PG Music Home Forums PG Music Product Forums Band-in-a-Box for Windows Notation Problems

I have previously posted some of the matters raised here in the previous topic www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=457611#Post457611 but I think they deserve a topic of their own, particularly because of that previous topic heading, which was a bit unspecific.

Each year I have to learn new things about using Band-in-a-Box, but I think the present problems I am experiencing may be a bit of a bug, or possibly wrong assumptions in setting the objectives for programming. It could also be that my learning curve has not caught up and there are some solutions of which I am unaware. If so, I would be very pleased to hear these.

First, I should explain that I use Band-in-a-Box for accompaniment when practicing, which as I understand was the main original use for the program. But of equal importance these days is the task of producing leadsheets for the musicians in my small jazz bands, and for producing the parts for small band arrangements. Traditionally Band-in-a-Box has been an excellent tool for these purposes and most of the users that I know use it for the same thing. In fact, you cannot be in our bands if you do not have a copy of Band-in-a-Box for swapping files and rehearsing parts with the great backing bands. Marketing please note, because these days most small jazz and dance bands use some kind of software for their band members to use for practicing their parts. I also know several arrangers who use Band-in-a-Box to work up the initial pro-formers for big band arrangements – me included.

Aside from what Matt recently described as 'clunky', when referring to Band-in-a-Box notation, my observation is that some of the problems with notation seem to have been caused by the programming for Bar-Based Lyrics, starting with the 2017 version and now continuing with 2018. I appreciate that Bar-Based Lyrics are important for some users. I do notice that 2018 has cleared up a bit of a problem with the old Line-Based lyrics. I have hundreds of tune files with this type of lyric formatting, and previously there was no way of completely deleting them. But once they have been Automatically converted to Bar-Based Lyrics, the “Erase Bar-Bar Lyrics” will now do this. It would not last year, despite my complaints, so thank you for this! However, I have to say that it is a shame that Line-Based Lyrics were abandoned. There were definitely some advantages over Note-Based Lyrics that have been lost in the change that was made back in 2017. I wish they were still in existence because they may help to eliminate the problem that Trygve "Leo" Larsen is presently experiencing.
For me there have been many faults in the all Band-in-a-Box versions, particularly for Note-Based lyrics, ever since bar-based lyrics were introduced. These days I have to get the white-out and ink pen working before I can produce a clean leadsheet to distribute to band members. Thus, I need heaps of extra filing space on my computer for the PDFs of the corrected versions I have scanned.

The problem of the last words of a stave being carried down to the bar starting the next stave below for me is extreme. I am not entirely sure my problem is exactly the same as Leo’s. In my occurrence it does of course depend on how many words of the lyric are in the last bar that was carried down. It also depends on the type and size of the font you use for your lyrics. I normally want more than a 100% for the lyrics font. I find I have to use mostly PG Text at 120% to make it readable on the music stand. It was much better when we had line-based lyrics because you could space the lyrics along the line to suit.

I was very encouraged when Oliver Gannon started to clean up the whole of the notation area the year before bar-based lyrics were introduced. Unfortunately the process did not continue.

I believe some considerable programming effort needs to be put into the whole area of notation and creating proper readable lead sheets that have chords and lyrics shown. The ideal situation, which is used by most fake books, is four bars per line, and nine lines on a page. Of course the chords have to be accommodated as well as the lyrics, along with any Section Text, Section Letters and Notation Symbols also. And please have a thought for us trombone types who need their lead sheets in Bass Clef, where we commonly need at least four ledger lines for the trombone upper range. There are more problems with the notation in Bass Clef than in Treble Clef and I think this is due to this unawareness of the range.

And please make the basics in the lead sheets produced using the 'Print' button the same as those using the Green button for 'LeadSheet Window'. There are several annoying differences at present that are not related to the purpose of each method.

Please also give some thought to properly showing triplets for Even time, without having to tick the 'Triplet Resolution (Swing)' box.

The ability to produce really good Leadsheets with Band-in-a-Box used to be one of its best features. And it was getting better every year, until you know what.

As I previously mentioned, this is ultra-important for those using Band-in-a-Box leadsheets for band practice purposes. And I am also told bY some teachers I know, the idiosyncrasies are even more of a problem for those in the education world, particularly for the kids!

Very thorough report, Graham.

I said clunky? While I don’t dispute I said that, I have been working the other side of this: exporting BIAB files by MIDI or now Music XML to dedicated notation programs. I don’t use BIAB for notation, so don’t take anything I may have said about it seriously.

You have told us for many years how useful BIAB is for you to produce parts for your band, and I defer to your experience pursuing worthwhile improvements.

Notation, notation, notation. I've been commenting on the need for what seems to be fairly small enhancements for at least 10 years. I finally gave up a few years ago.

To me, Biab/RB notation is sooo close to being good for live band charting but not quite. I too make good use of whiteout or hand markings. Most of the time my issue is with repeats and 1st/2nd endings. I gave up making them readable within Biab, what I do now is simply lay out a tune based on how the chart should look but without any of those things. That means it will not play correctly. Then I print it and hand draw them in. To help visualize this just take any typical fake book chart and remove everything but the bars and chords. No repeat signs, no section letters, no 2nd ending, no tag or coda sign, nothing. That's what I load into Biab, just the chords in the order they show on the chart.

And yes, maybe Matt didn't say it but clunky is the word.

Bob

Bob, you will enjoy the irony here: Dorico, the new notation software that is among the most expensive, has deficiencies in endings and codas. I waited to try it because the first release didn’t even have chord symbols.

Still, at their pace, fairly soon it may be the best choice out there.