Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >
You need to be logged in to post
Options
Index
#378939 - 12/01/16 04:01 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
These are some comments on the difference between the 'regular' and audiophile versions of BIAB. It is only my opinion. Sorry for the length. If anyone finds fault with what I've written, please explain and I'll make corrections and updates.

Last revised: December 1, 2016

This topic comes up frequently and you should be able to find plenty of opinion in posts within the last few years, and those opinions will vary.

I've used the audiophile version of BIAB for many years and highly recommend it with the following understanding: you will need good equipment, a good listening environment, and good ears to hear the differences. In other words, if you listen to MP3s in a car and you have long lost your high-frequency hearing like some musicians, you will not be able to notice any difference.

The 'regular' version uses .WMA files. The specs on these are often 128 Kbps, some less so. The sound seems to me to be comparable to a 198 Kbps MP3. The compression is about 11 to 1, so they are the same smaller size of a 128 Kbps MP3 but sound better than that.

Some instruments (such as acoustic guitar, acoustic grand piano, and cymbals) show compression artifacts more than others and thus are particularly better sounding in the audiophile version.

The audiophile version uses .WAV files of 44.1, 16-bit, or in other words CD quality. Because they are not compressed, the .WAV files will take up about 11 times more space than the corresponding .WMA files (and you still have the complete set of .WMA files).

The audiophile version runs slightly faster, which might not sound intuitive, but it does so because BIAB doesn't have to first uncompress the .WMA files. The way BIAB works is, if there are .WAV files available, it uses those; if there are none, it uses .WMA files, uncompresses them, then runs. This scheme makes it possible to have a combination of .WAV and .WMA files in your RealTracks and it works fine.

Be aware, the annual upgrade price for the audiophile version will be more.

At this time, PG Music ships the audiophile version on a very nice external drive that uses USB 3.0.

The difference in quality between the audiophile and regular versions seems to be getting less over the years. In the early days of RealTracks (2007), there were easily recognizable differences. I suspect improvements in the BIAB program using the Elastique algorithm have made this difference harder to detect, but that's just a guess. This year for BIAB 2017, PG Music has re-recorded a number of RealTracks for better sound.

Regardless of whether you have the audiophile version or not, the farther you stray from a recommended tempo, and the harder the Elastique algorithm must work, the more you risk hearing artifacts. Also, try unchecking some of the speed-up options in Preferences, RealTracks. I have a fast i7 and I even turn some options off to get the best quality I can for my final mix.

If you are producing commercial recordings, the audiophile version also makes a difference because noise in a mix is cumulative. If you have a little noise on each track, but add many tracks, you may notice it more. Therefore, my guideline is, if you are doing commercial work, you should get the audiophile version. For anyone else, it depends on how much you value having the best sound you can get. For me, as a composer, I get inspiration just from great sound, and that is reason enough to go audiophile.

If you have just purchased BIAB and like what you hear but want the best possible sound, call PG Music Sales and see if they can work something out to upgrade to the audiophile version.

All comments about BIAB also apply to RealBand, which uses the same RealTracks.

PG Music has not approved (nor so far, disapproved) of anything I have said here. As mentioned, I welcome and will make corrections.

Matt Finley
Kingsmill Music
Devoted BIAB User since 1994
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#379098 - 12/02/16 04:27 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 13679
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
VideoTrack Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 13679
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Excellent appraisal Matt, and I concur with all said.

PGM should consider to make this a sticky.

The subject is raised often (I certainly investigated it in detail too before upgrading to Audiophile), and it would be a valuable resource to users exploring the benefits and differences between versions.
_________________________
BIAB & RB2021(Audiophile), SonarPlatinum, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M StudioMonitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones

Top
#379340 - 12/02/16 04:03 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7989
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Pat Marr Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7989
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Thanks for that Matt.. good information...

and it validates my choice to skip the audiophile version because I'm certain that after years of working in loud industrial settings and playing in bands my impaired hearing could not discern the difference.

Top
#379367 - 12/02/16 06:00 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 17412
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 17412
Loc: Australia
Your thoughts are a great summary, Matt.

All I'll add is that should it turn out that a completed song is going to be compressed, and the quality of that final stage compression is important, then the Audiophile edition could be beneficial.

I'll explain.

Some more thoughts on audio quality...

When the original Realtrack and Realdrum wav files are converted to 128 kbps wma, there is some minor reduction in audio quality. Even though these wma files are reconstituted as wav files when BIAB plays, the quality losses from the initial conversion of wav to wma are still present.

The above means that when a final mix is assembled and then compressed as part of the final stage of presentation (for example, publishing on Soundcloud where Soundcloud automatically compresses everything uploaded), the Realtracks and Realdrums in the final mix will undergo the equivalent of a second compression. This could potentially reduce sound quality even more noticeably.

With the Audiophile edition, it's possible to work entirely with the original wav files without any loss of audio fidelity. Then, when the final mix is compressed, only a single compression is undergone.

  • With the previous thoughts in mind, when I upload a song to Soundcloud, I always create a final wav file mix and then upload that wav to Soundcloud. Because I use the Audiophile edition of the software, when Soundcloud compresses the uploaded wav, that's the only compression the Realtracks and Realdrums undergo. As a result, the audio quality of my streaming song on Soundcloud is the best that I can achieve using 16/44.1 original wav files.

  • Radio broadcasting is another area where music is compressed prior to being used. So if songs are likely to be played back by radio transmission, it's possible that the Audiophile edition will be useful in obtaining a better quality final sound.

The above thoughts stand outside of an individual user's ability to hear the high fidelity sound of Audiophile Realtracks and Realdrums. It is the overall hearing ability of the final audience that is considered.

Quote:
To test what compression does to an audio file, try the following.

1. Create a small song.

2. Save the final mix as:

  • (a) wav (at least 16 bit, 44.1 kHz);
  • (b) 128 kbps stereo mp3;
  • (c) 96 kbps stereo mp3.

3. Upload all three versions to Soundcloud (keep the tracks Private if you don't want the world to hear them).

4. Play the tracks back and compare.

During its preparation process, Soundcloud will compress each of the uploaded files. While some instruments survive this compression better than others, it's usually possible to hear audio artifacts creeping into to the published audio as a consequence of Soundcloud's compression.


Hope this makes sense.
Noel

December 3, 2016
_________________________
LINKS TO MY BIAB/RB SONGS


Top
#379402 - 12/02/16 08:52 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
This is very solid information, Noel. Yes, it is critical to avoid compressing a compressed file. While I don't use SoundCloud, I have encountered severe artifacts on YouTube. My video guy would make the original file as large as YouTube allowed before it would employ a worse compression level.

Radio stations can really destroy the quality (and dynamic range) of a song also. I have learned not to try to out-think a radio station, because whatever they do will mangle the sound anyway. The only thing you can do is what you say, stay in a non-compressed mode as long as possible.
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#379469 - 12/03/16 05:31 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 05/15/15
Posts: 867
Loc: St. Petersburg , FL
Island Soul Offline
Expert

Registered: 05/15/15
Posts: 867
Loc: St. Petersburg , FL
I only use BIAB audiophile edition now a days because of the high quality audio tracks it provides and the fact I like being able to have every real track avalibe with out having to install all the tracks on to my Mac. The fact that they are only 16 bit 44.1k does not really bother me since most people can't tell the difference in aduio higher than 320k mp3. As someone who went to school for audio, it would be nice to have at least 24bit 44.1, as I use that a lot when mixing in my DAW, and I hope the 2017 BIAB for Mac will be able to have the RTs at 24 bit, but again, it's not that big of a deal to me.
_________________________
Computer: Mid 2014 Macbook Pro,
DAWs: Pro Tools, Logic, and Maschine
plays drums, percussion, bass, steel pan, keyboard,
music producer/engineer

Top
#379475 - 12/03/16 05:50 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 12/10/14
Posts: 697
Loc: Canada
DEddy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 12/10/14
Posts: 697
Loc: Canada
Very informative info. Thanks to all.

DE
_________________________
Win 10, 64 bit, love my Lenovo T420, BIAB 2019 (613), RB 2019 (2)

Short term memory is getting shorter.

Top
#382048 - 12/12/16 10:34 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: DEddy]
Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Beachboy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
New to the Audiophile here.
I notice that the the Audiophile has both WAV & WMA (as mentioned earlier.
When installing to a HHD do you need both the WAV & WMA?
If not, do you go through a nd remove the WMA's?
If you don't remove the WMA's does BIAB just default to the WAV's?
If BIAB defaults to WAV can you, for example install WAV files to the Realtracks you use the most and leave WMA's for other instruments? (If you need to save space on your HDD)?


Edited by Beachboy (12/12/16 10:42 PM)
_________________________
WIN 10, BIAB WIN2021, Studio One 5, Audient iD4

Top
#382071 - 12/13/16 02:36 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
When installing from the PG Music USB drive to a hard drive on your computer (which you don't have to do), yes, you will get both a .WMA and a .WAV of each sound but you just need one or the other to use that sound.

Yes, you could write a batch file to go through and remove all the .WMA files if you wanted, but I don't think it's worth the effort since they are only 1/11 the size of the .WAV files.

Likewise, to save space, you could delete some .WAV files of sounds you don't plan to use, but you would have to do that manually within each folder you choose, which would take quite some effort.

What I do instead is use a file manager and copy only the folders that are new each year that I know I want from the USB drive over to my hard drive. And I bought a hard drive just for RealTracks and RealDrums.
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#382073 - 12/13/16 02:46 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
One other tip. When an update for RealTracks is announced, wait until they also release the audiophile version of that same update.

Sometimes they come together and there is a different link in the announcement. Sometimes the audiophile update comes in another post a few days later.
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#382079 - 12/13/16 02:58 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Beachboy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Thanks for the advice Matt.
Like you, I'm going to store the Realtracks & Drum WAV's on a backup drive.
So, if you leave botht he WAV & WMA's in their folders does BIAB just default to the WAV's?
Also, thanks for the headsup regarding the updates, I was wondering how that worked.
Yes, I think I'll do similar to you and satart be moving the WAV's I need as I need them to my HDD and then just add as new versions are released.
Col


Edited by Beachboy (12/13/16 03:09 AM)
_________________________
WIN 10, BIAB WIN2021, Studio One 5, Audient iD4

Top
#382103 - 12/13/16 05:26 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Yes, BIAB defaults to using the .WAV files. Go back and read my explanation of how that works in my first post. It's pretty cool how they do it. I explain that about six paragraphs down, the one that starts with "The audiophile version runs faster".
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#382117 - 12/13/16 07:43 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Beachboy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Matt,
Yes, see it now.
Thanks for all the info.
Col
_________________________
WIN 10, BIAB WIN2021, Studio One 5, Audient iD4

Top
#382169 - 12/13/16 11:05 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
It really is cool, how PG Music manages to do any of this.

There is a lot of info to take in here. I hope you found it clear and that this thread helped you.
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
#382228 - 12/13/16 02:48 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Beachboy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 428
Loc: Australia
Yes Matt, all very helpful.
Thanks
Col
_________________________
WIN 10, BIAB WIN2021, Studio One 5, Audient iD4

Top
#393429 - 01/31/17 12:42 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: VideoTrack]
Registered: 01/29/17
Posts: 81
Yorkshireknight Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/29/17
Posts: 81
Thank you for this great post Matt. Not only interseting but It has enabled me to make a wiser buying choice of the pak I need.
_________________________
https://soundcloud.com/yorkshireknight
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4e8SXLwMaA00HcN0RaEqEA

BIAB/Realband Ultra plus Pak.2017(3)Intel i7,16GB Ram, 250 GB SSD,2TB HD. Mixcraft 7,Line6 ux2, axiom 49,NT1 mic

Top
#393440 - 01/31/17 03:22 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Yorkshireknight]
Registered: 01/19/10
Posts: 154
Loc: Torino, ITALY
doctormidi Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 01/19/10
Posts: 154
Loc: Torino, ITALY
One thing I have always wondered about: If I buy the audiophile version, and add to that what usually is offered as the "bonus-49 pack", will it also be in the uncompressed wav format, or wma-only?

All the best!

Antonio
_________________________
I muri sono creature... scontrose

Top
#393528 - 01/31/17 11:12 AM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: doctormidi]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 17412
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 17412
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: doctormidi
One thing I have always wondered about: If I buy the audiophile version, and add to that what usually is offered as the "bonus-49 pack", will it also be in the uncompressed wav format, or wma-only?

All the best!

Antonio

Hi Antonio,

When this question was asked a year or so ago, Callie said that it's necessary to mention that one would like the Audiophile edition of the bonus package at the time of purchase. The package will then be added to the Audiophile's USB drive prior to shipping.

Regards,
Noel
_________________________
LINKS TO MY BIAB/RB SONGS


Top
#393550 - 01/31/17 01:40 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 09/15/16
Posts: 408
Will B - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 09/15/16
Posts: 408
This is a great breakdown, Matt. Definitely going to be sending new customers to this so they can get a veteran user's opinion in the future!
_________________________
Will - PG Music

Top
#393603 - 01/31/17 06:26 PM [Post your own Tips and Tricks here] Re: Tip: differences between the 'regular' and audiophile version [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22433
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Thanks, Will. I'm glad to have the opinion of a PG Music employee. I wrote this the day BIAB version 2017 was released for the PC. Potential customers always ask, and I had written parts of this info for many years, over and over. I'm pleased you find it helpful.
_________________________
BIAB 2021 Win Audiophile & Mac UltraPak. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Adobe Audition CC, Notion 6; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors

Top
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >


PG Music News
Ordering Your Band-in-a-Box® is Easy!

When you order any PG Music products directly from www.pgmusic.com (or www.bandinabox.com) you'll receive immediate links to start downloading your order! Even if you choose to have a backup copy of your Band-in-a-Box® packages shipped, you'll still have the download links available to you - no need to wait!

We've made it even easier to get started with Band-in-a-Box® with the Easy Payment Plan 4 - when you choose this payment option you'll pay four equal monthly payments starting on the day of your order.

Choose your Band-in-a-Box® for Windows package & order here.

Using Mac? Order here.

When you get to the checkout, simply click on Select Easy Payment Plan 4 for this product to apply this option.

Note: This only applies to this Band-in-a-Box product, and does not apply to other products that you might have in your order, including the physical backup copy if selected.

Band-in-a-Box® File Associations

You may have noticed when you were installing Band-in-a-Box® for Windows that you were asked if you would like to Associate Band-in-a-Box songs and styles with Band-in-a-Box? But, what does that mean?

It's actually pretty simple - basically, if you select this option while you're installing the program, files with the extensions .SGU, .MGU, and other Band-in-a-Box files will open directly in the program if you select them from outside the program.

Missed this option during your setup, but you'd like to apply it now? Go to File | File Utilities | Associate File types with Explorer within the program.

New Update for RealBand 2021 Available!

Do you use RealBand (included in all Band-in-a-Box® for Windows purchases)? Download the latest free update, which resolves a small viewing issue for Windows 11 users.

When you download the latest update for RealBand 2021, it will add all the updates we've made this year. See the full list here.

Ear Training Games in Band-in-a-Box® for Windows

October 1, 2021 is National Kids Music Day!

Head to the Practice Window in Band-in-a-Box® for Windows, and you'll see fun games that are fun ear training options for kids: Music Replay & Pitch Invasion.

Of course, you don't have to be a kid to like these games, I think there a fun way to learn at any age!

Music Replay is just what it sounds like - the program plays a 1-bar melody, and the user plays it back. Get it right, and you'll keep building that melody (and skill) within the game - get it wrong, and you'll be met with a warning tone and have to try again... it's quite addictive, and a lot of fun!

If you like a classic arcade game, then you'll love Pitch Invasion! We've managed to incorporate aliens with pitch-recognition skills in this exciting game, where you'll match the pitch of the alien ship descending towards your planet trying to destroy your collection of instruments - match the pitch and you've saved your instruments, make a mistake and the ship keeps coming... you'll have a few tries to get it right, if you're quick, but if all your instruments are destroyed - it's game over! The game speeds up as your skills improve, and you'll earn points along the way, with bonus points available throughout the game.

Open up your Band-in-a-Box® for Windows today to give it a try!

These ear training games are also included in Musical Arcade for Windows.

How to Make Backing Tracks with Band-in-a-Box®, by Nick Kellie

Band-in-a-Box® endorsing artist Nick Kellie recently got his hands on the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Mac, and put together this video showing off just how easy it is to make backing tracks in Band-in-a-Box®!

Band-in-a-Box Demo - How to make backing tracks

The Band-in-a-Box® VST DAW Plugin Works Great in Windows® 11!

Simon did it again - another test in Windows 11! See how well the Band-in-a-Box® VST DAW Plugin works with Windows® 11 in his latest video: The Band-in-a-Box® VST DAW Plugin Works Great in Windows® 11!

RealBand® Works Great in Windows® 11!

Here's an introductory look at RealBand® running on the preview version of Windows® 11!

Watch the video.

Forum Stats
34985 Members
66 Forums
71210 Topics
617505 Posts

Max Online: 2537 @ 01/19/20 07:09 AM
Newest Members
Piano Tone, Billscism, daveneal, a4ndrew3lls, jbrydon

34985 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
swingbabymix 330
Pipeline 287
VideoTrack 198
MarioD 152
MoveToGroove 147
justanoldmuso 135
rayc 128
Jim Fogle 118
Matt Finley 117
Simon - PG Music 109
Today's Birthdays
dmws