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#177712 - 10/31/12 06:16 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen)
Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 15029
PeterGannon Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 15029
Many people have requested GUI changes to the program.

We would appreciate hearing any specific suggestions that you have - the more specific the better.
This topic is for suggestions for **other than the main screen**. There is a different thread for the main screen here... http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=382577&an=0&page=0#Post382577
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PG Music Inc.

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#177713 - 11/01/12 02:07 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: PeterGannon]
Registered: 09/09/09
Posts: 67
Loc: France
Chris (SwingingSoft) Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/09/09
Posts: 67
Loc: France
Hello,

- I'll appreciate to have a custom toolbar or a dropdown menu to launch external apps (more than one and fast access in the gui).

- Maybe the PgLink system could be extended to access more fonctionalities ?

- The song picker could be replaced by something more modern, based on a treeview to look like the explorer (I wrote mine that you can find here but an internal one would be better).


Thanks... and good luck !
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Free tools for Biab:
Biab Scales and BIArpeggio to practice scales/arpeggio
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#177714 - 11/01/12 07:07 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Chris (SwingingSoft)]
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 12443
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
jford Offline
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Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 12443
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
I would like to see all pick lists have a common interface. Right now, the RealDrums and RealTracks pickers look similar, but are different. Songpicker works much differently, as does style picker. Selecting items should be easy.

For selecting and filtering items, I suggest using a filter system similar to that of the Thunderbird email client. A graphic is below:



All picklists should have the common look and feel.

This should also include resizing columns and selecting only the columns you want displayed.
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#177715 - 11/01/12 07:20 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jford]
Registered: 09/28/07
Posts: 3907
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
Ryszard Offline
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Posts: 3907
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
It would be really nice if the mouse scroll wheel worked in the picklists, too.
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#177716 - 11/01/12 08:25 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Ryszard]
Registered: 08/04/00
Posts: 1326
Loc: - Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Luiz Dias Offline
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Registered: 08/04/00
Posts: 1326
Loc: - Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Well,
maybe, due commercial reasons, that ugly Drums interface (a low resolution image of the drums/percussion set playing)could be redone.
Is it possible to be a more elaborated or realistic image? Use as reference the Drum softwares that are at the market. I know this will not change/improve the program, but people like fancy interfaces today.

my 2 cents
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#177717 - 11/01/12 09:52 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jford]
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Cerio Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Quote:

All picklists should have the common look and feel. This should also include resizing columns and selecting only the columns you want displayed.




I completely agree. Alowing custom organization of elements (ex: reorganizing -via drag&drop- the "Style tree" and renaming styles on the stylepicker window) would be great as well.

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#177718 - 11/01/12 10:13 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Cerio]
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Cerio Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Also, unifying Realdrums, Realtracks, MIDI supertracks, and MIDI tracks on one main window, would greatly simplify the program usability, specially for new users. This is one of the most difficult points to understand for newcomers, at least in my experience.
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#177719 - 11/01/12 11:17 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Cerio]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 24368
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 24368
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
One small thing that hinders me is not being able to see all the options on one screen, when space should have been sufficient to do so. This could involve things such as MORE or OPTIONS in dialog boxes. In other words, I like to be able to see all my alternatives. Over the years, I've had to periodically visit every dialog and try out all the buttons, only to discover something I didn't know was there or rediscover something I had forgotten about because it was always out of sight.

Examples:

Options, Preferences, Notation, MORE

.MID button, OPTIONS/SET RANGE

Soloist, MORE (and finding that button requires some hunting)
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#177720 - 11/01/12 11:22 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 24368
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 24368
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Pet peeve:

To activate MIDI Chord Detection requires several operations. When you are working on a transcription, you want to be able to get to this fantastic tool quickly.

Window, MIDI Chord Detection, MIDI Chord Detection

Why twice?

I would like a hot key combo for this, too, and/or a button.
_________________________
BIAB 2023 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6 Pro, Swam horns, Audition 3, Notion 7; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

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#177721 - 11/01/12 01:15 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 12/16/09
Posts: 413
Loc: Benoni, South Africa
CountryTrash Offline
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Registered: 12/16/09
Posts: 413
Loc: Benoni, South Africa
Please do not forget the up/down key volume control and left/right panning request in another thread
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#177722 - 11/01/12 01:47 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: CountryTrash]
Registered: 03/15/11
Posts: 17
Loc: Gloucester, England
Pete A Offline
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Registered: 03/15/11
Posts: 17
Loc: Gloucester, England
This may be a bit radical but in my opinion the name Band In A Box makes it sound like a child's toy. Not only that, the interface also looks a bit that way too.

As a new user I find the options all very confusing and hard to find. I would also like to see more consistency between BiaB and RB, especially regarding the options and layout.

Ideally the two programs should be combined into one. They must share a lot of functionality already? That would be a great excuse for renaming!

I also agree with a comment on the other thread about looking at other DAWs (Cubase, Sonar, etc.) and bringing the interfaces a more cool, modern look.

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#177723 - 11/01/12 05:47 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: PeterGannon]
Registered: 02/01/08
Posts: 826
Loc: BC, Canada
pwarren Offline
Expert

Registered: 02/01/08
Posts: 826
Loc: BC, Canada
BiaB does nearly everything I need or might need in the future so there's very little I'd like to see changed. However, there is one thing that would potentially make BiaB more flexible to users and that is the ability to launch unlimited apps from within the UI. Not only that but launch them with command line parameters that the user can select from a list.

Examples would be the current song title, tempo, style, key etc. This way programmers, like me for example, would be able to write useful tools to work with BiaB.

Larger amounts of data could be transfered via the clipboard. Examples like the song memo.

Here's what Delphi uses to configure a 3rd party apps launcher.





Note: the params edit should have a dropdown list of params available to the developer and some clipboard options would be useful too.

If adopted this web site could use a place to host 3rd party tools for others to download.
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#177724 - 11/03/12 12:04 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: pwarren]
Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7666
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
jazzmammal Offline
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Just a OT comment I'm going to throw in here. I can't help having the feeling that all these ideas are merely rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Most of us here are over 50 and a lot are over 60. I will occasionally spend a Saturday surfing youtube and watching demos of other software. Absolutely NONE of those demos involve anything that any of us here would call real music. The stuff I hear has no traditional structure to it, no verse, bridge, solo section, tag ending, etc. It's all dubstep, techno, hiphop and beats, loops, beats, loops and more beats and loops. It's all done by twenty somethings. A lot of it is very creative and I would even call some of it "good" but I can't relate to it at all and neither can any of us here I suspect. Example, I must have watched parts of 50 demo's for Ableton Live. Amazing software especially when used with the Akai controller that costs $600. Not one of those involved a real song we're used to and it's not even close. What these kids can do is really impressive but again with all my musical experience if someone gave me that setup and asked me to create something I would have no clue where to begin. My musical taste and experience won't tell me if what I did is hip to the young crowd or not. I strongly suspect they would say go back to your jazz grandpa. Exactly what we said or thought when our parents would talk about how the big bands are the real deal and this new stuff is crap.

10-15 years from now none or few of us are going to be doing this any more and what's the future of PG Music then? For Biab to have any relevance to the kinds of stuff these twenty somethings are doing now would require such a radical change of direction we would not recognize it and certainly are not qualified to even comment on it much less offer suggestions.

What we're talking about now is fine for the next year or so but what about later? I sincerely hope Peter has brought in a few young folks who know this stuff and they're already running some experiments with it.

You want to talk about having several versions of Biab? This would be exactly it. One setup for us old farts and a completely different one for young people if that's even possible without infringing on other software.

Bob
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#177725 - 11/03/12 04:51 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 8057
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 8057
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
multiple chord sheets arranged on tabs, as in EXCEL

see thread:
http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=356412&an=0&page=0#Post356412

This idea would be best suited to ReaLBand, but it could also be used in BIAB if each instrument could be directed to its own chord sheet. That way, all instruments could use the same chords, as it is now... or some of them could be driven by sparser or busier chords

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#177726 - 11/03/12 05:45 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 3363
JohnJohnJohn Offline
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Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 3363
Quote:

Most of us here are over 50 and a lot are over 60.




Hey Bob, how do you know this? I'm just curious if there is a way to see from the forum stats what the age demographic is of the users here. I have noticed more posts with "at my age..." in this forum than most! Also, I agree with your point. I suggested something similar in a recent post. I think this product could be greatly improved by targeting a younger demographic in addition to what they target now. The only thing I disagree with is that most/all of the youth are into that new-fangled techno/hiphop/whatever stuff! I know lots of young singer-songwriters who are doing lots of folk and country along with what we would have called pop in the 70s.

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#177727 - 11/03/12 06:23 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Cerio Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 1191
Loc: Spain
Quote:



Most of us here are over 50 and a lot are over 60. I will occasionally spend a Saturday surfing youtube and watching demos of other software. Absolutely NONE of those demos involve anything that any of us here would call real music. The stuff I hear has no traditional structure to it, no verse, bridge, solo section, tag ending, etc. It's all dubstep, techno, hiphop and beats, loops, beats, loops and more beats and loops. It's all done by twenty somethings




Ummmm.... Too many assumptions here...

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#177728 - 11/04/12 08:57 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Cerio]
Registered: 12/27/03
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Loc: Hamlin NY
MarioD Offline
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This is for both the main and the other screens.

I would like to either have the fonts changed or the ability to change fonts on the various messages and menus. For example the font for category in the style menu is one of them that is almost impossible to read on a high-resolution monitor. As are some of the message windows on the main screen.



They are actually a little smaller than these.
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#177729 - 11/04/12 11:01 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: MarioD]
Registered: 03/18/04
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Danny C. Offline
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I simple way to just copy and paste lyrics into the large scrolling window. For us with hundreds of songs who play live gigs it is just too cumbersome to add note lyrics for all of these tunes.

Thanks,
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#177730 - 11/04/12 12:28 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: Cerio]
Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7666
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
jazzmammal Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7666
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
Quote:

Ummmm.... Too many assumptions here...




You certainly could be right, this is just an observation I wanted to throw out there.

Back on topic.

One of the biggest things that's been written about for years is a rewrite of the Help files. Here's just one:

Midi and Audio setups. I touched on this in the other thread. Get rid of antique legacy references. Example, Setting up Midi or Sound Card. It refers to a MPU401. What? That thing is 20 years old. Sound Canvass. Yeah Roland still uses that term but it sounds old. Use Ketron SD2 or Garritan or something else that sounds new. Inside the Midi/Audio Drivers setup window get rid of all the incorrect old references like these:

In addition to the 128 general MIDI patches, newer Roland/Yamaha modules and soft-synths (eg. VSC3)...

The VSC3 is newer? It's an antique, doesn't work with 64 bit windows and was last updated 20 years ago.

Then right below that in the same window is the big button that says Audio Settings..MME.

How many times to we have to say it's not MME any more it's WDM. How old is that term, MME? Please.

In the Audio Settings window is a checkbox that says Mixer requires keystrokes to open Record Panel (Windows 95 only). What? I say again only louder WHAT??? Good grief, Win 95.

When the term "Sound Card" is used it's in the very old context of soundcards including a synth. Again, that's very old, nobody oh, ok almost nobody uses a Sounblaster that has the built in synth any more. There is not one reference in the set up window to a midi/audio digital USB interface. Interfaces are what everybody has now and NONE of those includes any kind of synth. In addition they all have their own ASIO drivers. Don't refer to ASIO4All in the ASIO window. In the modern world like the last several years, that's not needed because all the various manu's have perfectly good ASIO drivers of their own and you're much better off using them.

I could go to every window and make similar comments but you get the idea.

Bottom line here with all due respect Peter, before you spend any time thinking about how to change the GUI, menus etc you have to get the staff together and/or include the beta testers and go through each page of the manual and help files and purge these old references and do a full rewrite to bring the Biab Help files into the 21st century.

Now, Cerio if PG elects to not change these things that have been written about in the forums for years, what does that say about the targeted customer base? They're a bunch of old farts using old equipment and they're worried about losing them.

Bob


Edited by jazzmammal (11/04/12 12:34 PM)
_________________________
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.

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#177731 - 11/05/12 03:26 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: GUI suggestions/requests (**other** than main screen) [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 09/28/07
Posts: 3907
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
Ryszard Offline
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Registered: 09/28/07
Posts: 3907
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
Quote:

Bottom line here with all due respect Peter, before you spend any time thinking about how to change the GUI, menus etc you have to get the staff together and/or include the beta testers and go through each page of the manual and help files and purge these old references and do a full rewrite to bring the Biab Help files into the 21st century.




. . . Which plays directly into my long-time, repeated suggestion to have a third-party specialist assist with or take over documentation for reasons of completeness and thoroughness (two different things). I specifically order the hard copy manual so I can write missing entries, of which there are many, in the Index, something I can't do in the online Help file. A unique program of this complexity requires comprehensive documentation.
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