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#535763 - 05/07/19 05:33 AM [RealBand] Imports from BB to Real Band
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
The memo says :

"Song is saved with Volume, Pan, Reverb, Chorus, Bank0,"

But the reverb from BB song is actually not saved.

Anybody hear the same ?

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#535850 - 05/07/19 02:23 PM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 497
Loc: UK
Bob Calver Offline
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Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 497
Loc: UK
are you talking about midi only because real tracks are audio and if they sound like that in BIAB they should sound the same in RB.

if you are losing the reverb on midi tracks its worth checking the event list to see if the reverb is hard written to the midi track.

are you using the same synth in BIAB and RB? Just a suggestion.

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#535951 - 05/08/19 04:28 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
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Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
Hi Bob
Its pure real tracks and yes the same synths.
If I render each track to separate wav files one by one from BB it saves the reverbsound.
But if I open og import the BB file the reverb is not there.

I often like the mixes of the BB demos, and would love to have exact same reverb.
Chorus volume and pan and delay seems to be there.
Just not the reverb

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#536001 - 05/08/19 09:11 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 5218
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 5218
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
stratos,

Can you give the name of a sample demo file as an example of a song you are talking about and what build of Band-in-a-Box and RealBand you are using so some of us can try to duplicate your results? Based on your last comment I'm assuming you are listening to demo song files, if not please tell us otherwise.

I'd like to verify but I want to verify like for like if possible.
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2019 BiaB (632) UltraPlusPak RB 2019 (Build 4)
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#536042 - 05/08/19 06:16 PM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19370
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19370
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Originally Posted By: stratos
Hi Bob
Its pure real tracks and yes the same synths.
If I render each track to separate wav files one by one from BB it saves the reverbsound....
I often like the mixes of the BB demos, and would love to have exact same reverb.
Chorus volume and pan and delay seems to be there.
Just not the reverb

If using only RT's and Audio files (no MIDI tracks) as implied, then the synth and synth settings shouldn't matter.
Hearing a reverb on BiaB RT's and not on the same file opened in RB seems to point to a reverb on the audio tracks (and RT's) in BiaB as the difference, so how is reverb being added to these tracks in BiaB ?
Does BiaB have a magic setting for reverb on RT's?

I'm asking because I obviously don't spend enough time in BiaB to notice this. Hoping someone else knows the answer.
There may indeed be a way to add reverb in BiaB that RB doesn't support .. they are two different programs and do have differences, but I have never noticed this behavior before though.
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#536056 - 05/08/19 11:39 PM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
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Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
stratos,

Can you give the name of a sample demo file as an example of a song you are talking about and what build of Band-in-a-Box and RealBand you are using so some of us can try to duplicate your results? Based on your last comment I'm assuming you are listening to demo song files, if not please tell us otherwise.

I'd like to verify but I want to verify like for like if possible.

Hi Jim
Thanks for your interest in helping.
I have all the latest builds RB and BiaB

I will emphasize that I want the same reverb that BiaB generate in a song, when I open or import the whole selection from that song into RealBand.
Here comes an example where the piano has NO reverb in Realband but 65 out of 127 reverb in BiaB:

****** Song Summary *************
Title: All RealTracks: Jazz Ballad, Double-Time at B, in-2
File:_BAL2AB2 Demo (ALL REALTRACKS - Piano and AcBass, BalladSw60,Doub-Time-at-B).SGU
Key=Bb , Tempo 60, Length (m:s)=4:32
No intro. 64 bar chorus, from bar 1 to bar 64. Repeat x1 chorus
No Melody
No Soloist track.
Song is saved with Volume, Pan, Reverb, Chorus, Bank0,
Style is _BAL2AB2.STY (Jazz Ballad Double Time-B)


Edited by stratos (05/09/19 12:03 AM)

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#536058 - 05/08/19 11:59 PM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: rharv]
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
Originally Posted By: rharv
Originally Posted By: stratos
Hi Bob
Its pure real tracks and yes the same synths.
If I render each track to separate wav files one by one from BB it saves the reverbsound....
I often like the mixes of the BB demos, and would love to have exact same reverb.
Chorus volume and pan and delay seems to be there.
Just not the reverb

If using only RT's and Audio files (no MIDI tracks) as implied, then the synth and synth settings shouldn't matter.
Hearing a reverb on BiaB RT's and not on the same file opened in RB seems to point to a reverb on the audio tracks (and RT's) in BiaB as the difference, so how is reverb being added to these tracks in BiaB ?
Does BiaB have a magic setting for reverb on RT's?

I'm asking because I obviously don't spend enough time in BiaB to notice this. Hoping someone else knows the answer.
There may indeed be a way to add reverb in BiaB that RB doesn't support .. they are two different programs and do have differences, but I have never noticed this behavior before though.



Yes it could be very nice to see a comment from Support.
Until now I put on the PG reverb from FX in RealBand,that has a default(editable) setting , but its might not be the same as in the demo.


Edited by stratos (05/09/19 12:02 AM)

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#536060 - 05/09/19 01:39 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 497
Loc: UK
Bob Calver Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 497
Loc: UK
If its not midi I'm puzzled. I thought RealTracks were wma files with the fx as a recorded part of the file. I know some guitar parts have DI versions but I just don't understand why the reverb should be lost. Maybe someone more knowledgeable has the answer.

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#536082 - 05/09/19 04:40 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: Bob Calver]
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
Originally Posted By: Bob Calver
If its not midi I'm puzzled. I thought RealTracks were wma files with the fx as a recorded part of the file. I know some guitar parts have DI versions but I just don't understand why the reverb should be lost. Maybe someone more knowledgeable has the answer.


Until they reply here, I hope that Jim Fogle try the same thing out, so I can see if its only my system....

Thanks for your help

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#536085 - 05/09/19 05:32 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: Bob Calver]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 5106
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 5106
Loc: South Carolina
Originally Posted By: Bob Calver
If its not midi I'm puzzled. I thought RealTracks were wma files with the fx as a recorded part of the file. I know some guitar parts have DI versions but I just don't understand why the reverb should be lost. Maybe someone more knowledgeable has the answer.


I think possibly that memo refers to the default mixer settings and the default Style settings. I opened 64 bit BIAB 2019 and the default mixer settings were for Style ZZJAZZ. Two channels had panning left and right and all channels have reverb set at 40. I loaded the Style you're working with, _BAL2AB2.STY and the panning and reverb is considerably different. There has been reverb settings and panning changes even on tracks with no instrument assigned which I believe is programmed into the Style to maintain the overall mix to stay uniform and consistent if the user adds additional instrument to the basic style.


To determine what happens with these settings I set the reverb on the piano track that was 65 all the way to 127 and rendered the song. The reverb was in the song render.

I'm not sure that all of the BIAB mixer settings transfer to RB if a BIAB SGU file is opened in RB. So I added the PGMusic Flanger plug in set fairly extreme so there would be no question if the plug in opened attached to the piano track in RB. It did not. There was no extreme reverb or flanger on the piano track when I opened the sgu file that had those settings saved did not carry over to open in RB. I set the volume and panning to extremes also and saved them in the BIAB sgu file. They did open in RB as I had them set in BIAB.


In order to get the exact same sound of a BIAB track with effects, panning and volume, it's best to render and export the files and then import those files into RB or another DAW. I would recommend if you want the effect captured, to set the panning and volume to zero (center) and leave the effect on the track. Otherwise, it's good practice for any BIAB song that will be moved to a DAW for processing, to set the mix to flat, dry and center. You have a menu option from the Master Button Right Click drop down menu to select that option before saving or rendering your song project. This gives you more flexibility with your tracks when you're working in your DAW.
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#536108 - 05/09/19 08:52 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7760
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7760
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
Charlie,
You are right. This issue was discussed at length at inception during beta.
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#536213 - 05/10/19 01:04 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
stratos Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 222
Loc: Denmark
Hi Charlie and all.

Now I settle with the fact that reverb in my system doesn´t appear when imported from BB, unless I save all tracks to one mixed wave file. That means totally dry.
After all, I think that it might be the best to import all instrument DRY to have the best possibilities in further mixing

The only thing left for me, is why the memo writes "saved with reverb ", but I can easily live with that (lol)

Thanks for your kind help.



Edited by stratos (05/10/19 03:02 AM)

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#536251 - 05/10/19 08:39 AM [RealBand] Re: Imports from BB to Real Band [Re: stratos]
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 11393
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
jford Offline
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Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 11393
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
There is a setting in BIAB to auto-add Reverb to RealTracks and it appears to use the PGMusic Reverb plugin. That would imply that you would have to make the same setting in RealBand to get the same effect (RealBand doesn't automatically load plugins on tracks when reading in a BIAB file).

Look on or about page 253-254 of the user manual for more information (the text portion without pictures extracted below).

Quote:
Auto-Add Reverb
There is also a feature that automatically adds reverb to RealTracks, according to instrument type. No reverb is added to the Bass part, for example, but most instruments get reverb.

This feature defaults to on, but you can turn it off in the PG Music Reverb dialog, which opens by pressing the [Plugins] button and choosing the menu command Audio Reverb Dialog. If you just want more or less reverb added, you can adjust the Strength %. For example, the default Band-in-a-Box reverb setting is 40 for most tracks. If you set the strength to 75%, the setting becomes 30.

Reverb Settings
The default is a “room” type of reverb but you can also set the type of reverb. To do this, press the [Plugins] button and choose the menu command Audio Reverb Dialog, and adjust the various parameters in the PG Music Reverb dialog. Reverb can be enabled/disabled globally for all songs, in which case the setting will still appear but no reverb will be applied. Or you can enable/disable the the audio reverb for the current song only. This will save some CPU cycles if you are using a slower machine.
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