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Joined: Jul 2007
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Well others may have got luckier, but here is the process I went to.
1] Look around on the screen for a save style button - none
2] Check out the menus along the top ribbon - find something called "Favorite folders" Check it out, draw a blank
3] Go to the Help Type in Favorite style - pop up appears listing 'Favorite Patches', and 'Using favourite patches' Difference? well never mind - draw a blank
4] Some months later... Realise that the fourth option on the right click style menu is something called "Favorite Style"
5] Investigate the Favorite Style Dialogue Box:
Notice a button called 'Add Fav' Click on it, This opens up the root BB folder -
Why?
Click around in the dialog box. Notice a tab labelled "Recently Played"
No, I don't want to append go to Top, search or delete, I have already tgried the Add fav button and it did not yield results
Give up again.
Months later, purely by chance Realise that the "Ad Fav" is not the same button as the "Add Fav" in the next tab.
TWO BUTTONS IN THE SAME DIALOG BOX WITH TWO DIFFERENT FUNCTIONS BUT IDENTICAL NAMES!
Months later, realise that there is a HELP screen for Favorite Styles Dialog box BUT....
It does not appear when searched for...
It does display a pic of the dialogue box and explain the buttons...BUT it does NOT tell you where to find the said dialogue box!
I have also often favoritized styles and songs, only to find they have disappeared after update too.
I realise that one could have travelled a different route, and got lucky somehow, but I must say that this is by no means the only issue I have with finding things.
GUIZ!
#
Last edited by ZeroZero; 01/08/15 11:06 AM.
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,415
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Joined: Jun 2012
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I think most of us agree that the menus can be somewhat difficult to navigate and work through. No doubt some of this has occurred as a result of the long-term "evolution" of the product. Features get added, and options get squeezed in, and eventually some of the locations these occur at just don't make much sense.
Pull it apart and start again? Big ask...
But I agree that some of these things definitely need to be more methodically laid out.
My 2 cents
Trev
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,459
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Expert
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,459 |
Well others may have got luckier, but here is the process I went to.
1] Look around on the screen for a save style button - none
2] Check out the menus along the top ribbon - find something called "Favorite folders" Check it out, draw a blank
3] Go to the Help Type in Favorite style - pop up appears listing 'Favorite Patches', and 'Using favourite patches' Difference? well never mind - draw a blank
4] Some months later... Realise that the fourth option on the right click style menu is something called "Favorite Style"
5] Investigate the Favorite Style Dialogue Box:
Notice a button called 'Add Fav' Click on it, This opens up the root BB folder -
Why?
Click around in the dialog box. Notice a tab labelled "Recently Played"
No, I don't want to append go to Top, search or delete, I have already tgried the Add fav button and it did not yield results
Give up again.
Months later, purely by chance Realise that the "Ad Fav" is not the same button as the "Add Fav" in the next tab.
TWO BUTTONS IN THE SAME DIALOG BOX WITH TWO DIFFERENT FUNCTIONS BUT IDENTICAL NAMES!
Months later, realise that there is a HELP screen for Favorite Styles Dialog box BUT....
It does not appear when searched for...
It does display a pic of the dialogue box and explain the buttons...BUT it does NOT tell you where to find the said dialogue box!
I have also often favoritized styles and songs, only to find they have disappeared after update too.
I realise that one could have travelled a different route, and got lucky somehow, but I must say that this is by no means the only issue I have with finding things.
GUIZ!
#
I had exactly the same problem some time ago, trying to find the command to add a song to "Favourites". If finding very basic functions is so difficult and unintuitive for very experienced users, try to imagine how would it be for newcomers...
BIAB 2024, latest build.
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,739
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OP
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Hi Cerio, Yes there are countless anomolies in BIAB. Most new users, especially the young, just laugh at it, frankly I can see why.
After experiencing crash city so many times with BIAB I now run my piano completely outside band in a box, then just use it for practice, rehearsing chord changes - even this it does not do well.
I do love this program though, I am critical because PG needs to get real and stop botching bits together
We have FOUR different menus for styles!!!
1] The one on the top ribbon
2] The Bottom area of the style menu
3] The One on the top area of the style button
4] The one reached by right clicking the black style info rectangle
5] And we also have a style maker button...
6] then of course there is the style picker, real track pickers,real drum pickers, song pickers
All this needs simplification, it needs to be intuitive, without the use of double tildes and other esoteric functions - a complete rethink
Z
Z
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 647
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 647 |
+1
Unfortunately, only a few people would buy a new version BIAB without the '50 new features'. It'e not a big selling point to say 'we've just fixed 150 menu problems'
I really would like them to take the time to do all of that clean up, but the cost would be enormous with very little positive new income. Plus, as many have said, this is an old product with hundreds, if not thousands of additions over the years. As an ex-programmer, I know that unless you really know what you are trying to fix, and all of the interactions, any change can be disastrous. And without hours of testing and quality control, you might be worse off than before.
It seems they can fix the new stuff pretty easily (eg real tracks) but not the legacy product. Just look at all the requests for Notation / Music XML that have gone unanswered, but they were able to add synsys which is XML related.
PGMusic has to put its money into getting us to buy a new version every year. I am not sure how many would buy a version that is just fixing errors.
BIAB for Windows Version 2019 (643)
Windows 10 (1909)
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jul 2007
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+1
Unfortunately, only a few people would buy a new version BIAB without the '50 new features'. It'e not a big selling point to say 'we've just fixed 150 menu problems'
I really would like them to take the time to do all of that clean up, but the cost would be enormous with very little positive new income. Plus, as many have said, this is an old product with hundreds, if not thousands of additions over the years. As an ex-programmer, I know that unless you really know what you are trying to fix, and all of the interactions, any change can be disastrous. And without hours of testing and quality control, you might be worse off than before.
It seems they can fix the new stuff pretty easily (eg real tracks) but not the legacy product. Just look at all the requests for Notation / Music XML that have gone unanswered, but they were able to add synsys which is XML related.
PGMusic has to put its money into getting us to buy a new version every year. I am not sure how many would buy a version that is just fixing errors.
Yes Dave this perspective can be had. I am an ex programmer too, and I have led a team of designers designing complex software (to teach maths to kids). My view is that there so much clutter and compromise code and gui that its got too old. If BIAB is to make it to the 21st century then its going to be 64 bit - which compels a rewrite. Instead of viewing this as a problem, its a fantastic opportunity to simplify build in a more modular way, add new concepts and features and repain all these quirks. I have worked software through several redesigns. Cubase has, on more than one occasion, gone back to the drawing board and developed entirely new software (Cubase VST, Cubase SX), there is a general appearance of professionalism, rock solid stability and above all user utility. The code interfaces have been redesigned many times. Presently they are working on a new powerful score package (you can already write a full orchestral score), they keep coming up with genuine innovations - like expression maps, which allow customisation of individual MIDI articulation/notes. The products are largely price comparible. Yes the user base is larger,(and likely a bigger development team) but that is BECAUSE it is such a good product. BIAB is not taken seriously by many professional musicians, especially the young and there is still no VST, no 64 bit, no stability, no further innovation (since real tracks) and a flakey architecture. IMO. To continue with this development philosophy is (IMO) a downward spiral, commercially.
Last edited by ZeroZero; 01/10/15 02:29 AM.
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Dec 2002
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BIAB is not taken seriously by many professional musicians, especially the young and there is still no VST, no 64 bit, no stability, no further innovation (since real tracks) and a flakey architecture. Young profession musicians and those aspiring to that goal... get to that level by mastering their instruments and not by sitting with software programs. AS a result that is not and should not be the target market for BIAB. Take a look at the forum users. WE are the target audience. And we should not fool ourselves into thinking the next version of BIAB, or a better user interface or one more set of RT's is going to make us a better musician. "We Have Met the Enemy and He Is Us", Pogo (1972). Requests for revisions is fine. BIAB may be a mess, but it is a gallant mess. Think of it this way, are you getting what you pay for. If yes, be happy, if no, put your money somewhere else. And really, in the end, this is just a novelty to burn time. Oh, and have fun. Ya, I am a little down these days....
Last edited by jazzmandan; 01/10/15 05:04 AM.
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
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The subject of re-write is a Very Major task. Objectively, the program currently could currently have 30 man-years of development investment. Maybe more. Realistically, enhancements to the UI and more practical layout of the menus and controls is very much a requirement. So is removing the legacy DOS 8.3 stuff. PGM will be the only ones to actually make the decision on which direction to undertake, but I think there is consensus that one way or another, something needs to be done. I remember reading this article some years ago. I think it fits well here. My 2 cents (Incidentally, I'm a full time programmer too) Trevor
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,545
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,545 |
>>> Young profession musicians and those aspiring to that goal... get to that level by mastering their instruments and not by sitting with software programs. AS a result that is not and should not be the target market for BIAB.
BIAB is used by lots of professional musicians. They don't sit and stare at the program, they are playing along as they practice.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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BIAB may be a mess, but it is a gallant mess.
I agree Jazzmandan, although I criticise BIAB its the Best accompaniment software there is IMO It's not attracting young minds though.. and that means it goes when we do. It has SO much potential with a little creative thinking - massive! One thing I have learnt about development of software is that by far the cheapest method is to do the design on 'paper' over and over again until the idea is right, rather that start coding concepts/modules that are poorly thought out. This just needs a few highly creative people with musical and programming skills. Peter, if your reading this have you ever read De Bono's "Beyond Yes and No"? If not I strongly recommend this small but worthwhile book on creative thinking. Po.....tential: Why not have vocal Real Tracks? (in the new 64 bit app  ) Of course they would have limits in regard to modulation, but within fixed limits this seems to me feasible. As far as the lyrics go, they could be in fixed four bar measures or something similar... Z
Last edited by ZeroZero; 01/10/15 10:54 AM.
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,545
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
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>>> Notice a button called 'Add Fav' Click on it, This opens up the root BB folder -
Why?
The file list *.sty is displayed, and this is to let you select a style that you want to add as a favorite style.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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Thank you for listening Peter. Surely there should be easier ways than hunting and pecking through root directories? 'Media Bay' proposal: Could the style picker the song picker, the MIDI and RT instrument pickers, all be put in ONE dialog box - similar to a media bay in Cubase, or in Omnisphere? I mean a separate window with searchable headings, indexable tags , excludable (e.g. only favs. RTs, BLues) media types (song/style/rt etc.). Headings of viewed lists should be clickable so one can arrange via useful parameters - e.g date, alphabetical, type.# The Window should have hideable panels or tabs and a general neatness of logic - not buttons here there and everywhere, like the current Style Picker. The style category list is also highly confusing. For example, if you are seeking a blues backing track you see a list of types - blues, jazz etc, but then again there are loops, a list of new MIDI Super tracks, another list of New Real Tracks, and a lot more clutter for the eyes - if you want to see all blues tracks are these additional folders included or excluded? No way to tell. I have never succeeded in finding the category "Artist performance" unless I go through WIN7 interfaces to select the BB drive. No use of hidden codes in the new 'Media Bay' (tildes etc) make everything apparent to a novice user (who never reads manuals) using tooltips. A look at Cubase's Media Bay could show the ideas better than my words. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yg1NLKWCTw4If a new Media Bay were to be provided AND the items removed from the numerous locations on the main GUI it would do a lot to unclutter and de-confuse. Z
Last edited by ZeroZero; 01/11/15 12:33 AM.
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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User Video: Next-Level AI Music Editing with ACE Studio and Band-in-a-Box®
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 German for Windows is Here!
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 für Windows Deutsch ist verfügbar!
Wir waren fleißig und haben über 50 neue Funktionen und eine erstaunliche Sammlung neuer Inhalte hinzugefügt, darunter 222 RealTracks, neue RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, "Songs with Vocals" Artist Performance Sets, abspielbare RealTracks Set 3, abspielbare RealDrums Set 2, zwei neue Sets von "RealDrums Stems", XPro Styles PAK 6, Xtra Styles PAK 17 und mehr!
Paket | Was ist Neu
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!
If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
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