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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3 |
Hi , i m about to order the UltraPlusPak Audiophile for Mac . It comes loaded on a USB drive. I always prefered to work with audio installed on a Firewire which is supposed to deliver higher speed , faster access and therefore better performances.
Do the owners of that Audiophile Pak for Mac ever complained about slow access or any problem due to the use of that USB drive.?
Maybe people use that drive as a back up and transfer the files and data on a Firewire drive for pro use ?
Any feedback will be appreciated since i m holding my VIsa card in my hand
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
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Posts: 38,502 |
I don't find any noticeable difference in the case of Band in a Box, USB2.0 is plenty fast enough.
Consider that BIAB does not multitrack in the usual sense of the word, there is a single stereo output going on there.
Couple that with the fact that BIAB does not stream from drive, it accesses the drive to load things, the RealTracks being the thing that takes the longest to do, but the drive throughput is only a small part of the problem here, it isn't streaming so Sustained Transfer Rate doesn't even come into play here, the Realtrack time is more about processing which parts of the root RT file to place where in your song than about streaming. That can be accomplished with the Burst Rate of USB 2.0 quite easily. Once the song is generated, the playback you hear is actually being derived from a Temp storage on your internal hard drive anyway.
Loading times of RealTracks don't seem to be affected all that much differently on the FireWire drive as vs the USB either. (I copied my USB drive's BB contents to a FireWire at one point just to see.) Now I just use the original USB drive that PGMusic sent me.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3 |
Thanx a lot Mac. I read your posts on the forum, quite interesting. Now i m just waiting to know the shipping delay and cost (i m in Europe) before using plastic :-)
(i asked the PG support for that and i ll get an reply soon i hope)
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 812
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 812 |
Hi sam7,
If you want real speed, you might want to check into the new Solid State Hard drives. They come in many flavors (USB, Firewire, PCMCIA) and both the read and write speeds are far above the fastest Firewire drives. There is no spinning platter, so the data has a much longer and more secure lifespan, there is much less heat also.
The downside is the cost, right now they are a tad pricey. You can check both tigerdirect and newegg, they both have many models available. I'm waiting for 3 things right now>
1. The cost to come down
2. A portable enclosure without need of a power supply
3. Making sure that the drive doesn't suffer from the Windows format problem (for example, a 500 GB drive formatted for Windows loses almost 90 GB. Frustrating!)
Good luck, hope this helps,
Ed
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
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There is indeed a failure mode with solid state drive.
It is catastrophic.
And it is instantaneous.
That said, it is as minimized as can be, but it exists. Because a problem with power can take the thing out in a few nanoseconds. Not. Pretty. Unlike a crashed hard drive, there is no clean room or data recovery solution should it happen.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
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likkle birdies are floating around saying usb could get vewy interesting
in the next few years allied with improved pen drive wead/wite performance n
larger storage sizes..
oops likkle birdie just dropped a doodoo on my head for telling..
but mebe i'll be wrong n people can throw egg at me..lol.
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 166
Apprentice
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Apprentice
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 166 |
Ed, could you enlighten me on this?
If a drive is connected to the Mac over USB (or FireWire), is this connection not the bottleneck? Meaning that no matter how fast the drive is it is always faster then the connection UNLESS it is connected over the bus (like an internal drive)?
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,101
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Expert
Joined: Jun 2003
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I drive a PC and know nothing about Mac so if I'm volunteering worthless information here please excuse my ignorance of the operating system and the file formats involved. For what its worth, I opened up the usb enclosure on my 2009.5 Audiophile last month because the fans started making a loud screaching noise. I couldn't fix that problem but found that the drive inside was a 3.5 inch SATA, so I just pulled it out and installed it in an eSATA enclousre that I had laying around, or I could have installed it in an empty bay in my desktop.
We can debate USB and Fireware until the cows come home but right now neither approach the transfer speeds of SATA. You might want to consider that option.
Keith
2024 Audiophile Windows 11 AMD RYZEN THREADRIPPER 3960X 4.5GHZ 128 GB RAM 2 Nvidia RTX 3090s, Vegas,Acid,SoundForge,Izotope Production,Melodyne Studio,Cakewalk,Raven Mti
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
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Well, since the iNTEL Macs, we no longer enjoy the good old SCSI drive interface, it is now the same as Windows.
BUT -- USB 2.0 can do Burst speeds that rival FireWire. Both can do Bursts that rival the internal connections, but with Audio that streams direct to or from disk, the Burst spec can be meaningless for us, what we need to know really is the specification that most manufacturers won't publish and that is the STR or the Sustained Transfer Rate of the drive.
Now that I've said all that, I don't think it really applies in the case of BiaB because it seems that the drive is only accessed when building the RealTracks/RealDrums for the song and that is not a direct disk stream situation such as we want when multitracking many simultaneous channels of Audio into and out of the computer at the same time.
That means that the Burst spec is likely what is applying anyway.
That said, the internal connection methods are always going to be a better way to go if you can go that way. At this point in time, anyway.
But I wouldn't spend too much of the time and money resources chasing after faster loading times. Technology marches on and if the past is any indication, some day in the not too distant future something will come out that will better handle large file situations like these. You can almost feel it. But the larger consumer market of digital video is certainly driving the developments.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,101
Expert
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Posts: 1,101 |
The point that I was really trying to make that may have gotten lost within some of my other commentary is that unlike some other usb drive versions of BIAB that are contained on a laptop size hard drive, the 2009.5 audiophile version comes on a 3.5 inch SATA drive that is readily placed in an eSATA enclosure or an empty internal bay on a desktop.
Keith
2024 Audiophile Windows 11 AMD RYZEN THREADRIPPER 3960X 4.5GHZ 128 GB RAM 2 Nvidia RTX 3090s, Vegas,Acid,SoundForge,Izotope Production,Melodyne Studio,Cakewalk,Raven Mti
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
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Quote:
The point that I was really trying to make that may have gotten lost within some of my other commentary is that unlike some other usb drive versions of BIAB that are contained on a laptop size hard drive, the 2009.5 audiophile version comes on a 3.5 inch SATA drive that is readily placed in an eSATA enclosure or an empty internal bay on a desktop.
Not a problem to connect the laptop SATA drive to the desktop if you've picked out the right adaptor.
Here's one, there are others that are less expensive, too!
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3 |
I started this topic before buying the 1T USB drive Pak for Mac. I must thank all the people who helped with their contribution. Afer having read a few posts I bought the Pak through the Internet from PG , it all worked perfectly, got the parcel within 48 hours (from Canada to Europe) and it works great. I confirm those drive are Hornettek Hover HDD SATA , there are 2 models , the one i got is the USB, there s also a SSC Model (eSATA/USB) but it s not the one that comes standard when shipping from PG.
I confirm that installation is a breeze (Mac Intel 2x2.66 Dual Xeon, 5GB) , and it works as expected.
The soft is brilliant , i hadn t used BIAB since the early MIDI versions, the concept was already here but now;..wow !!!! brilliant !!!
Thanx again to all , even if now i got the answers to my initial post i continue reading the posts , very interesting because it s now about larger issues with HD that apply to all HD users, not only PG original package.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
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Veteran
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Posts: 38,502 |
Quote:
But I wouldn't spend too much of the time and money resources chasing after faster loading times. Technology marches on and if the past is any indication, some day in the not too distant future something will come out that will better handle large file situations like these. You can almost feel it. But the larger consumer market of digital video is certainly driving the developments.
--Mac
Well, the march of technology continues relentlessly on.
When I typed the above we were in beta testing the new Windows BiaB2010 and I knew it would feature MUCH FASTER REALTRACKS LOADING TIMES.
On average, the loading time is now around 7 secs on my long in the tooth windows machine here.
If there is a RealTracks Soloist involved, it does still take a bit longer, I guess for the computing processing more than the disk part, though.
And I'm thinking that if PGMusic could speed it up that much for the PC environment, the future of Macintosh BiaB RealTracks loading times is very bright indeed.
Stay tuned.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 812
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Hi,
I just learned something that I thought was pretty amazing. I was looking at buying a new DA interface. I always considered firewire, because I thought the transfer rate, throughput and sonics would be better. BUT.....I stand corrected>
RME has a new USB 2 interface and they explained that Firewire has a built in latency of 6ms, whereas USB 2 high speed with AC power (No Buss power) has latency of 2-4ms. Not a huge change, but better than firewire. This new device looks amazing and the first USB interface I have seriously considered. RME is expensive, but it's just about the best, unless your pockets allow you to buy a Lynx Aurora, Metric Halo ULN 2, or Apogee Ensemble, all above $2,000. The RME UC is about $1,300 but the converters and Mic Pres and drivers/cuemix are supposed to be amazing.
Ed
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
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Don't think if a 2mS difference is really worth being the sole criteria for picking one over the other, though.
There are other inputs to this problem that should also be considered carefully when choosing a sound device.
Bandwidth, for one. If you are only ever considering streaming in one stereo track at a time, USB can do that. But if you need multitrack multiple channel streaming, FireWire may still represent the better choice due to its Sustained Transfer Rate.
Also consider carefully your use of higher bitrates here, too, if that is of importance to you.
--Mac
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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User Video: Next-Level AI Music Editing with ACE Studio and Band-in-a-Box®
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 German for Windows is Here!
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 für Windows Deutsch ist verfügbar!
Wir waren fleißig und haben über 50 neue Funktionen und eine erstaunliche Sammlung neuer Inhalte hinzugefügt, darunter 222 RealTracks, neue RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, "Songs with Vocals" Artist Performance Sets, abspielbare RealTracks Set 3, abspielbare RealDrums Set 2, zwei neue Sets von "RealDrums Stems", XPro Styles PAK 6, Xtra Styles PAK 17 und mehr!
Paket | Was ist Neu
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!
If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
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