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#234199 01/10/14 06:42 PM
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For Real instruments that have Real Charts, is there some way to extract the complete MIDI files that correspond with each audio file?

To clarify, if I load one of the audio files (for a real track instrument) into my DAW I can play it from beginning to end audibly. However, I would also like to see the corresponding Real Chart from beginning to end. Not just those sections that might be generated by BIAB to match the current song's chord progression.

Alternatively, is there a way to force BIAB to generate a track that will match any given RT audio file from beginning to end so that the corresponding MIDI track could then be dragged into a DAW?

Am I trying to look into Pandora's Box here or might we be able to do this without unearthing closely guarded PGM secrets? smile

Bob

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Bob,

It can be done. What version of BIAB do you have?

Sometimes the notation files do not parallel the RT note for note. This is because they are transcribed after the RT was was created at the PG Music studios (at least as far as I understand). For the faster and more complicated tracks, the discrepancies tend to be more noticeable. That being said, the notation provided is a very good representation.

Regards,
Noel


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I did some of the transcriptions in the early years of RealTracks. I do not know if the process (which is proprietary) has changed since then, but I can tell you my transcription sounded dead on when played along with the RealTrack. However, my MIDI transcription had none of the nuances characteristic of the instrument.


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Thanks for the response guys. I'm not really expecting a perfect match but naturally the closer the better. However, regardless of how well or how poorly they match the audio, I really would like to be able to extract the RC MIDI files.

Quote:
It can be done. What version of BIAB do you have?


I have BIAB 2014, Build 380.

Could one of you please outline the procedure to extract the corresponding RC MIDI file for each audio file.

Thanks in advance,

Bob

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Go to Options > Preferences > RealTracks and Tick "Save RealCharts in Midi Files. Go to File > Make a Standard Midi File.
The track needs to have RealCharts, if it is green with an underline it should, also in the the realtrack picker window there is a Chart column that will say if it has a Chart.
is is easy to access in RealBand http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=182571#Post182571

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Thanks solidrock but, I don't see how this gets me the RC for any specific audio file. I know how to get BIAB to generate the RC MIDI file for any given track it has created within a song but I want to get the chart associated with a given audio file in the RT folders.

For example, let's just take one specific file:
bb\RealTracks\Fiddle, SoloistWesternSwingAndy Sw165\fi0791.wma

For my installation, fi0791.wma is the very first audio file under the Fiddle... folder.

Now, how do I instruct BIAB to output the MIDI file associated with this RT audio file? Such a chart should depict approximately what the artist played when the fi0791.wma file was recorded.

What I want to do is to be able to choose any such audio file under the Real Tracks folder and obtain the corresponding RC MIDI file. Is there a way to do that and, if so, what is the procedure?

BTW I'm not using Real Band so I would prefer to do this with BIAB and/or my DAW.

Thanks again for any help,

Bob

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Sorry, yes I see, I wanted the same some time back and still do, but I think Peter said there is no associated midi file for the RT, that the RC information was embedded in the program it's self. Maybe it should be suggested again in the wishlist ? I know if you get RealDrums from http://www.realdrumsforbiab.com/ they come with the associated midi file. If they could do this with the RealTracks and RealDrums it would be very helpful, sorry I could not help.

Bob...

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Thanks solidrock.

OK Noel96,

Quote:
Bob,

It can be done. What version of BIAB do you have?


Since you said it can be done, could you outline the procedure for us?

Thanks

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Hi Bob,

Not a problem. In 2014 it's easier than it's ever been.

Load in the Realtrack that you are interested in. When the Realtrack is loaded, it must have a line under the name. See the below image. This line says that this RT has a notation file associated with it.



In the above image, the RT on the Piano track has notation associated with it (it is underlined) while RT on the Bass slot does not have notation. (This means that what I describe below will work for the the Piano track RT but not the Bass one.)

When the track is loaded. Generate the song. There's no need for it to play through.

Now simply left-click on the Piano Track and drag it across to the MID quadrant of the Drop Station.



Once it's done, right-click on the Drop Station and you can choose to go to the folder that it's stored in.

Hope this helps,
Noel


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The only way you can do it at the moment is set tempo to 165 and drop the fi0791.wma in, Ctrl+A to highlight the whole track, go up to Audio menu > Pitch to Midi Convert, it gets it close but you have to play with the settings, you can redo a section by just highlighting that section only. It would be so much easier if they just convert the RC data to a midi file for each RT (fi0791.mid, fi0792.mid.....).

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Hi Noel96,

Thanks for your response but we must be having a communication problem. When you say 'generate your song' it sounds to me like you think I want the chart that matches the audio BIAB cobbles together for a specific song and RT instrument. But, what I want is the chart for the various audio files recorded by the Artists. Such as for the fi0791.wma file.

How do you propose I enter a song that will cause BIAB to generate the same audio as contained in the fi0791 file from beginning to end. That would be the key to doing it all right but how would I make such a song? For any given chord progression that I enter, BIAB is going to cobble together segments of fi0791, fi0792, ... according to its programmed strategy. I think it likely that the strategy will include some random phrase selections among other things so I don't know how to force BIAB to choose all the segments in a given file like fi0791 in unbroken order. I agree that if we could make BIAB do that, then it would be a simple matter to drag out the MIDI chart for that matching audio track.

If you know of some way to create such a song whose audio will match a given RT audio file, please describe your procedure.

Hi solidrock,

Your suggestion sounds a little more along the lines that will be needed to do this. I don't know if it will work or not, have you tried this? I expect to have a little block of time later today so I'll try something along these lines and get back with you.

Meanwhile, if anyone else knows some clever way to extract the MIDI chart info from the bt1 files, please chime in.

God Bless,

Bob

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Hi Bob,

Yes, I misinterpreted you post. Sorry about that. I can't help with what you're after.

Regards,
Noel


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Bob, I agree with Noel. The method to produce RealTracks and charts is proprietary and is unknown to users. I don't know how to do what you want.


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Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Bob, I agree with Noel. The method to produce RealTracks and charts is proprietary and is unknown to users. I don't know how to do what you want.


Thanks guys, I was afraid that might be the situation. Which is why I included

Quote:
Am I trying to look into Pandora's Box here or might we be able to do this without unearthing closely guarded PGM secrets?


in my original post.

God Bless,

Bob

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The best way that I tried was below in RealBand, that got it very close when I played the midi back along with the the original RT, you will just have to try that and see if is good enough for what you want.


"The only way you can do it at the moment is set tempo to 165 and drop the fi0791.wma in, Ctrl+A to highlight the whole track, go up to Audio menu > Pitch to Midi Convert, it gets it close but you have to play with the settings, you can redo a section by just highlighting that section only. It would be so much easier if they just convert the RC data to a midi file for each RT (fi0791.mid, fi0792.mid.....)."

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Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Bob, I agree with Noel. The method to produce RealTracks and charts is proprietary and is unknown to users. I don't know how to do what you want.


Quote:
Am I trying to look into Pandora's Box here or might we be able to do this without unearthing closely guarded PGM secrets?


I don't think it has to do with that, look at midi super tracks, I think they just haven't thought of doing it nor got around to doing it. As I said put it again in the wishlist.

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Hi solidrock,

I'm sorry that I haven't gotten around to your suggestion yet but I've been kind of overloaded today smile

Now that I read your post more carefully, I see that you are suggesting using RB's pitch to MIDI converter. Presently at least I'm not using RB but I would imagine that I could do the same thing with Melodyne so when I get a little breather, I'll try that. However, I was kind of hoping there would be some easy way to extract it. After all the MIDI file or its equivalent must live somewhere.

Regarding adding this request the wishlist, I'm a newbie here so I'm not familiar with that department yet smile but if you already did that, could you point me to what you posted?

Anyway, thanks to everyone for your kind responses.

Bob

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Melodyne was not as good I don't think, but if you have it give it a go.
It was way back so I did another, who knows a miracle might happen:
http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=34&page=1

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That is indeed surprising because generally speaking Melodyne is very good. If the audio to MIDI converter in RB is that good maybe I should fire up RB smile

BTW I cast my vote for your Wishlist post. Hope others will join in.

Rejoice,

Bob

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Hi Bob,
If you are using sonar X3 or Cubase Daws load the wma file into the daw. Open the pitch correction screen and select pitch to midi. That will generate a midi file from the wave file. I use this when I want to correct some of the playing of the solo/melody instruments that sometimes play funny notes.

Regards

Willie

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