sh_t just to render a midi file!
BIABguy
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If you truly selected the term, "Render" in BiaB, it could not have created the MIDI file from the external MIDI synth, it must use a DXi or VSTi synth.
If, however, you meant by that statement that you were able to *record* the MIDI to .wav file successfully, that is what can be done.
About USB devices: Don't expect to be able to open and run BiaB first and then plug in your USB sound device. It will no get recognized by BiaB.
First always plug in the USB device and wait for your system to recognize it.
Then start up BiaB.
This is because when BiaB first opens, it looks for and then displays all the available sound devices. Bypass that and you can have problems.
Yeah, when I'm using USB device here, I often have to shut BB back down again and then hook up the USB device, then start BB again because I forgot to first have the USB device hooked up and recognized before starting BiaB...
--Mac
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Quote:
If you truly selected the term, "Render" in BiaB, it could not have created the MIDI file from the external MIDI synth, it must use a DXi or VSTi synth.
If, however, you meant by that statement that you were able to *record* the MIDI to .wav file successfully, that is what can be done.
--Mac
Actually I did truly select the term "Render" and it did create a file (a wav file, not a midi file) from the external MIDI synth.
When you go into the Render to Audio File screen you are presented with two choices for rendering:
1. DXi - Direct Render (save WAV file)
2. (Re)- Render to WAV File
In my case, since I wasn't using DXi I had to select the second choice for Rendering.
BIABguy
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I believe the poster means that the "WAV" file gets stuck.
I am certain that this is a program bug... I have the same problem with BIAB 2011.
When I create a BIAB file I use either the Forte or Coyote DXI plugin together with Real Tracks and Real Drums.
The tune plays just fine in BIAB, but when you go to render a WAV file, the result is horrible!!!! Hiccup city to say the least.
I've done everything suggested (unchecked fast generation of real tracks, gotten the latest ASIO audio drivers for my ASIO USB ports (XIO 25 from M-Audio), tried different songs, reinstalled BIAB and the plugins. I also downloaded all updates... You name it, I done it!
So, I rendered a separate wav file for the solo track (sax) and, additionally, made a midi file. When I imported them both into Fruity Loops, I used the DXI plugin that came with Fruity Loops. The result was a perfect WAV file could be generated.
So, gentleman and ladies at PGMUSIC, I have been a devout customer for over 20 years and have spent thousands of dollars on your incredible products (which I love), including but not limited to the audiofile versions. Please take my word for it. There is a flaw in rendering to a WAV file when using the ASIO USB port (XIO 25). This is not a DXI problem, or computer problem. IT IS MOST LIKELY A FLAW in BIAB!
Note, I am using a Rocket Ship for a computer. The fastest i7 chip money can buy, with 7200 rpm drives and 6 gigabytes of memory. Also, 2 gigs of video memory. So, please don't be picking on my computer in your response. The quickest way to resolve the problem is to turn inward and look into your program!
Thanks in advance. I really want to be able to use the DXI/VST plugins together with Real Tracks and Drums to generate a WAV file. Is this really too much to ask?
Thanks.
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