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Has anyone used BIAB and made a professional sounding demo that they used to pitch to publishers?
I'd be interesting in hearing the devil and to see if you actually got a record deal from it.
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You asked two questions there... are you asking about publishers or record companies?
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As Roger pointed out, you did ask two questions.
To the first one, yes. I have used BB directly for a couple of tunes that were sent to publishers, signed, and used in film and TV shows "as is" with no re-recording. So it's certainly good enough for that.
Regarding the second question... I have yet to get a record deal on any of my songs nor have I had any of my songs signed into a record deal to be recorded by an artist. The question is.... does BB have the sound quality in it's real tracks to actually be used by a major label for their artist's without calling in the big name studio players for a live session? This is only my opinion..... but I think, probably not. While it is really outstanding, amazing, saves a lot of time, and it sounds good, however, to the trained ear, it's not the real thing. There's a clarity with live players that simply doesn't exist "yet" in the real tracks. It's close, and it will convince a lot of people that it's a real band.... (hence the name), but it's still less than 100%. But not by much. I've had some very talented studio folks ask about the players in my band because it did sound realistic enough to fool them.
EDIT: If you listen to any number of folks in the Showcase, you can hear songs that are definitely what I call professional quality and could easily fit right in to a given radio station play list.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 03/30/23 01:09 PM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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There are pro writers (some with with numerous hits) who use BIAB every day for demos.
If they want to raise their hands and say so I will let them do so of their own accord. They may even be on this forum. Ya never know who is on here people.....Just sayin'...So mind your manners.
But the answer is yes.
Professional people use it all the time for demos, and I also think the quality of any album you could make with it would be (to me) about 1000 times higher than the current list of top 100 hits on Spotify, hands down, if that helps.
That ain't nothing but loops. If you can find a real instrument anywhere I would love to know.
If Real Tracks are only 90 percent real that is still more real than 99.9999999 percent of the junk out there now.
If you want to go totally pro, just log in to Bandlab loops and grab yourself some phat dope stems and then you'll really be keepin' it real.
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To echo David's post, and elaborate on my own (I was in a hurry when I replied), BIAB is absolutely used for demo purposes. That was actually my entire reason for getting it in the first place, and I've found it to be an excellent tool. I have a number of peers who have done likewise.
I'm probably old school in this thinking, but I still believe that a great demo can't mask an average (or worse) song. One of my favorite Nashville cliches is "when you polish a turd, all you get is a polished turd". A great demo (like you can get using BIAB) is a wonderful thing to have when pitching your songs, either to publishers or artists, but it's still going to be all about how good or great the song is in the first place.
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Thanks for popping in Roger! Well, there you have it. Anyone can feel free to google Roger's creds and attach them to the question. So I guess the answer is: Get BIAB. Learn how to use it. Write some great songs. Is there anything else left to be said among the people who purchased BIAB as part of their SONGWRITING LIFE?? 
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If you want to go totally pro, just log in to Bandlab loops and grab yourself some phat dope stems and then you'll really be keepin' it real. David, I've picked up some very nice pedal steel guitar, slide guitar and Telecaster chickin' pickin' loops from Bandlab. It's all in using the search feature. There are some gems available for free but you have to hunt for them.
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Maybe not directly on topic but we've had 26 songs licensed that were all done using RT's and RD's.
Several were licensed by Mood Media and they are the world's largest provider of overhead music in 100+ countries. We also have five songs on Songtrader's small curated playlists they use to introduce clients to their catalog.
I'm not trying to be braggadocio but only suggesting that those folks must consider PG Musics tracks to be at a pro level.
FWIW,
Bud
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Thanks everyone for your wonderful replies, and info. I'd like to hear some of your demos that got picked up. I have been working on demos and cant seem to get them sounding pro enough. I am wondering if I am too critical of my work or I need to learn more recording techniques, or upgrade my DAW systems.
THANKS
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Thanks everyone for your wonderful replies, and info. I'd like to hear some of your demos that got picked up. I have been working on demos and cant seem to get them sounding pro enough. I am wondering if I am too critical of my work or I need to learn more recording techniques, or upgrade my DAW systems.
THANKS Most of our songs via Sontradr that have been licensed were all produced since we joined ST in 2017. So anything on our SC account for the last five years or so would include many of those and all would be hopefully the same "quality." Recently we have had about 20 songs added to some significant Spotify curators playlist. Again, we don't think of our selves in our desktop home "studio" as pros -- only that our output is considered by some (other than family and friends ) to be at a high enough level for acceptance. I really don't think of them as demos. They are what they are. They are done for nothing but fun! Bud
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As Roger pointed out, you did ask two questions.
Regarding the second question... I have yet to get a record deal on any of my songs nor have I had any of my songs signed into a record deal to be recorded by an artist. The question is.... does BB have the sound quality in it's real tracks to actually be used by a major label for their artist's without calling in the big name studio players for a live session? This is only my opinion..... but I think, probably not. While it is really outstanding, amazing, saves a lot of time, and it sounds good, however, to the trained ear, it's not the real thing. There's a clarity with live players that simply doesn't exist "yet" in the real tracks. It's close, and it will convince a lot of people that it's a real band.... (hence the name), but it's still less than 100%. But not by much. I've had some very talented studio folks ask about the players in my band because it did sound realistic enough to fool them.
+1
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So, what is the difference between a publisher and a distributor?
I thought they are the same. I assume you don't need to make a demo. You can just make a completed song, upload to a distributor, it will be published on all platforms, done.
Also, is Songtradr anything special? Is it better than other mainstream distributors such as CD Baby, DistroKid, TuneCore, etc?
A Canadian music producer, singer songwriter, composer, and professional guitarist.
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So, what is the difference between a publisher and a distributor?
I thought they are the same. I assume you don't need to make a demo. You can just make a completed song, upload to a distributor, it will be published on all platforms, done.
Also, is Songtradr anything special? Is it better than other mainstream distributors such as CD Baby, DistroKid, TuneCore, etc?
Songtradr is a sync library. They license songs for customers including the big film/commercial companies to indie producers and more. They offer distribution but that’s only a side feature for members. You upload your songs to them and if a customer wants to license it ST handles All the business end for a relatively small percentage and collects royalties. They are one of many sync libraries but unlike the others they will accept all of your uploads. Most libraries approve the song before making it available to customers. There is a ton of info on the net about sync libraries. Bud
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So, what is the difference between a publisher and a distributor?
I thought they are the same. I assume you don't need to make a demo. You can just make a completed song, upload to a distributor, it will be published on all platforms, done.
Also, is Songtradr anything special? Is it better than other mainstream distributors such as CD Baby, DistroKid, TuneCore, etc?
Songtradr is a sync library. They license songs for customers including the big film/commercial companies to indie producers and more. They offer distribution but that’s only a side feature for members. You upload your songs to them and if a customer wants to license it ST handles All the business end for a relatively small percentage and collects royalties. They are one of many sync libraries but unlike the others they will accept all of your uploads. Most libraries approve the song before making it available to customers. There is a ton of info on the net about sync libraries. Bud This is true. They're basically like a huge store where people looking for music can go and browse for something that fits what they are looking for. The better quality libraries and publishers are very selective. As a result they are more familiar with the music and artists in their libraries and when the customer comes to them with a requirement, they are in a position to recommend a number of songs that would fit. Some of those will also forward the listing to their writers for the purpose of getting newly written music for the customer. These libraries are very good to work with but are extremely difficult to get into. All of the better libraries are very high bar.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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So, what is the difference between a publisher and a distributor?
I thought they are the same. I assume you don't need to make a demo. You can just make a completed song, upload to a distributor, it will be published on all platforms, done.
Also, is Songtradr anything special? Is it better than other mainstream distributors such as CD Baby, DistroKid, TuneCore, etc?
Songtradr is a sync library. They license songs for customers including the big film/commercial companies to indie producers and more. They offer distribution but that’s only a side feature for members. You upload your songs to them and if a customer wants to license it ST handles All the business end for a relatively small percentage and collects royalties. They are one of many sync libraries but unlike the others they will accept all of your uploads. Most libraries approve the song before making it available to customers. There is a ton of info on the net about sync libraries. Bud This is true. They're basically like a huge store where people looking for music can go and browse for something that fits what they are looking for. The better quality libraries and publishers are very selective. As a result they are more familiar with the music and artists in their libraries and when the customer comes to them with a requirement, they are in a position to recommend a number of songs that would fit. Some of those will also forward the listing to their writers for the purpose of getting newly written music for the customer. These libraries are very good to work with but are extremely difficult to get into. All of the better libraries are very high bar. So, can you do a triple dipping? You first upload your song to a distributor like DistroKid, then you upload the same WAV to a sync library like Songtradr, and finally you upload that WAV to a PRO like ASCAP. In this case, you can collect royalties from three separate sources. Are you allowed to do that? Is there gonna be a copyright conflict between a regular publisher and a sync library?
A Canadian music producer, singer songwriter, composer, and professional guitarist.
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Hi, Elliot, I listened to your demos. They are certainly done well enough for someone to make a buying decision. Roger Brown is a pretty well-known songwriter and anything he says is more than a little credible. A lot of good stuff has a Texas connection...lol Just saying! It is funny how things keep coming up on this site that remind me of my past. There was this friend of mine Eric Taylor who married Nanci Griffith, and we all use to hang out and play at Anderson Fair in Houston, Texas. Perhaps Roger could tell us a little about how "I Knew Love" came about. I Knew Love https://youtu.be/uP5kO2eR4s0Billy
Last edited by Planobilly; 04/15/23 05:45 PM.
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You first upload your song to a distributor like DistroKid, then you upload the same WAV to a sync library like Songtradr, and finally you upload that WAV to a PRO like ASCAP.
In this case, you can collect royalties from three separate sources.
Are you allowed to do that? Is there gonna be a copyright conflict between a regular publisher and a sync library?
Triple dipping? Yes. Join ASCAP? Not if your profile is correct and you live in Canada. Go to this page and start reading till you understand a few things. Pay attention to SOCAN. You have a lot of reading to do. Canada Collective Rights Societies
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Triple dipping? Yes. Join ASCAP? Not if your profile is correct and you live in Canada.
Go to this page and start reading till you understand a few things. Pay attention to SOCAN. You have a lot of reading to do. To be honest, I'm a Canadian, but I don't want to join SOCAN. To me, SOCAN is like a Blackberry, while ASCAP and BMI are like iPhones. The American stuff is always better than the Canadian counterparts. I know in order to join ASCAP, you need to provide your US social security number, or tax forms, which I don't have. I'm currently doing some research on BMI, as they may have different policies for Canadians to join. ASCAP has two types of membership: Individual and Publisher. Although Individual type won't accept me, I still have a chance. I own a small Canadian corporation, I think I can try to join ASCAP through that corporation as a Publisher member. I love my country, but unless both ASCAP and BMI refuse to accept Canadians, I wouldn't even consider SOCAN.
A Canadian music producer, singer songwriter, composer, and professional guitarist.
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As a Canadian living in Canada, you can select ASCAP or BMI to handle your USA performance rights — after you join SOCAN.
Go back to that page and keep reading till you understand your rights and options. I’ve ignored most of your comments on these issues because a) you know so little about them and b) a lot of what I’ve posted doesn’t apply to you.
Read and learn. For everyone’s sake but mostly for your own, please do this.
BIAB 2023 Audiophile, 24/60 Core M2 Mac Studio Ultra/8TB/192GB Sonoma, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
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So, can you do a triple dipping?
You first upload your song to a distributor like DistroKid, then you upload the same WAV to a sync library like Songtradr, and finally you upload that WAV to a PRO like ASCAP.
In this case, you can collect royalties from three separate sources.
Are you allowed to do that? Is there gonna be a copyright conflict between a regular publisher and a sync library? No. You don't triple or double dip. Your pro only collects income. They don't distribute or publish. You can upload a song but it's only for registration. Your publisher should do that on your behalf and if you are in a non exclusive library you can have one song with multiple registrations but each is tagged uniquely to a given publisher. Whoever is responsible for publishing a song in a specific place is responsible for the royalty to the pro. Streaming services pay for streams on their platforms. So no. You're only getting paid from the one publishing company that got the song in the cut. You can have one song producing multiple revenue streams but none of those are stacked. I hope I explained that clearly enough.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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