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Steve,

How do you find the glossy monitor? That's one thing that concerns me a bit. It looks really nice, but I'm not sure about glare.

-Larry

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LT,
I had assumed you were considering a MacPro instead of an iMac. So, my question is this. What audio interface are you going to use? Can you configure the iMac with two hard drives, especially if you're going to be doing a lot of audio data. A single hard drive with two partitions doesn't really work if you have lots of audio tracks, because your system uses it, and it gets used to write and read audio. You should have a dedicated drive for audio and a dedicated drive for the system.

WIth an iMac, it appears that you can only use USB or Firewire, instead of a PCI or PCI-e audio card. What were you planning on using?

Gary


I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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LT at this point, you should hang out at the Biab for Mac forum to get a different perspective. I just checked, didn't see you in there.

Bob


Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Quote:

LT,
I had assumed you were considering a MacPro instead of an iMac. So, my question is this. What audio interface are you going to use? Can you configure the iMac with two hard drives, especially if you're going to be doing a lot of audio data. A single hard drive with two partitions doesn't really work if you have lots of audio tracks, because your system uses it, and it gets used to write and read audio. You should have a dedicated drive for audio and a dedicated drive for the system.

WIth an iMac, it appears that you can only use USB or Firewire, instead of a PCI or PCI-e audio card. What were you planning on using?

Gary




Gary, I'm not sure if you can have two hard drives in an iMac. I suspect not, but I don't really anticipate doing a lot of audio tracks. I bought my current system expecting that I would be doing a lot more recording and it turns out I didn't. When I tried to do some simple couple track recordings with BIAB or a midi file as a backup track, sometimes it worked, but more often than not the computer would start sputtering and mess things up. (that is using separate hard drives for the system files and for data/tracking -- however, I was just using my soundblaster card and who knows what other things on the system might be slowing it down. I can't say I spent a lot of time troubleshooting).

I have tended to simply use BIAB, and for fairly basic things -- as a backup band for practice and to put together some lead sheets. But who knows whether I may get motivated to do more recording/mixing in the future, especially if things actually work without frustration. So the hard drive issue is something to keep in mind. The MacPro looks great, but boy are they pricey. For what I tend to use the computer for, I think the MacPro might be overkill.

As far as an audio card, I haven't gotten that far yet. The options are open, so a firewire or USB card would be fine with me.
I'm sure I could find something that would suit.

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Quote:

LT at this point, you should hang out at the Biab for Mac forum to get a different perspective. I just checked, didn't see you in there.

Bob




Will do -- thanks.

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Well, Firewire, IMHO, is something you should stay away from. I don't like it, and I don't think it's a good choice, but there are those who use it, and will disagree with me.

That's my two cents, for what it's worth.

Gary


I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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gary.
no probs mate.
all the best to you.

LT
i would sincerely suggest before spending any money at all you
try out a mac n run tests with music software and do the same with a powerfull i7 system.
for me i would have the latter. seriously mate i would talk to lots of people
with i7's before makeing a decision.
particularly watch carefully how quikly apps start up on an i7.
(assuming its configged properly.)
actually let me ask you a question.
in any song of yours whats the max no of traks you would have and max no
of synth and effects plug ins. ??
any real time synths that are heavy on resources ??
if not...here quad core amd 620 systems are 560 buks.
not an i7 in power, ..but might tide you over for a few years
till 8 and 16 cores get affordeable.


retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
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LT,

About the glare issue, I will have to admit that if you have a lot of lights or bright areas behind you there is quite a bit of glare. I just position the screen where that doesn't happen.


Manning,

Sorry for not responding earlier. (i suspect you'll get red spikes.) That is exactly what I got. When i got the red spikes it would glitch and i would have to start over. Also it did have separate drives (I have now sold it). I used one to load the programs and the other to store the data.

I apologize if i have missed anymore questions to respond to. You guys have put out a lot of information for LT to think about. If I would have known some of the things that y'all have put in this thread I would have probably kept my HP laptop and saved myself some money.

Thanks guys, This is an outstanding forum with outstanding people who really care about others.

Steve


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We have an iMac, MacBook Pro, a Windows laptop and a Windows desktop (all for business-use). So I have experience with both PC and Mac. For both the platforms there are pros and cons. Here are some that come to mind:

Windows based system pros:
-Relative cheap to purchase
-familiar lay-out to most people

Windows based system cons:
-System clutters up in time, making the system slow
-Windows uses a up lot of resources
-System needs constant maintenance to assure smooth operation
-Upgrade from one Windows version to the newest version is expensive

Mac system pros:
-a Mac WORKS, no need for constant maintenance
-installation of printers and other devices are super easy (yes, easier than Windows Plug and Pray)
-fantastic controls (mouse and touchpad) and intuitive lay-out
-cheap to upgrade from one OS to the next
-Windows can be run on a Mac
-great design

Mac system cons:
-Mac does not support Flash; certain web-content is not visible
-when connecting to a Windows Exchange server for webmail you are limited to use the light version
-Initial purchase is more expensive than a PC

Take into consideration the licenses for Windows-based software you may have. If you cannot migrate them to the Mac, you may have to buy new licenses. On the other hand: a Mac already comes with iLive, and iWorks is pretty inexpensive...

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@Garry: On a Mac you can use USB, so USB-audio interfaces are always a good option. On iMacs, Mac Pro's and MacBook Pro you can go for FireWire (IEEE1394) which works fabulous for audio-interfaces.

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Mike,
I know the interfaces are there. My displeasure with the firewire interface is just that, with the interface, in that it was designed for moving massive amounts of data, such as hard drives and such, and not really for the timing critical application that music needs. Macs, PCs, in that case, it doesn't matter.

Gary


I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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LT,
Then this came across my desktop this morning, so something else to consider in the purchase of a Mac. It used to be that you didn't worry about this kind of stuff, I guess now you do.

Quote:

Security Firm Discovers Spyware in Mac Software!

Brought to You By:
MacWorld


Intego, makers of security and privacy apps for the Mac, warned on Tuesday that some Mac software include a new piece of invasive spyware. Macworld has obtained a preliminary list of the applications with the spyware.

In a press release, Intego states that a number of apps and screen savers distributed through sites like MacUpdate, VersionTracker, and Softpedia are installing a little more software than users bargain for; Apple’s Mac OS X Downloads site also contained entries for some of the apps, though the download links appear to now be inactive. The spyware in question is called OSX/OpinionSpy and it’s a variant of Windows spyware that has existed since 2008.

As to the spyware’s invasive actions, it allegedly dupes users into handing over their admin passwords with a dialog claiming that it "market research" software will be installed to collect browsing and purchasing history. OSX/OpinionSpy then installs a process called “PremierOpinion” that runs as root. Intego says the spyware then opens an HTTP backdoor on port 8254, scans all accessible local and networked volumes, and injects code into Safari, Firefox, and iChat in memory (meaning it doesn’t alter the applications themselves). It also regularly transmits encrypted data to a variety of servers, which contains e-mail addresses, iChat message headers, and URLs—as well as potentially personal data like usernames, passwords, credit card numbers, bookmarks, and browsing history.

OSX/OpinionSpy can also upgrade itself automatically with no user intervention and relaunch itself via Mac OS X’s launchd, the system-wide process that manages a number of automated systems, background daemons, and launch processes. Furthermore, upon uninstalling the original program, OSX/OpinionSpy remains installed on your Mac.

So far, Intego has found OSX/OpinionSpy in one application—MishInc FLV To Mp3—and a number of screensavers (here's a MacUpdate example link) that are all made by 7art-screensavers:

* Secret Land ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Color Therapy Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* 7art Foliage Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Nature Harmony Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Fiesta Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Fractal Sun Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Full Moon Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Sky Flight Clock ScreenSaverv.2.8
* Sunny Bubbles Clock ScreenSaver v.2.9
* Everlasting Flowering Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Magic Forest Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Freezelight Clock ScreenSaver v.2.9
* Precious Stone Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Silver Snow Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Water Color Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Love Dance Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Galaxy Rhythm Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* 7art Eternal Love Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Fire Element Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Water Element Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Emerald Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Radiating Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Rocket Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Serenity Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Gravity Free Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Crystal Clock ScreenSaver v.2.6
* One World Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Sky Watch ScreenSaver v.2.8
* Lighthouse Clock ScreenSaver v.2.8

PremierOpinion, an “elite research community” that provides the namesake software, offers a privacy policy, a snippet of which is a bit alarming:

For certain commercial customers, we may provide individual-level information. We make this data available so that these customers may enhance their own understanding of Internet usage and online commercial trends. In all cases, we make commercially viable efforts to automatically filter confidential personally identifiable information such as UserID, password, credit card numbers, and account numbers from the data being provided.

While the policy also states that “customers” can opt out of the program at any time, it only offers uninstall instructions for Windows, not Mac OS X. It also explains that PremierOpinion gave OSX/OpinionSpy the ability to analyze, repair, or reinstall itself out of concerns over system stability, in case third-party software does more harm than good while attempting to remove it.

That said, Intego claims that as long as VirusBarrier X5 and X6 users update to the latest version of its threat filters, released May 31, 2010, its software should be able to remove OSX/OpinionSpy successfully.




Gary


I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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Quote:


Windows based system cons:
-System clutters up in time, making the system slow
-System needs constant maintenance to assure smooth operation

Mac system pros:
-a Mac WORKS, no need for constant maintenance
-installation of printers and other devices are super easy (yes, easier than Windows Plug and Pray)
-fantastic controls (mouse and touchpad) and intuitive lay-out
-great design





I know there are other issues to consider, but these are the things that really made me start thinking about a Mac. I realize the computer is just a tool, but most typical consumers (of which I consider myself one) want it to be fun to use also. The fewer headaches the better.

I admit that the Adobe/Mac issue and resulting lack of flash is a bit of a pain.

@Manning -- I don't intend to use many audio tracks. Probably not more than 3 or 4, tops. I also don't use tons of soft synths. The truth is music RECORDING is a small part of what I use the computer for. I hear you regarding checking out systems first. With my own inquiries and all of the good information from the friendly folks here, I will certainly be in a position to make an informed decision when I decide to make a purchase. In the end, I suspect it will be fine either way.

@Steve - Thanks for the information about the glare. I don't have lots of light behind my work space, but I do have windows in front of and to the left of where my computer is located. As I use the computer for some light photo editing and for working on documents, this could be something worth thinking more about.

@ Gary -- I figure it's only a matter of time before Macs have similar issues to PCs re: viruses, etc. I suspect the first big virus is going to be a real problem, because everyone assumes Macs don't have this issue and I doubt they will be ready for it.

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LT
crikey with those low needs a 600 buk amd 620 quad core pc
is way more than you need mate.
so i would look at that cos it will have enough oomph as your
needs change. test one out mate.
with money saved get a nice sound device and mic pre n mic etc
n some monitors. thats what i would do.


retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
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For Music Studio: 3 XP's.Pro series.
For Gigs, MP3's, BIAB, and Electronic Real Books & their MP3's: I Pod 15 Gig and I Pod Touch with 30 Gigs.
For biz and music Toshiba Portable Qosmio with XP.
For water anchor ala 17 Foot Osage Aluminum Canoel: Mac Plus
For poetry writing and early serious multi-tracking: Mac Powerbook *8* Megs of Ram really goes far boosting music composing!

Retired, gigging, goofing off in the sun and playin' with lots of toys.

If I only could afford a new Mac, I'd jump at the opportunity...even get a free I Pad Touch for free. (Education student or teacher offer)



Yamaha...Motif ES-8, Motif Rack, CS6X
Korg...Karma,Triton Classic, PA-80, M-1+
AkaiSampler-S5000, Roland.. X5080 Rack/G-1000 Arranger
Various Guitars/Basses Amps Pedals Rec.Equip.


Plus, BIAB 2015 and Sonar Platinum 2015 Upgrade from Cakewalk's Sonar X-3
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It is great to get a free I Pad Touch for ..... free!


Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2022, Realband, Harrison Mixbus 32c version 9.1324, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
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Hi again everyone --

So it's now been a few months and I've been continuing to use my old PC as I haven't had the time to fully consider the purchase of a new computer. Now I'm back in shopping mode and after looking at prices for similarly equipped systems, my needs, etc. I am leaning strongly toward buying another PC with WIndows 7. If I go that route, I was looking at another Dell or an HP. Assuming budget is not a large limiting factor (within reason), what type of configuration would you suggest? Does the old addage of "buy the most computer you can afford" still hold true or is that wisdom no longer appropriate?

So you don't have to go back and read all of the old messages I'll give you a quick summary of my useage again: My needs for BIAB and recording/editing are relatively basic. I would like a little room to grow (just in case), but I generally use BIAB more for practice and background tracks and only very occasionally do any recording. When I do record, it is typically only a couple of tracks or so. I have only been using my soundblaster card up until now.

I also use the computer for transcribing software, some digital photography editing (nothing too intensive), storage of photos and music that I stream wirelessly to my stereo, ripping CDs and sometimes converting DVDs for use on a netbook or iPod, typical office applications (Word and Excel), e-mail, internet ... I'm sure you get the idea.

Thanks again.

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Hi, LT -

I'd recommend getting the most processing power you can afford, but I think you'll find you'll do better by purchasing additional hard disk space and memory somewhere else (for example, NewEgg). Sometimes it's actually cheaper to buy it with the smallest hard drive they offer, and then save money on multiple larger, faster hard drives elsewhere. Likewise for the memory. You might find that you can get a system with 2GB (for example), and then find you save a bunch bringing it up to 4, 6, or 8 GB by buying elsewhere. I would shop for those other components at the same time as shopping for the computer, so you can keep track of what costs what where.

I usually create a little spreadsheet with the different components I'm looking for and then price it all over the place to find the best deal. A little research can save you a bunch of money.


John

Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD
Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA

BB2024/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK

http://www.sus4chord.com
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Thanks, John. What I have generally found is that places like Dell and HP sort of force you to get more memory, larger hard drive, etc. by not including the smaller drives/memory as options,if you configure a system with more processing power, but I'll check that out as a possibility.

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I've been using the same computer for the last 4 years and I don't have a problem with it. I've been known to run up to 12 tracks loaded with synths and plugins. Many of them are not pg softsynths. I run a drum synth called DR005, an old outdated synth. Then I use DX plugins and VST synths. I've recorded using ASIO4ALL since the only card I'm using now is a simple $30 soundblaster card.

This computer has 2 gigs of memory, 2.3 gighz processor, 1 100 gig PCI hard drive, one SATA 500 gig hard drive and 1 1 terrabyte ext drive.

I'm running windows xp sp3. I've got 3 different email accounts running. I have windows menu bars galore, half of which I don't use. The system is a 32 bit single processor type by AMD.

I've found that, when the system gets over loaded and starts stuttering, I just switch it over to ASIO to do my recording with. That also eliminates any sync offset my software produces.

One last thing you have to remember. To run a really great DAW you need to shut down a lot of background software. (TSR's) Also there are a lot of windows apps running that probably never get used. Best thing is to eliminate them altogether. Shut down any screen saver. Those are only good for eyecandy now as the new screens don't burn. There are web sites out there dedicated to setting a PC up as a DAW. Use google or bing and look 'em up.

Last but not least, don't think a MAC is always going to be a fast, smooth, running machine. Sooner or later it's gonna get bloated just like PC's do. Software for the MAC is gonna cost more and will probably do way less.

About BIAB for MAC. My understanding is Pgmusic just came out with the latest version for it with real instruments. But many of the features found on the PC version are not included for the MAC version.

Now one of my grandsons has a MAX and swears by it. He says that it's so fast. But I'll give it another year and he'll be griping about slow downs due to software and internet gloat. It's just part of the problem.

There is one thing to consider. Just because the MAC isn't troubled much with viruses doesn't mean they're not on the way. It's just a matter of time before the hack-heads come up with something to mess 'em up. Life just ain't no fun if these loose cannons can't come up with some kind of problems for MAC users too.

My 2½¢ worth of thought.


Russ
Anyday above ground is a good day

Computer is Hp Pavillion Vision
6 Ghz quad core AMD processor
8 Gig memory
1 TB hard drive
6 GB hard drive
Windows 7 Premium
Loose nut behind the keyboard laugh

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