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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Feb 2015
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I last used BIAB in 2000 and was impressed with how the internal Sound Blaster Live card (with the EMU chip),rendered audio. Especially the drums and strings. I cant seem to come close to the sound I rendered back then. (Now using BIAB 2013). Short of getting another old SB Live card, can someone recommend an external sound card for BIAB? Thanks
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Welcome to the forum. I would be surprised if your older SB card would install now, at least in Windows 8.1. There are certainly some great choices now for external sound cards. I happen to be using the Focusrite Scarlett units (two computers; one has a 18i8 and the other has a 6i6). They do the job well and sound great. Check the software that comes with different brands; you may make your decision more by that than by the hardware. Also make sure the unit has ASIO drivers.
Playback of audio is not all that critical; any sound card will do, even the relatively awful Realtec unit in a laptop. The main questions start when you want to record audio. What will you be doing? How many inputs?
As you know, in 2000 BIAB was all MIDI and you needed a software or hardware synth. Now, with RealTracks (which are audio), this is less critical. The newest versions of BIAB come with some VSTi software instruments. Tell us more about what's important to you, and we can make more recommendations if needed. By your comments, I'm guessing you may be using the default Microsoft sounds for MIDI, which are horrible. Tell us as much as you can about your system, especially whether or not you are using a software synth (VSTi or DXi). Also tell us what your Preferences, MIDI Driver, Output says.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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The SoundBlaster Live card used soundfonts to create its sounds. By default, it loaded with a 2MB soundfont, but it had a 4MB and an 8MB soundfont available. Most folks I know immediately substituted the 2MB for the 8MB, since it sounded that much better.
You might want to try using a soundfont enabled VSTi (such as SynthFont) and get a copy of the Creative SoundBlaster soundfonts, although there are other better non-Creative GM soundfonts I like better). Then see if maybe it renders closer to what you remember.
The issue isn't the version of BIAB you are using, it's the sound source you are using. The sound you are hearing is probably just the Microsoft WAVTable soundset, which will make sounds, but doesn't sound very good.
Around 2000, BIAB also implemented the VSC Sound Canvas, which may also be what you remember. The VSC doesn't work on 64-bit operating systems. So, alternately, you might just want to consider a completely new softsynth sound source. For example, there is the TTS-1 that comes with Cakewalk products - you could buy Cakewalk Music Creator ($39), another DAW, and get the TTS-1 along with it). It isn't exactly like the old Roland VSC, but it is very similar.
There is also the Coyote Forte DX ($40), which gives much better sounds than the default Windows soundset.
Both Music Creator and Coyote Forte are available from the PGMusic website store.
Just some thoughts.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2024/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Creative no longer advertises the inclusion of any built-in midi sound sources with any of their sound cards.
PC based gaming, not audio production, used to be the big reason for development of midi sound sources. Increased memory and storage space provides the room needed to replace midi files with audio files. Game designers use expensive external sound modules or VST instruments to create audio files instead of relying on built-in soundcard midi sound sources.
The most recent Creative soundcard I found with the built-in midi sounds is an Audigy 2 LE. The Creative website has a downloadable app that detects your pc operating system and creative device then automatically selects, or lets you manually select, the drivers and software that matches your system.
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Thank you for the good info. I'm currently using XP on a desktop with a Sound blaster Live 24 bit card. I'll look into what you have suggested.
john
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I am a huge fan of Ketron for the quality of their samples (especially acoustic instruments like saxes.) I have an SD4 which is a little large, but basically combines two SD2 modules. I can program in full chords that I trigger with my woodwind controller to simulate a horn section. PG used to sell the SD2 but they can still be found on eBay for $200 or so.
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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One of the pieces of kit in my arsenal is a Ketron SD2. Like Phillyjazz mentioned, it has some reasonable sounds - but, you must remember that it is MIDI, it's not a sound card.
Best
Trevor
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I see that Ketron just released an updated successor to the SD2 - The SD1000 - Retails for about $450 (I never see them discounted.) Amazon is sold out. You can check it out here. Apparently the sounds have been updated, and it stores loops and MIDI sequences. I still like the SD4 as it can stand alone (and has actual buttons to change patches.) On the other hand, I'd probably never do anything without my Surface Pro 3, so it's not as big a deal as it used to be. http://www.ajamsonic.com/ajsd1000.html
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
32GB DDR4
Win 10 64-bit
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MOTO 2
Ketron SD4,SD1000
Yamaha RX-v381amp
VB-Audio virtual cables
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Several of us on here use Focusrite. They offer both USB and Firewire external interfaces. Firewire probably has a speed advantage but I haven't had a problem on my USB interface. FOCUSRITE InterfacesThe benefit of these devices is that they have good preamps and the drivers work well in most all applications.
 Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I notice that the lower end Focusrite models don't have midi ports. What's the preferred way to accommodate those with an older external midi controller that doesn't have usb? I see there are midi to USB adapters. Are there sync issues when using them with an external USB audio interface?
-Ron
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I used to use one of these before I got the Focusrite. It never had a problem working with my old soundcard. M-Audio Midisport-1x1 USB MIDI InterfaceThe Focusrite 6i6 that I have has midi and it's not terribly more priced than the lower models.
Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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JBarb, as you can see from these replies, "external sound card" can mean a lot of things. I think before we comment further, we would need to hear more from you about what you are looking for.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Are you looking for better GM sound set (VST, Soundfont, etc) or an actual external sound card? Most of the suggestions deal with the former. I'm running W8.1 and switch between the VSC (which I actually prefer) and the TTS-1 for sound sources for generic GM2 playback. The VSC is discontinued and no longer installable or supported on x64 as noted, but offers SC88 sound sets and there are some work arounds for it. Spending ~$300 on a SampleTank just to do GM/GS stuff is not wise. Both work for just simple audition/midi rec/play needs.
Now, if you're actually asking about an external sound card (ie. digital to audio interface, for both inputs and outputs), then that's a different question entirely. For those using mostly Real and/or User Tracks, that is an important distinction.
For the second option, I use a UA4-FX which is a USB device with a raft of I/O options and even pretty nice (and easy to use) effects. It doesn't have 'fancy' mic preamp stuff, but records from line and XLR inputs (quite nicely thank you) upto 24b/96Khz as needed. I seldom even venture into video (24b/48K) myself however since I'm happy with CD audio. It is also pretty much legacy gear now though as well, but did get x64 driver updates.
You really need to define your connectivity needs. Mine included a MIDI I/O to USB and RCA I/O's which are really handy for attaching my external Spirit HW mixer to the PC via the UA4.
Actually, it sounds like you're just looking for a better sounding GM/GS PnP sound set option. Most of those are legacy SW items now, though very handy to have some around. There's another recent thread on this same topic.
Last edited by GravityWave; 02/12/15 08:15 AM.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I notice that the lower end Focusrite models don't have midi ports. What's the preferred way to accommodate those with an older external midi controller that doesn't have usb? I see there are midi to USB adapters. Are there sync issues when using them with an external USB audio interface?
-Ron Depends on your needs. You only need the midi ports if you use midi and if the midi keyboard doesn't connect via USB. Most of the newer keyboards do connect with USB so there's no need to have midi ports on the interface.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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....... You only need the midi ports if you use midi and if the midi keyboard doesn't connect via USB. ......
Thanks Herb, I sometimes use an old Kurzweil PC2X for sounds and as controller. No usb, that's why I was asking. Come next desktop upgrade, doubt I'll be able to transfer my MAudio 2496 (requires extra PCIe slot, not common now on stock motherboards). So separate midi and audio usb interfaces don't create timing glitches? No big deal, will probably go with single unit that has both - as suggested above. Thx guys. -Ron
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Doubt I'll be able to transfer my MAudio 2496 (requires extra PCIe slot, not common now on stock motherboards). Nice Ron. That's why I upgraded to Focusrite. I had on old GadgetLabs Wave 8*24 interface that also had the PCI card. It's great that the newer interfaces are completely external. I'm actually thinking about upgrading my 6i6 to a 18i20 to get more inputs. PM me if you want a deal on a 6i6. I've had mine new less than a year.
Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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....... You only need the midi ports if you use midi and if the midi keyboard doesn't connect via USB. ......
Thanks Herb, I sometimes use an old Kurzweil PC2X for sounds and as controller. No usb, that's why I was asking. Come next desktop upgrade, doubt I'll be able to transfer my MAudio 2496 (requires extra PCIe slot, not common now on stock motherboards). So separate midi and audio usb interfaces don't create timing glitches? No big deal, will probably go with single unit that has both - as suggested above. Thx guys. -Ron There will be no timing problems when using separate midi and audio interfaces. But there is another solution. That would be a 5 pin MIDI to an USB converter This may save you a bit of money. I hope this helps.
I want my last spoken words to be "I hid a million dollars under the........................"
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Thx Mario, the converter is what I meant by separate midi interface. (Is there another kind?). Good to hear no timing conflict with usb audio (just in case I go that route.)
Thx Steve, no plans to reconfigure til Win 10 is fully released later this year.
-Ron
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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[quote=GravityWave]Spending ~$300 on a SampleTank just to do GM/GS stuff is not wise.quote]
The Sampletank program by itself is free and IKM even includes some free sounds, that's why Biab includes it. The full ST including 33 gigs of sound libraries is what costs $300. Omnisynth is the GM soundset and full price is $39 and IKM will put it on sale a couple of times a year for $10. So you already have ST free and you can buy Omnisynth for $10-39 and you have a decent GM synth.
There's a thread in the Tips & Tricks forum that explains how to set it up.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2007
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I had Sound Blaster 2 Audigy ZS PCI card with breakout box perfectly working with windows 7 64bit and adapted 64bit drivers i got via-via from some one called Daniel. The big plus of this breakout box is a mic in and headphone out with each a volume potmeter plus optical SPDIF in-out. IMO though old still one of the best systems for GM and soundfont use, and audio quality, though 48kHz only, is very good. If you need a hardware GM synth instead of a VST one f.i. to save processor speed or memory maybe a wise choice?
Alas since i bought an focusrite unit for multitracking, i took it out even when i had it working side by side for a while, but i needed the PCI slot for something else. Pity i have to use the BIAB wavetable coyote plugin now for General MIDI .... If some one needs the drivers mail me. BTW i have the SB2 and breakout for sale if someone is interested; make me an offer. - F
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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User Video: Next-Level AI Music Editing with ACE Studio and Band-in-a-Box®
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 German for Windows is Here!
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This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
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Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
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With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
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A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
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