Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
RealBand
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 416
Journeyman
OP Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 416
Little bit of a rant .....

Yesterday I was working on a cover of Alan Jackson's The Older I Get and I started generating the solos and fills. At about every 3rd Realtrack generation for a section RB just crashed out. Had to start saving after every successful generation as I could not predict whether RB will play along with the next step.

This is the first time that I had such a bad experience with it.

Took me most of the day to finish a song that would normally take me about 2 hours!

Windows 8.1
Windows Audio Driver
DELL Pentium 3558U " 1.70GHz
8GB RAM
x64 Windows/Processor

Last edited by CountryTrash; 06/03/19 08:27 PM.

I'm doing allright for Country Trash ....

I used to care, but things have changed (Bob Dylan)

BIAB 2022W + RB
M-Audio FastTrack C600, Rode NT2-A
Digitech VoiceLive 4

Epiphone Sheraton, Ibanez 12str, Washburn 6str, Cort 6Str Nylon
Yanagisawa Tenor Sax

RealBand
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
Any new plugins in play?

Just wonderin, as a few times I have traced weird behavior back to that.
Judging by your specific issue the next thing I would suspect is your Temp Audio Directory location/space/settings.

Temp Audio Directory is in Prefs - Audio.


I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
RealBand
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,809
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,809
Associated with rharv's thoughts; have you defragged your hard drive lately? If you're using a solid state drive (SSD) instead of a hard drive you need to use the TRIM command as defrag is a hard drive utility.


Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK
DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8
Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
RealBand
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Expert
Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Hi

Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
Associated with rharv's thoughts; have you defragged your hard drive lately? If you're using a solid state drive (SSD) instead of a hard drive you need to use the TRIM command as defrag is a hard drive utility.


You may like to read my post here on SSD problems

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=539708#Post539708

Mike


BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro
Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth
Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt

http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
RealBand
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
NEVER defrag your multi track partition.


John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.wintertexaninfo.com/BANDS/JohnnyD.php
RealBand
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,312
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,312
Originally Posted By: silvertones
NEVER defrag your multi track partition.

Hi John,
Could you share with us the reason not to do this?


BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
RealBand
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
If you're doing multitrack recording (bwf wtc) defrag will reduce the performance of playback as the data will write to the disk sequentiall (all files interleaved as the data comes in) but defragging will separate all the data so that the seeking is increased dramatically. Even for 'electronic' style projects, defragging your audio partition shouldn't be necessary, same with a sample library partition (as the samplelibs will tend to write contiguously during install.)

Overall though I try to keep a 'working' partition for audio and then move data off of that as projects are finished (to backups or backup partitions etc) for longterm storage & recall. This alone will keep your audio drive from being 'fragmented', and larger studios probably just format the working partition (or hot swap in a new drive) before starting a new project.


John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.wintertexaninfo.com/BANDS/JohnnyD.php
RealBand
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
John is correct, especially concerning RB.

When you add tracks or edit a track the newly created data gets stored in the Temp Audio Directory.
Then RB plays as normal and jumps over to grab the new data from the Temp Directory as needed.

Once the song gets saved, the Temp data in use gets written to the main SEQ file.
This gets written in such a way that RB can simply read it start to finish linearly afterwards. (interleaved tracks etc). This is by design as it makes it easier on the machine (no disk thrashing type motions, smoother buffer, etc) and the program.

This is also why people who use the same drive for their Temp Audio Directory as they use for their OS and RB take a harder hit on performance and possible problems than those who use a second drive for the Temp Audio Directory. Especially as more and more edits get done and more and more tracks get added.

Save often.
It not only cleans things up but does help with performance.
The thing to remember is saving wipes out the current undo options .. so you have to consider that also .. but saving also creates a backup of the previous file, so you can always get back to that previous version at worst.

Personally OS is on C:, as is RB
The SEQ files are on E: or G: and F: is my Temp Audio Directory.

One drive handles the program
One drive handles the disk read operations for the SEQ file
One drive handles the disk write operations (for Temp Audio) and the Temp Audio playback.

Once saved, the interweaved file is all on the Read disk again (E: or G: in my case). And the Temp Audio drive gets a fresh start.
Granted it may be overkill for most users, but we record multiple tracks simultaneously all the time (usually 8, sometimes 16 at a time).
For us this setup has helped with stability/performance.
So I thought I'd mention one tip I always try to use; separate drives.

When I find this option in other DAWs I'll do much the same thing by the way. Just seems to make sense. If they let me select the Temp Audio Directory I think it through and keep it separate if possible.

I don't think the Temp Audio directory is actually 'cleaned up' of the chunks of data until you close out of RB. They just aren't used anymore once the song is saved. They get deleted when RB is closed.
I wonder if this is one reason some people swear by restarting RB every hour.
With the setup above we do 2-3 hour sessions of multitrack recording regularly (at least twice a week) and don't have many issues.

If you are crashing often, open your Temp Audio Directory in Windows File Explorer and see what kind of audio files are there.

Last edited by rharv; 06/06/19 12:38 PM.

I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
RealBand
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Many moons ago before I new about defrag and interleaving this tool got me out of the woods never to defrag again.
AnalogX Interleaver.


John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.wintertexaninfo.com/BANDS/JohnnyD.php
RealBand
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 416
Journeyman
OP Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 416
Audio Temp Directory
C:\Users\HENRY_~1\AppData\Local\Temp\

500GB hard drive - 130GB Free

5% fragmented - left it there

Some more strangeness..
Song is 4.11 Minutes long.
Laid down the vocals yesterday. Recorded fine to just past 60% then started stuttering.
Ended up recording the song in two halves


I'm doing allright for Country Trash ....

I used to care, but things have changed (Bob Dylan)

BIAB 2022W + RB
M-Audio FastTrack C600, Rode NT2-A
Digitech VoiceLive 4

Epiphone Sheraton, Ibanez 12str, Washburn 6str, Cort 6Str Nylon
Yanagisawa Tenor Sax

RealBand
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Expert
Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Originally Posted By: CountryTrash
Audio Temp Directory
C:\Users\HENRY_~1\AppData\Local\Temp\

500GB hard drive - 130GB Free

5% fragmented - left it there

Some more strangeness..
Song is 4.11 Minutes long.
Laid down the vocals yesterday. Recorded fine to just past 60% then started stuttering.
Ended up recording the song in two halves




Hmm
You are a bit close to the edge there, may well pay to defrag and gain that 5%.
its a bit tight if you are using a lot of temp audio and buffers etc.
just my thoughts
Mike


BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro
Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth
Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt

http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
RealBand
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,693
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,693
I've read for years to NEVER defrag SSD's.

As for the problems, I would start with your system, run Disc Cleanup, clear temp files, the recycle bin, all that kind of thing. Then run an A/V scan plus Malwarebytes. You can also check your system performance by running Geekbench and give us the score. Your CPU is a 6 year old dual core, kind of lower end but it should be good enough if the system is clean. If you haven't reinstalled or done a Windows repair in all that time you may need to do that. Windows is notorious for clogging up over that many years and many times you can't do anything about it other than do a fresh install. Many people do that routinely every year or two until they retire the machine.

Secondly, you list the Windows audio driver but you also list an M Audio Fast Track interface. Are you using the M Audio, does it have a native ASIO driver and are you using it? If so, what buffer settings?

Bob


Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
RealBand
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,161
M-Audio interface and Windows Audio driver may indeed be part of the issue ..
Good catch


I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support

Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.

Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support

Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins

Join the conversation on our forum.

Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac Videos

With the release of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac, we’re rolling out a collection of brand-new videos on our YouTube channel. We’ll also keep this forum post updated so you can easily find all the latest videos in one convenient spot.

From overviews of new features and walkthroughs of the 202 new RealTracks, to highlights of XPro Styles PAK 8, Xtra Styles PAKs 18, the 2025 49-PAK, and in-depth tutorials — you’ll find everything you need to explore what’s new in Band-in-a-Box® 2025.

Reference this forum post for One-Stop Shopping of our Band-in-a-Box® 2025 Mac Videos — we’ll be adding more videos as they’re released!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac is Here!

Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac is here, packed with major new features and an incredible collection of available new content! This includes 202 RealTracks (in Sets 449-467), plus 20 bonus Unreleased RealTracks in the 2025 49-PAK. There are new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 4, two new sets of “RealDrums Stems,” XPro Styles PAK 8, Xtra Styles PAK 19, and more!

Special Offers
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac with savings of up to 50% on most upgrade packages during our special—available until July 31, 2025! Visit our Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.

2025 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK Add-ons
We've packed our Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK with some incredible Add-ons! The Free Bonus PAK is automatically included with most Band-in-a-Box® for Mac 2025 packages, but for even more Add-ons (including 20 Unreleased RealTracks!) upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49. You can see the full lists of items in each package, and listen to demos here.

If you have any questions, feel free to connect with us directly—we’re here to help!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 Italian Version is Here!

Cari amici
È stata aggerate la versione in Italiano del programma più amato dagli appassionati di musica, il nostro Band-in-a-Box.
Questo è il link alla nuova versione 2025.

Di seguito i link per scaricare il pacchetti di lingua italiana aggiornati per Band-in-a-Box e RealBand, anche per chi avesse già comprato la nuova versione in inglese.

Band-in-a-Box 2025 - Italiano
RealBand 2025 - Italiano

Band-in-a-Box 2025 French Version is Here!

Bonjour à tous,

Band-in-a-Box® 2025 pour Windows est disponible en Français.
Le téléchargement se fait à partir du site PG Music

Pour ceux qui auraient déjà acheté la version 2025 de Band-in-a-Box (et qui donc ont une version anglaise), il est possible de "franciser" cette version avec les patchs suivants:

BIAB 2025 - francisation
RealBand 2025 - francisation

Voilà, enjoy!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 German Version is Here!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 für Windows Deutsch ist verfügbar!

Die deutsche Version Band-in-a-Box® 2025 für Windows ist ab sofort verfügbar!

Alle die bereits die englische Version von Band-in-a-Box und RealBand 2024 installiert haben, finden hier die Installationsdateien für das Sprachenupdate:

https://nn.pgmusic.com/pgfiles/languagesupport/deutsch2025.exe
https://nn.pgmusic.com/pgfiles/languagesupport/deutsch2025RB.exe

Update Your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 to Build 1128 for Windows Today!

Already using Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows®? Download Build 1128 now from our Support Page to enjoy the latest enhancements and improvements from our team.

Stay up to date—get the latest update now!

Forum Statistics
Forums58
Topics84,276
Posts777,225
Members39,608
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
Newest Members
ranvidlor, mario39956, Mtbowe, emorrison1962, mariaedinson3
39,609 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 151
zedd 119
DC Ron 103
WaoBand 101
nonchai 100
rsdean 89
Today's Birthdays
MoBuc, pinot1947
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5