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#164089 - 06/28/12 07:37 AM [Off-Topic] Article
90 dB Offline
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Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
In case anyone might be interested, I have a piece on American Thinker today.


http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/06/they.html



Regards,

Bob
_________________________
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#164090 - 06/28/12 09:17 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7548
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
+1

excellent article. (That means you're about to be deluged by objections. I hope everyone with good sense supports you publicly. All that's necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do and say nothing.)

We should reward common sense when we see it. Heaven knows the opposition is quick to ridicule it... and when the oppositions point of view is the only one we're allowed to see or hear, shame on us for allowing that to happen.

But we're almost (if not totally) there already.

This has been around a long time, but it is a wakeup call when you see how long the agenda has been in existence and how thoroughly it has succeeded
http://www.uhuh.com/nwo/communism/comgoals.htm

While searching for this, I was somewhat surprised (yet, not really) to see that 99% of the articles were oriented toward character bashing the author in hopes of undermining the message. But the message stands on its own two feet regardless of how anyone may perceive the author's personal perspective.

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#164091 - 06/28/12 09:23 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: Pat Marr]
90 dB Offline
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Loc: Florida
Thanks Pat. The reaction so far has been positive, but then, AT readers tend to be conservative types, so I'm just preaching to the choir.



Regards,


Bob
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#164092 - 06/28/12 09:52 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
Kemmrich Offline
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Registered: 02/27/07
Posts: 1815
Politics is politics and I am not that interested in discussing your views, whether or not I agree -- except to say

a) to every complex problem, there is always a very simple solution -- and most of the time it is wrong;
b) This generational viewpoint of "they" has been present in every generation.

However, the one thing that really bothers me was this one:

Quote:

"They started awarding trophies to every player in school team sports, winners and losers."



I don't why folks keep throwing that up as if it is destroying the competitive fiber of our youth -- 'cause it is crock of crap.

This sound-bite is tossed about by those who don't really pay attention any more to kids in sport. Kids know who wins and loses, winning trophies are for winners and the competitive spirit is alive and well. I am not sure how recognition for participation in an activity has somehow led to the downfall of our society.

Don't like the movies -- don't go see them, they have always been bastions of liberal, corrupt individuals and corporations. Don't like the way schools are run, vote in a new school board. Your simplistic rant about what is wrong with America is misinformed and as dangerous as the yea-hoos on the left.

Isn't there anyone in the middle anymore?

Kevin
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#164093 - 06/28/12 10:30 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: Kemmrich]
90 dB Offline
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Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
Kevin,

For someone “not that interested in discussing your views “, you do have quite a bit to say.

“Your simplistic rant about what is wrong with America is misinformed and as dangerous as the yea-hoos on the left.”


Your response sounds more like an expression of personal antipathy than a rejection of my views. For that reason, I will not bother to refute any of your points.

Thanks for reading the article and commenting.




Regards,


Bob
_________________________
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https://90dbband.bandcamp.com/

https://soundcloud.com/90-db



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#164094 - 06/28/12 12:13 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7548
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
before we get a flame war going here, I'd just like to say that intelligent people should be able to express highly volatile ideas peaceably and without resorting to character assassination.

The old expression is that "He who runs out of arguments strikes first", so resorting to personal attacks in forum discussion is generally regarded as an admission of ideological defeat.

In my experience you can get away with almost any statement in discussions of this sort, as long as you say it in a way that preserves the dignity of those on the other side of the discussion. Failing to do that pretty much always leads to a fight rather than a discussion.

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#164095 - 06/28/12 02:58 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: Pat Marr]
90 dB Offline
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Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
I agree Pat. It was not my intention to start any controversy.



Regards,


Bob
_________________________
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https://90dbband.bandcamp.com/

https://soundcloud.com/90-db



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#164096 - 06/28/12 03:50 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: Kemmrich]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4389
Quote:

Kids know who wins and loses, winning trophies are for winners and the competitive spirit is alive and well. I am not sure how recognition for participation in an activity has somehow led to the downfall of our society.




Sure they know. But do they care?

And I am against giving losers trophies because it teaches kids that they will be rewarded for just showing up, like most people do at their jobs when they get older. If your life is just about showing up, I pity you. I do everything 100% and 100 miles per hour. That's because I was raised in a generation that taught me that the hardest workers succeed. Of course that means I also crash hard when I crash. Life is to be lived, experienced and enjoyed, not just endured. That kind of comment usually comes from paents who were eggheads and bookworms and never experienced the joy of working with a team and achieving a common goal. If they do choose sports, the goal is to excel. If not, that is fine too. If they choose arts, music, dance, carpentry, plumbing... do it 100% and excel at it.

Trophys to losing teams is a bad thing. A trophy is supposed to represent excellence, not participation. Little doughy kids like "Chad" and "Cameron" do not deserve trophies just for showing up in their uniform to please their yuppie parents.

Yes, I am an old school inner city kid who grew up scuffling on the streets. I did not have permissive parents, and many times during on field confrontations my father stood and watched me get the stuffing beat out of me. Rather than stepping in, he allowed it to be motivation for me to become better at defending myself so it didn't happen. And it resulted in my being Northast Ohio Golden Gloves runner up 2 years in a row, at the same time helping me realize that fighting outside of organized boxing is stupid and pointless. After Golden Gloves, I never got into a fight where it wasn't to rescue someone from an outnumbered beating. However, once I step in, it's a battle to the death.

You don't learn that being rewarded for nothing but showing up.

All these parents now jumping on the "my kid won't play football because he might get hurt" bandwagon should just put them in dresses and eye makeup and prepare them for the gender change surgery. Planes crash too. So your kid will never fly because there that chance? How about driving? Cars crash more often than planes. You may not have noticed from your position, but life is tough. Wear your helmet.

Remember. Conceive it, perceive it, believe it, achieve it.
_________________________
I will continue to post in the songwriters forum but will be keeping my opinions to myself as far as the off topic forum goes.

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#164097 - 06/28/12 05:06 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
dcuny Offline
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Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 2364
Loc: Sacramento, California
before we get a flame war going here, I'd just like to say that intelligent people should be able to express highly volatile ideas peaceably and without resorting to character assassination.

That's an excellent thought!

I hope everyone with good sense supports you publicly.
All that's necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do and say nothing.




Bob, the gist of the article is good (at least, in terms of intent), but I think it simplifies things a bit much.

You repeatedly say We grumbled, but did nothing. I don't think this is accurate. Quite a bit has been done by people on these issues, and continues to be done. To say otherwise does discredit to those who have worked long and hard for their causes.

You say "In true Alinsky fashion, they batter us with labels.", but your own terms - "Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement" - seem to be exactly what you are complaining about.

But what I find most problematic in pointing to a group of "them" is that they are conveniently not "us".
_________________________
-- David Cuny
My virtual singer development blog

Vocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?

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#164098 - 06/28/12 05:42 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: dcuny]
90 dB Offline
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Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
Quote:

before we get a flame war going here, I'd just like to say that intelligent people should be able to express highly volatile ideas peaceably and without resorting to character assassination.

That's an excellent thought!

I hope everyone with good sense supports you publicly.
All that's necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do and say nothing.




Bob, the gist of the article is good (at least, in terms of intent), but I think it simplifies things a bit much.

You repeatedly say We grumbled, but did nothing. I don't think this is accurate. Quite a bit has been done by people on these issues, and continues to be done. To say otherwise does discredit to those who have worked long and hard for their causes.

You say "In true Alinsky fashion, they batter us with labels.", but your own terms - "Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement" - seem to be exactly what you are complaining about.

But what I find most problematic in pointing to a group of "them" is that they are conveniently not "us".







David,

Thanks for reading the article. While I agree that “quite a bit has been done”, I submit that it has not been enough. I don't believe that stating that fact does any discredit to anyone. A failed effort is still a failure, regardless of the good intentions of the people making the effort.


“You say "In true Alinsky fashion, they batter us with labels.", but your own terms - "Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement" - seem to be exactly what you are complaining about.”


I respectfully disagree. These terms are political, not epithetic. Terms like “Xenophobe”, “Homophobe”, “Racist “ and “Misogynist “ are epithets, not legitimate political descriptions, such as “Marxist”.

“But what I find most problematic in pointing to a group of "them" is that they are conveniently not "us". “

Actually, that was the point of the entire article. Everyone blames “Them”, while in fact, WE are “Them”, not by commission, but by omission.

Have you any argument on the content of the article, or just a problem with the way it was presented? Your comments have not made that very clear to me.



Regards,


Bob
_________________________
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https://90dbband.bandcamp.com/

https://soundcloud.com/90-db



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#164099 - 06/28/12 07:12 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
pwarren Offline
Expert

Registered: 02/01/08
Posts: 826
Loc: BC, Canada
Well I won't comment on that since political discussions are not permitted on this site. I did, however spot a big error in one of your claims.

They created a federal bureaucracy answerable to no one, with pay and retirement benefits triple those of the general populace

The source you cite, whether accurate or not, claims 44% greater pay and benefits. That's not even close to the triple (300%) you claim. The problem with this type of error is other people read it and assume it's correct.
_________________________
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#164100 - 06/28/12 07:28 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: pwarren]
90 dB Offline
Veteran

Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
Quote:

Well I won't comment on that since political discussions are not permitted on this site. I did, however spot a big error in one of your claims.

They created a federal bureaucracy answerable to no one, with pay and retirement benefits triple those of the general populace

The source you cite, whether accurate or not, claims 44% greater pay and benefits. That's not even close to the triple (300%) you claim. The problem with this type of error is other people read it and assume it's correct.









Point taken. I stand corrected.

That said, I still submit that a 44% difference in pay and benefits is egregious. Actually, it's closer to 50%, or twice that of the private sector.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/tbb/tbb-0605-35.pdf

In future, I will pay closer attention to my statistics. Good catch.





Regards,


Bob
_________________________
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https://90dbband.bandcamp.com/

https://soundcloud.com/90-db



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#164101 - 06/28/12 07:41 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
dcuny Offline
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Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 2364
Loc: Sacramento, California
You imply that there's some sort of concerted Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement ideology behind all the changes. But it's more a given than a proven point. And (to my mind) you don't make a very compelling case.

For example:

They created a federal bureaucracy answerable to no one, with pay and retirement benefits triple those of the general populace.

The basic premise - federal bureaucracy is answerable to no one - is a large claim, and not really true. Bureaucracy by it's definition is answerable up the chain, and ultimately the folk at top are as well. It's slow and insulated, but it is accountable.

As for pay benefits, are you comparing apples and oranges? When you say "general populace", it doesn't sound like you're comparing the same benefits for the same type of jobs. Considering that we're in the middle of a massive recession, I suspect the comparison is even less balanced, given the level of unemployment.


They created an imperial presidency and made the Congress inconsequential.

Wikipedia says Imperial Presidency goes back to the '60s and Nixon, with another big push by Reagan. That's not exactly overnight, and those aren't generally seen as folk on your list.

Congress is many things, but not inconsequential.


They fostered the destruction of our manufacturing and agriculture bases.

The flight of capitalists based on cheap manufacture and labor isn't by folk on your list, either.


They permitted the invasion of our country by illegal aliens, and chastised anyone who objected.

I'd argue that the people who paid the illegal aliens bear the brunt of the blame here. Statistics says that's driven by the demand for cheap labor for agriculture. In any event, the people who support the idea that workers having some level of rights aren't generally Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement.


They legalized and promoted the systematic murder of millions of the innocent unborn.

Clearly a hotbutton issue. The Jane Does in Roe vs. Wade now say they were reluctant and blame their lawyers. But I doubt the majority of abortion supporters were socialists. While Margaret Sanger was a socialist, and a believer in eugenics and racial superiority as well. But it's an unsupported leap to claim that of everyone who believed that abortion was a reproductive rights issue has the same set of values.

You claim a lot, but rely on the reader to agree with you, assuming they also lump everyone other than them as having the same set of Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world ideology driving them.

That's just not the case. The argument is an emotional one, not a logical one.


"We revered Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, and all of those who gave us this great nation."

Why were these people "revered"? Most of what people believe about Washington is myth (although stripped of the myth, he's still pretty awesome). Jefferson was a brilliant thinker, but very much a flawed man. Lincoln is often admired because he "freed the slaves", but that's simply not true, and distorts what the American Civil War was about in the first place.

From the historical documents I've seen, I wouldn't agree. We've never been the sort of homogeneous group that school history texts seem to present us as. And history has never been quite as squeaky clean as we're often led to believe.


"But we weren't the morally, sexually, politically ambiguous creatures that now inhabit much of America."

I heard an story a while back on NPR, where people talked about this sort of thing. Invariably, they would cite the time when they were growing up. What was interesting is they they would talk to someone who was an adult at that time, who quickly debunked this idea that "things were so much better". They kept pushing back the the prior decade, and that before, but never did find such a time.

So - in my view - you paint with a wide brush of generalizations and rely on appealing to your reader's sense of nostalgia and shared moral outrage.

An it worries me, because in the process of simplifying the problem to a Marxist conspiracy of some sort, it overlooks assumptions, such as the existence of that mythical better time. It also feel it encourages a "tribe" mentality, which seems to be hardwired into us. It seems very easy to put someone in the "not our tribe" category.

We knew that actions had consequences, and that hard work would be rewarded."

The sad thing is, that's not necessarily true. Good people suffer, evil people live out lives of luxury. People take credit for the work of others, and sometimes people get away with murder.

I appreciate people standing up for what they believe is right. But having someone disagree with you doesn't make them a Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive.
_________________________
-- David Cuny
My virtual singer development blog

Vocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?

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#164102 - 06/28/12 07:57 PM [Off-Topic] Federal Overpaid? [Re: 90 dB]
dcuny Offline
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Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 2364
Loc: Sacramento, California
If you look through that paper, you'll also see that there's no clear agreement as to what the measure of over/underpayment is. It finally bases the conclusion that federal workers are overpaid because "Just 1 in 5,000 federal nondefense workers is fired for poor performance each year."

That's the metric for wages? At a minimum, they could at least try to show those non-fired workers underperform their private equivalents, but they don't even try.

Further, it argues that top federal positions shouldn't be paying comparable wages because "it draws talent away from high-valued activities in the private sector", which is an interesting argument: we essentially should pay less for government to ensure we get worse government.

All in all, an odd paper. Oh, I see it's written by the Cato Institute:
Quote:

The Cato Institute is a public policy research organization — a think tank — dedicated to the principles of individual liberty, limited government, free markets and peace. Its scholars and analysts conduct independent, nonpartisan research on a wide range of policy issues.


The bottom line is that even this paper admits it's not an apples to apples comparison.
_________________________
-- David Cuny
My virtual singer development blog

Vocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?

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#164103 - 06/28/12 09:06 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Federal Overpaid? [Re: dcuny]
John Conley Offline
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Registered: 09/28/03
Posts: 8333
Loc: London, Ontario, Canada
It's grand to live in Canuckistan.
Where the pucks fly through frozen stands
And the docs are on the dole.
We cut the wood for bats, popsickle sticks and studs,
Where the true north stands proud and free.
Strong arms hold our blades
And our crosses burn bright on verdent hills


You get the idea.
I don't.
_________________________
John Conley
Musica est vita

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#164104 - 06/28/12 09:57 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: dcuny]
90 dB Offline
Veteran

Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4720
Loc: Florida
Quote:

You imply that there's some sort of concerted Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement ideology behind all the changes. But it's more a given than a proven point. And (to my mind) you don't make a very compelling case.

For example:

They created a federal bureaucracy answerable to no one, with pay and retirement benefits triple those of the general populace.

The basic premise - federal bureaucracy is answerable to no one - is a large claim, and not really true. Bureaucracy by it's definition is answerable up the chain, and ultimately the folk at top are as well. It's slow and insulated, but it is accountable.

As for pay benefits, are you comparing apples and oranges? When you say "general populace", it doesn't sound like you're comparing the same benefits for the same type of jobs. Considering that we're in the middle of a massive recession, I suspect the comparison is even less balanced, given the level of unemployment.


They created an imperial presidency and made the Congress inconsequential.

Wikipedia says Imperial Presidency goes back to the '60s and Nixon, with another big push by Reagan. That's not exactly overnight, and those aren't generally seen as folk on your list.

Congress is many things, but not inconsequential.


They fostered the destruction of our manufacturing and agriculture bases.

The flight of capitalists based on cheap manufacture and labor isn't by folk on your list, either.


They permitted the invasion of our country by illegal aliens, and chastised anyone who objected.

I'd argue that the people who paid the illegal aliens bear the brunt of the blame here. Statistics says that's driven by the demand for cheap labor for agriculture. In any event, the people who support the idea that workers having some level of rights aren't generally Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world movement.


They legalized and promoted the systematic murder of millions of the innocent unborn.

Clearly a hotbutton issue. The Jane Does in Roe vs. Wade now say they were reluctant and blame their lawyers. But I doubt the majority of abortion supporters were socialists. While Margaret Sanger was a socialist, and a believer in eugenics and racial superiority as well. But it's an unsupported leap to claim that of everyone who believed that abortion was a reproductive rights issue has the same set of values.

You claim a lot, but rely on the reader to agree with you, assuming they also lump everyone other than them as having the same set of Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive world ideology driving them.

That's just not the case. The argument is an emotional one, not a logical one.


"We revered Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, and all of those who gave us this great nation."

Why were these people "revered"? Most of what people believe about Washington is myth (although stripped of the myth, he's still pretty awesome). Jefferson was a brilliant thinker, but very much a flawed man. Lincoln is often admired because he "freed the slaves", but that's simply not true, and distorts what the American Civil War was about in the first place.

From the historical documents I've seen, I wouldn't agree. We've never been the sort of homogeneous group that school history texts seem to present us as. And history has never been quite as squeaky clean as we're often led to believe.


"But we weren't the morally, sexually, politically ambiguous creatures that now inhabit much of America."

I heard an story a while back on NPR, where people talked about this sort of thing. Invariably, they would cite the time when they were growing up. What was interesting is they they would talk to someone who was an adult at that time, who quickly debunked this idea that "things were so much better". They kept pushing back the the prior decade, and that before, but never did find such a time.

So - in my view - you paint with a wide brush of generalizations and rely on appealing to your reader's sense of nostalgia and shared moral outrage.

An it worries me, because in the process of simplifying the problem to a Marxist conspiracy of some sort, it overlooks assumptions, such as the existence of that mythical better time. It also feel it encourages a "tribe" mentality, which seems to be hardwired into us. It seems very easy to put someone in the "not our tribe" category.

We knew that actions had consequences, and that hard work would be rewarded."

The sad thing is, that's not necessarily true. Good people suffer, evil people live out lives of luxury. People take credit for the work of others, and sometimes people get away with murder.

I appreciate people standing up for what they believe is right. But having someone disagree with you doesn't make them a Marxist/communist/socialist/progressive.








I began a rebuttal to your points, but realized that it would be futile, and a waste of time. I'm afraid we will just have to agree to disagree.
I appreciate your reading the article and taking the time to comment.



Regards,


Bob
_________________________
Dyslectics Untie!


https://90dbband.bandcamp.com/

https://soundcloud.com/90-db



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#164105 - 06/28/12 10:13 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: 90 dB]
dcuny Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 2364
Loc: Sacramento, California
Quote:

I began a rebuttal to your points, but realized that it would be futile, and a waste of time. I'm afraid we will just have to agree to disagree.



Astonishingly enough, that's exactly the same reason why I initially decided not to give a detailed response.

But you asked...

Quote:

I appreciate your reading the article and taking the time to comment.



And thanks for taking the time to read and consider my response!

I suspect any additional responses would just devolve, sort of like John's free verse. I'm sure there's some rhyming scheme embedded somewhere in his lyric - I'm just not clever enough to grok it.

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#164106 - 06/28/12 11:30 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: dcuny]
KeithS Offline
Expert

Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 900
Loc: Mobile, Alabama
I admire your well thought out views David. Its good to seee someone who can cut through the crap without getting down in the muck.
_________________________
Keith
BIAB 2018 Audiophile
Home Built i7 i5280K 3.4 Ghz, 64 GB RAM, Melodyne Studio 4
Windows 7 64 Bit, SONAR Platinum, Sony Vegas 13, Acid 7, Sony Audio Master Suite, Waves Horizon Bundle, Izotope Ozone 7 Advanced

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#164107 - 06/29/12 01:42 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: KeithS]
dcuny Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 2364
Loc: Sacramento, California
Thanks!

But... Since I called Pat out on his terminology, I'm now morally obligated to point out:

Quote:

Its good to seee someone who can cut through the crap without getting down in the muck.






Cheers!
_________________________
-- David Cuny
My virtual singer development blog

Vocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?

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#164108 - 06/29/12 08:25 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Article [Re: dcuny]
Pat Marr Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7548
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Man, there are a BUNCH of things about this discussion that bother me:

I'll preface my replies with the admission that I speak opinion. I'm not professing my point of view to be absolute truth. having said that...

IMO, most of the rebuttals above make the same logical error they claim to be correcting in the original article.

Quote:

to every complex problem, there is always a very simple solution -- and most of the time it is wrong;





that is, in itself, a simple summary of a complex problem. "WRONG" is the simple summary bandied about most often when there is no opposing argument offered, but the current argument is rejected.

The greatest affront to common sense (IMO) is to suggest that any conclusion that is not perfect is therefore wrong. Conservatives don't claim to have perfect answers. We shoot for RATIONAL answers. The definition of a rational decision is that it is not based on what makes us feel good, but rather it is the least-cost max-benefit solution

I didn't see ANY rebuttals above that offered anything more tangible than a rejection of the ideas offered because they aren't perfect. Nobody can win that game because no matter how much time is spent considering the cost and benefits, the opposition can just reject it without offering a better option.

(thoughts divided into separate posts for clarity of reading)

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User Feedback - Run as Administrator

Our Forum is a great resource for all your Band-in-a-Box questions (and a GREAT place to connect with other program users!)

Among the many forums available, we have a User-to-User Tips & Tricks forum - perfect for sharing your own technical tips and tricks for any PG Music product!

Like the recent post by jford: You Should Run BIAB and RealBand As Administrator!

Xtra Styles PAK 5 Song Contest - Over 25 Entries!

We recently launched an Xtra Styles PAK 5 Song Contest with 4 prizes of $150!

So far, there are more than 25 entries! Have a listen to these entries and submit your own song here.

Contest Rules:
-You must own Band-in-a-Box® 2018 along with one or more of the Xtra Styles PAK 5 packages (Country, Jazz, Rock-Pop, MIDI)
-The song you submit must be your own original composition. This could be simply typing in chords to your song and pressing play, but you may also add additional instruments, solo, and/or melody.
-Public domain songs will be accepted.
-Multiple entries are permitted.
-Submit your song to the "Xtra Styles 5 Contest" forum, before the deadline. (This contest runs until September 30th)

For complete information on this contest, click here.

New Online Band-in-a-Box and RealBand Manuals

Do you hate digging around for manuals as much as I do? Now you can access the most recent Band-in-a-Box® and RealBand manuals with just a few clicks on the new Online Manuals section of our website.

The PDF manuals for version 2017 and 2018 are available now. Plus, we're adding online versions of these manuals too! The Band-in-a-Box® 2018 Windows User's Guide is complete, and the Mac User's Guide will be coming very soon. We're even adding a search feature to make it even easier for you to find features that you are looking for - stay tuned!

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