PG Music Home Forums General Discussion User Showcase Another "Vietnam Song"

I never dreamed I would post this song.
I've never even considered recording it.
After clifton and David broached the subject in their songs, I went and dug this up.

This is a snapshot of a specific time in our history.
And the reactions and feelings from certain segments of America.
It tells the story of a "conflicted" veteran.
And how he (and others like him) were treated by a small (or maybe less than small), but very vocal group of the Americans he had gone to war for.

This sentiment, fortunately, no longer seems to exists.
But it ripped the fabric of America at the time.

We have healed.
The Wall commemorates those who gave their lives for the ideals of America.
Those who returned no longer face the anger and ridicule that some chose to greet them with at the time.
That should give us all hope for the future.

Again, keep in mind this was written in 1975. (I was 20).
A snapshot in time.


UNPOPULAR HERO

i was raised in the bible belt
by mom and apple pie
all my life i pledged allegiance
while the stars and stipes would fly
and when my notice came the canadian border
never crossed my mind
like my grampa, my dad and my uncles
i was proud to serve my time

   unpopular hero in an unpopular war
   i was still a virgin
   she stood leaning in the door
   she just wants her pay
   she don't want my love
   she just want her pay

i read the history they wrote
i saw the movies they made
audey murphy, john wayne and my dad came home
to ticker tape parades
but when we came home
no one looked us in the eye
we didn't want to talk of it
but no one asked us why

   unpopular hero in an unpopular war
   we were all just virgins
   she stood leaning in the door
   she just wants her pay
   she don't want my love
   she just want her pay

i've got pictures you don't want to see
swirling through my head
every day i fight to forget
my fight is all but dead
go ahead, ignore us
maybe we'll go away
will anyone mention vietnam
come memorial day

   unpopular hero in an unpopular war
   sixty thousand virgins
   please no more
   it's too much to pay
   it's too much to pay





The BAND:
Style is _LAMENT.STY (Lament Modern Pop Country Ballad)

RealTracks in style: 1825:Bass, Electric, PopModernGrooveHeld Ev16 075
RealTracks in style: 1537:Guitar, Electric, Rhythm PopBelieveArp Ev16 065
RealTracks in style: 1037:Guitar, Acoustic, Rhythm NorthernRockBallad Ev 065
RealTracks in song: 3056:Guitar, Acoustic, Rhythm Pop16thsSyncBrent Ev16 085
RealTracks in song: 836:Guitar, Electric, Rhythm AltCountryRootsy Ev 075 (A:muted)
RealDrums in style: ModernPopBallad16ths^01-a:Quiet hat, Sync-kick, b:Open hat, Sync-kick



floyd

Me love this long time.

Floyd,

A tremendous song... Outstanding and heavy write for a twenty year old. Very cool to hear you perform this now - I love the way it sounds like you are looking back.

I also love the mix and the way the rhythm guitars bubble underneath the track.

Headed back for my third listen...

Bob

Spot on Floyd that's the way you do it.

Did you use realtracks or loops or are you playing the guitar ?.

I would love to hear the original even if recording standards were not as advanced (a wee tape recording maybe) WHY..?, I love all that stuff, vinyl,tape, my passion.

Great song about a very sad time in our history. I lost seven friends in that war.

As usual your mix, vocals and lyrics are top notch.

No words. In all the best ways. I can't even imagine aside from glimpses like this. Thanks for giving some insight.

And..

Thank you to everyone who has served. I NEVER take that lightly.

This song will haunt me for a bit.

No it;s not another Vienmam war song, it is an outstanding Vietnam war, era song. This just brings to life that period that is so remarkable in all of it's glory and horror. THis is down to earth, from someone who was in the time period. Love it Floyd.

floyd,

This is very, very powerful! I'm glad you pulled it out, dusted it off and unleashed BIAB. I love that ending and the ending chord. It really left me hanging in the air thinking about all you'd sung. As I'm sitting here typing this, the song and its images are still bright in my mind.

I thought it was excellent the way that you used the chorus as a kind of parallel narrative. For me, the verses were a glimpse into the mind, heart and soul of the unpopular hero and the choruses (complete with their own independent development) were a glimpse of the 'other side of the coin'. 'Heartbreaking' is a word that just sprang into my head. Your story-telling and commentary unfolded like a movie for me. First person narrative was an ideal choice of perspective.

Everything about this sits perfectly in my headphones. The acoustic guitar beginning was terrific and its sound was first class. Then as the rest of the band started joining in and building a wall of sound with musical precision and intent, I found myself getting pulled into the music and the lyrics more as a participant than a listener. I think that's why the starkness of the ending was so powerful for me. It was like I was there, a part of the history.

This song resonated with me in so many ways!

All the best,
Noel

Man, what a song! On my second listen as I type this.

Just a tremendous write! And the fact you did it when you were only 20 ... pretty deep stuff.

Love the production on this too, the way you start with just the acoustic and then slowly build intensity by adding in the additional instruments with the drums not coming in until the last chorus, and then that last hanging chord ....

I'm glad you decided to post this, it's an song that should be heard.

FJ,
You ACED IT.
In Australia we has a "hit single" in about 84 which essayed some of the things you covered. We were at a stage where we could talk about Vietnam by then - ignore the evil politics of the war and focus on the human story. If you get a chance to look up I Was Only 19 (a walk in the light green) by Redgum you may like it. Is has a different impact to your song but different is always good. Your song has incredible impact and is sung/performed perfectly for the topic, time and purpose. Well done.
I Was only 19 - Redgum
Oh, it was a hit again a couple of years ago - but as a cover by a hip hop band - odd but that's OK.
A mate & I wrote our own - but from the perspective of observing the evacuation...
It doesn't have the impact of yours and, as is usual for me, has too many words and not enough emotion - YOU get the balance right.
Solong Shuffle - Pygmy Beat

Yes, the final chord, because it ends like Vietnam, just going on, the final chord still there when it 's only a phantom. I still remember the face of the guy who said, they killed my brother, so I'm going over there.

floyd, The sound you get is always crisp, clean and well balanced. Good choice of instruments and you skillfully added them as the build progressed. The write was advanced considering your age at the time. It shows that you were not immune to the collective feeling at the time of loss of innocence. Your chorus brings that across with some stark images. I was in my teens and twenties at that time and looking back I can say with certainty that the war affected every single person that I knew in one way or another. You have left no doubt that it affected you. Beautifully done, Tom

Per our previous PM conversation I'll echo all other comments.
One gains many new perspectives when one experiences the true face of war, the brutality of it all and coming to grips of what's expected of you when faced with the challenging circumstances every day.
One can't unsee any of the images or reconcile many of the experiences at such a young age.

But, no complaints here....that's life.
Carry on.....back to topic.

eddie - means a lot that you accept and like this... thanks...





Thanks, Bob. I had a tendency to write a number of "heavy" things in those days. Listening to too much Prine...

Floyd,

Very powerful write and great production.Love the ending.
Bringing this from your back pages seems very appropriate to me... just watched the Ken Burns doc- this song would fit there and lose nothing to all the anthems of the day.

Robert

floyd

Excellent writing from a 20 year old (or anyone else for that matter).
Great arrangement to go with the lyrics.

Going back for another listen.

Peter

p.s along with the song Ray mentioned another Australian song referencing this issue was Khe Sanh by Cold Chisel.
Khe Sanh

Love this song Floyd. Was a very different time back then. Excellent vocal and back track. Your lyrics were powerful. As always you put together a polished professional level song. Thanks for sharing...

Thanks, beatmaster. The tracks are all RealTracks. No loops, no additional guitars (though I use both on occasion).

IF I have a tape of this it would be 40 years old - and is buried in a box somewhere. I have a certain number of old lyrics that continue to get copied over to my latest computer (though I don't change that often, either). That is where I found this lyric to re-visit...





Thanks for listening, Mario. Sorry for your loss...

Caaron - Thanks for that. Indeed, we should all thank those who served...

Well, for me, I get it. Three years in Viet Nam back to back.

Thanks for posting this song. Even all these years later, a song like this brings back the reality of that time and place.

Songwriting and music is an effective time machine.

Some really unpleasant stuff happens in any war but the Viet Nam war still rages on in the minds of quite a few of us who are still alive to remember.

There are no winners in war, only survivors.

Thanks again,

Billy

I was 20 in 1966 - with a college deferment, and one for grad school later and then afterwards I drew a very "safe" number in the draft lottery. My best friend had already been killed in Cambodia. This song reminds me of my many conflicts of the time. Some wanted to go and went. Others didn't want to go but had no choice. Others had deferments. It seemed then and now so unfair to the extent that I harbored guilt over my deferments. Growing up with many family members who served from WWII to Vietnam I will always honor their's and all veterans' service.

Pardon this...I know it's not about me but this song is so very powerful and it elicited those emotions. And isn't that the hallmark of a great song? And this is indeed such a song with all of the fj stamps of goodness.

Tom so well stated the feelings of the time. I can't add to that.

Thanks for sharing this.

Bud (Janice was 9 in 1966 )

Well, if Floyd did it, it's worth a listen :-)

Sad episode ... you're probably right, though. Most people did not feel that way about our soldiers. Just a very, very vocal minority, stirred up by political agitators and re-enforced by news anchors misrepresenting what the majority of our soldiers were like. When the talking heads say things every night, people get the idea that's what everybody thinks, and there's a natural peer pressure to buy into it. Sucks. And pisses me off, too.

Good song.

Clifton - I appreciate you saying that. Thanks for "breaking the ice" - otherwise this would never have seen the light of day...

To Buds comment

"It seemed then and now so unfair to the extent that I harbored guilt over my deferments."

Some of us stayed for several tours just so others did not have to go. We were happy to do that.

I am very glad you did not have to go there. We needed good people like you at home just as much as we needed people there.

Thanks,

Billy

fj,


I hesitate to comment because it will require you to bump the thread to get your 15 minutes of fame, but here goes.

I like the song. A dark period in our history for sure. Well done.



Regards,

Lefty

Noel,

I am pleased that this resonated with you. You always "get" the finer points of both the writing and the production. Thanks for such a fine review...

I'm surprised that no one has fathomed a guess at what that last chord is...

Hmmm.....that sounds like a challenge.

Since we just moved my axes are not handy....so....unless I missed it somewhere what KEY are you in?

Back to topic....

Nice write, glad it found the light of day. As Noel said, the "parallel narrative" is really effective.

I was wondering how long you'd hold off on the drums.

Like some others, I'd have bet you added custom guitars to the track. I keep underestimating what this program (and users) is capable of.

You can pat your 20 year old self on the back.

The power of this great ballad still echo's through the generations. Great write Floyd.Rob

Floyd,

Inviting acoustic right off the bat—makes me want to hear more, and the great vocal also keeps me listening. Some awesome lines lyrically, but overall to me this is missing a hook or shift somewhere in the tune to keep it fresh on the ear—I wish I was wiser musically to better express what I mean. To me, this is so close to going from really good to something special. As it stands, a well done song.

Best regards,

Deej

Dave - thanks for such a fine review... thanks for mentioning the last chord... a "good ending" can often be one of the little things that keep a song in your head for a little longer. I was hoping that would do that...




ray - I had not heard that before (I Was Only 19 ) - thanks for the link. It is heavier and more dramatic that this! Wow. I enjoyed hearing yours, too. Nice driving rhythm from the guitars. And Terry' flute is really nice... Thanks for stopping by...

Thanks for having a listen, Marty...




Tom - thanks for such a fine review. I've been working more on the sound/processing of the acoustic guitars to get them to "sit just right" - to cut through the mix, crisp and clear, and still be "subtle". I, too, was in my teens and early twenties then. It was dramatic times.

Hello, floyd

It is the first time for me to listen to the song of this genre from you.
Your rock songs are wonderful, but also this song is nice.
I thought that it expressed a sad story probably shared by all Americans very well.
I was deeply impressed.

Best regards.

Shigeki Adachi

Wayne - I really appreciate you giving me your reaction to this prior to posting. It was important that this be "okay" for those who were actually there. I know that we cannot possible know - or even come close to imagining - what that was like. Trying to do so, boggles the mind, breaks my heart and brings a lump in my throat and a tear to the eye...

Thanks for your opinion.

Thanks for your service.


(from your other post - the song is in the key of C - I think... it repeats Am G F G for every line throughout the song. I have always thought that was C, but it might be Am. I don't know enough theory to say definitively).

Hi floyd jane,

This song has good story. Got a nice feel and moves nicely along. Make's ya realize how good North America has it. Thanks for sharing.

Your quite welcome Floyd....
You didn't have to inquire with me so I thank you for your courtesy (even though it was not necessary) and your kind words.

Ha...oh...it's "mind boggling"...that's for damn sure.

Truthfully, there isn't a day that goes by that I don't have images of that part of my life and reminded of how profound the experience was at 18 years old and how it formed who I am today.
(After 13 months in country I rotated back to CONUS and was still 19 years old.)

I have (3) songs I wrote about that experience but have been done for many years and are not BIAB creations. (Just Do It on my s/c page and Toy Guns not uploaded yet and the third one is not uploaded yet)

Ok....back to topic....thanks again.

(That last chord wouldn't be a Badd9...would it?)

A very moving and beautifully written song Floyd. It has a superb keening melody that fits the subject matter spot on. It gripped me to the end. That closing unresolved chord was so right - a question left hanging.

I was 18 in 1966 and remember here in the UK there was footage every night on the TV news, often more graphic than is allowed these days. For some strange reason it's common for brave people in the forces to be neglected on their return, as if forgetting them will somehow make forgetting the whole thing easier. We have a shameful record here of not doing more for the maimed who returned from Afghanistan, another unpopular campaign.

John

Well Floyd,

I made it back alive in one piece.

Well almost..




I think this song is very powerful as all your songs are, and it was a great experience to take a peek inside the head of the young songwriter, and imagining you with your trusty old Yamaha when she was young, howling at the moon.

Great stuff man.

Great sad song, Floyd

the song is excellent as usual. I like the rock guitar in background.

The subject of the song is a very important subject.
Every war has many impopular heroes.

But they will be heroes FOREVER, and they are the heroes not the others.

I would to extend the lyrics of your song, to the young American soldiers
that hardly fought in Italy during II WWar.

Thanks from an Italian man to you (now after about 60 years) for all these young soldiers surely forever heroes.

Sergio

Appreciate that, Robert...




Peter - Thanks. Seems like y'all had more of those than we did!...



Thanks for listening, Scott...

Floyd

Powerful stuff. I too lost friends in that war. This really captures the unresolved nature of the entire experience.

Perfectly produced to let the story be told. Excellent all the way.

Keep em coming,
Bob

Floyd,

From someone that served in the military, during that era, a sincere thank you. You captured the emotion that swirls within some of us very well.

Thanks Billy. I honor your service. And, again, thanks to fj for posting this song.

Bud

I was spat upon in the New York airport while in uniform circa 1969.

You've captured the moment, FJ. Kudos.

Billy - thanks for the listen... but, more importantly, thanks for your service. As I said to Wayne - I don't think we can even come close to imagining...

It has been good to hear everyone's story from that period of our history - from each perspective... thanks for giving me a first read on this, too...




Thanks for having a listen, Phil...




Again, we thank you, Billy...





Bob - thanks for stopping by for a listen....

Thanks, David. The collection of available guitar tracks - both acoustic and electric - has gotten better with each release. BIAB 2018 added a bunch of really nice ones. It makes "finding what you hear in your head" easier all the time. I hope it will continue into the future releases... I've found some nice ways to process the stereo acoustic RTs to get just what I've been looking for for a long time...





Thanks, Rob - appreciate that...





Thanks for the listen, Deej - and the thoughtful ideas... Since this was written 40 years ago, it reflects a particular period in time - and a style of writing/music that was prevalent at the time. I saw no reason to try to "modernize" this. In fact, I think that might reduce its impact (but I could be wrong)...

Shigeki Adachi - If I can "deeply impress" you, that is a feather in my cap... thanks..





LPman - thanks for having a listen...





Wayne - thanks for stopping by again - that last chord is Fm(maj7)...

Floyd,

Hands down, this is my favorite vocal performance of yours! There is a sincerity in the vocal that is undeniable! This is pretty good writing from such a young lad in my opinion! Glad you brought it back to life here! Thanks, Torrey

Thanks for your thoughts, John. Those were defining times in our history - often the emotions involved are aimed at the wrong people... those guys coming home were 18, too - and had been through a hell not of their own choosing. And as you say, it continues today... let's hope we are not headed towards worse....





Thanks, David. Thanks to you and Cliff for breaking the ice that allowed this to resurface...





Sergio - good of you to bring up how your country sees these things, too...

WOW!! One thing is clear from this....some people are just born writers! A lot of great stuff here for a 20-year-old mind, but then we're not talking about just any 20-year-old. FJ has obviously had the knack for a long, long time. I remember this era, and am just a few years behind Floyd. It was turbulent, intense, and fascinating. I feel very lucky to have grown up when I did. A lot of great music came out of it, but there was a lot of conflict, and a lot of misery, particularly for Viet Nam vets. Thanks for bringing this one back for us Floyd! Take care. Greg

Thanks, Bob. Glad you stopped in for a listen. Sorry to hear of your friends...




Jim - thanks for having a listen and affirming the message. And Thanks for your service...





Don - It is good for us to continue to hear these stories - we should never stop remembering and learning from the past... Thank you for your service, too...

Thanks, Torrey. I did have over 40 years to practice that vocal...




Thanks for that, Greg... We did grow up in interesting times...



Thanks to everyone for the reception that this song has gotten. It has been a rewarding experience. Thanks to all who have shared their story - especially those who served...

Thank you.

Hi Floyd,

This song demonstrates your songwriter's integrity and involvement.
Although I was too young at the time to remember, I've seen lots of documentaries and movies about Vietnam.
I can only imagine the impact this must have had on the soldiers returning home, being judged by others (who stayed at home).

Another Pro song in a long list of cool songs.

Rob