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#558363 - 10/09/19 12:01 AM [Songwriting] False chords: 3 questions
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
"You can type any chord progression and BIAB will play something else instead". Maybe this saying would fit better to the presentation videos... Real Tracks sound really good if only they were right... Since I purchased BIAB I'm still struggling with this same issue. Typing C7 and listening C7#9 or whatever BIAB decides. Gone through the settings hundred times, typing only simple triads and adding the extended notes on another track...

1. Anybody knows if the 2019-Version improved in this topic?


I regenerate an instrument 5-6 times and if I'm lucky I get the right chords once on the chorus once on the verse etc. and then I can cut and put them together in my DAW.

2. Anybody knows if I can regenerate only a section of a track (for example 8 bars) in the 2019-Version?


A Real Track bass will often approach the next chord chromatically. It may play f# over a Dm7-Chord if the next chord is a G7, which doesn't sound very nice.

1. Anybody knows if we can sort this out in the 2019-Version?


I think if a musician can't play a Dm9-Chord and plays a Dm7 or even a simple Dm instead is no big deal. But playing something else (like Dm6) all the time is a no go and someone should rap his fingers...
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You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

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https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#558389 - 10/09/19 03:23 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
Hi Musicheart,

BIAB changes chords unless the user tells it to do so. To stop that happening, do the following...

1. right-click your mouse on the chord sheet

2. select "Song Settings" from the menu that appears

3. select "Force Simple Arrangement" (#3 on the image below). This is telling BIAB not to embellish the chords but to play what's entered on the chordsheet.

4. also set 'Natural Arrangement' to disabled (#2 on the image below)

Now if you type in chords, BIAB will play them if they were recorded by the Realtrack artist.

Regards,
Noel


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#558390 - 10/09/19 03:27 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
In relation to question #2...

BIAB doesn't yet allow for generation of sections. Realband does allow this, though.


And for question 3...

I've noticed the semitone step sometimes with jazz base in particular. As far as I know, a user cannot control the individual notes of a Realtrack.
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#558396 - 10/09/19 04:58 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 14102
Loc: Hamlin NY
MarioD Offline
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Registered: 12/27/03
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Loc: Hamlin NY
Originally Posted By: Noel96
............................
And for question 3...

I've noticed the semitone step sometimes with jazz base in particular. As far as I know, a user cannot control the individual notes of a Realtrack.


Noel is correct in that you cannot control individual Realtrack notes. But with Melodyne Editor you can change individual Realtrack notes. It is an expensive workaround, approximately $400 USD, but is does work.

Note that I do not work for Melodyne. My comments are from experience only.
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#558399 - 10/09/19 05:14 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 12/20/16
Posts: 908
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
Teunis Offline
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Registered: 12/20/16
Posts: 908
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
Have you tried opening the song in RealBand and using the MultiRiff on the part of the track you want to change. I also found changing a part from one RealTrack to another can sometimes make things better. I had a part where the piano sounded fairly sick - changed the RealTrack to a similar piano track and it cleaned it up.

Just a thought. Changing stuff in Melodyne requires a lot of patience by my experience.

Tony
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#558401 - 10/09/19 05:37 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 3312
Loc: Ontario, Canada
BlueAttitude Offline
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Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 3312
Loc: Ontario, Canada
I've used melodyne here to change bass notes from time to time, wasn't hard to do as long as it's just a few that need changing. I've also used it to tighten up the timing on some realtrack bass parts.
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#558445 - 10/09/19 01:14 PM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 6255
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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The "new for 2019" plug-in has the capability to regenerate highlighted bars in both the Windows and Mac plug-ins.
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Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
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#558446 - 10/09/19 01:19 PM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 16598
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
The "new for 2019" plug-in has the capability to regenerate highlighted bars in both the Windows and Mac plug-ins.

Thanks for mentioning this, Jim. The plugin slipped my mind.

Noel
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#558512 - 10/10/19 04:51 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 5745
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Posts: 5745
Loc: South Carolina
The short answers to your 3 questions

1. yes
2. yes
3. yes

1. Anybody knows if we can sort this out in the 2019-Version?

Yes.

In 2019-Version, 2018,17,16,15,14 and earlier.
Yes, BIAB has the tools, procedures, and techniques to accomplish those tasks you listed without ever leaving the program.

The solution will always be specific to the song and the issue when trying to correct it in BIAB. The solution for most can be accomplished easier, though not necessarily quicker, moving toward a solution away from BIAB to another software such as Melodyne or DAW where their knowledge base is greater than they have for advanced or little used BIAB tools, procedures and techniques.

For most, actually all, it's easier, more intuitive, visual and comfortable to move to other software and DAW's. But your issues (and more) can certainly be corrected and fixed in BIAB. Folks choose not to do it, not that it can't be done.






Edited by Charlie Fogle (10/10/19 04:57 AM)
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#558529 - 10/10/19 06:58 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Thanks for answering! I've tried everything you mentioned in the past but no success. I'll keep trying to work around...
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#558531 - 10/10/19 07:00 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Teunis]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Thanks for answering.
I tried RealBand for a couple of days when I purchased BIAB but it crashed so many times that I left it alone since then.
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#558536 - 10/10/19 07:07 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Thanks!

Great! I hope the 2020 BIAB-Version will sort out even more false chords and notes, so that it will be worth upgrading for me. I'm dreaming of a Band where everybody plays right, perfect. (As opposite to composing, typing the chords and after pressing the play-button: "who was it?")
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#558917 - 10/12/19 09:32 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7462
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
jazzmammal Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7462
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
I just listened to your YT vids, very well done especially your vocals. Curious, are these tunes studio productions, did you do some of it or all of it yourself? The mixes are definitely professional as well.

As for Biab, I agree with the suggestion you should be using Real Band. Before I start talking about what you can do with it, there are always a few folks who complain about crashes and they never get into details so they just leave that complaint out there making it look like RB has serious problems. Not true at all. When someone actually explains what they're doing and lets us work it out for them it always turns out to be something with their system or configurations. RB is pretty stable. I would suggest you try RB again and if you start having it crashing note exactly what you were trying to do, what you did and how you did it and start a new topic in the RB forum. Tell us about your system, how it's set up, what you're using for sound, is it all audio, any midi, all that kind of thing. And watch all the RB videos too.

Your music is very good and interesting, you don't need to be this frustrated we can help you.

Bob
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#559517 - 10/17/19 02:54 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Originally Posted By: jazzmammal
I just listened to your YT vids, very well done especially your vocals. Curious, are these tunes studio productions, did you do some of it or all of it yourself? The mixes are definitely professional as well.

As for Biab, I agree with the suggestion you should be using Real Band. Before I start talking about what you can do with it, there are always a few folks who complain about crashes and they never get into details so they just leave that complaint out there making it look like RB has serious problems. Not true at all. When someone actually explains what they're doing and lets us work it out for them it always turns out to be something with their system or configurations. RB is pretty stable. I would suggest you try RB again and if you start having it crashing note exactly what you were trying to do, what you did and how you did it and start a new topic in the RB forum. Tell us about your system, how it's set up, what you're using for sound, is it all audio, any midi, all that kind of thing. And watch all the RB videos too.

Your music is very good and interesting, you don't need to be this frustrated we can help you.

Bob




Thanks for your answer Bob.

I'm glad you like my tracks. Indeed I composed the music, performed the guitars, programmed the MIDI tracks, recorded my female vocalist and sound-engineered the tracks myself. The newest versions are slightly improved (smoother bass, more transparency etc.) I purchased BIAB in order to speed up my workflow and most of all to make everything sound more organic. I know BIAB has great stuff for practicing and learning. But for the experienced ones, who know exactly what they want, who spent weeks working on a track and flipped around 100 times every single note, engaging someone who’s playing false chords or notes it's just not fair. Maybe in this case, or till it's fixed in the next version, I'd say: "Warning: this RealTrack doesn't support every chord you typed. You may listen other harmonies after rendering. Proceed?" OK, that would be a matter of choice.

By the way, I like BAIB. I still export and use some RealTracks. And MIDI tracks as well, they are not flat, they have been performed by someone and that sounds pretty organic, on keys for instance.

If you are a member of PG Music staff I’d be glad to send you in detail what I did with RealBand and when it crashed. As well as some other issues I consider absolutely essential (respectively no go).

Thank you
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#560724 - 10/25/19 08:49 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7462
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
jazzmammal Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 7462
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
Had a very busy week and missed this post. This forum is for users talking to users nobody is staff here other than an occasional post by a staff person answering a very specific issue.

After reading your explanation of what you do and listening to your songs Biab is not well suited for you as far as a finished porduct is concerned. You do not have note level control over the RT's or RD's. They are prerecorded audio phrases. As for chord control you can turn off the Natural Arrangement function plus turn on the Jazz Down the chords function. That should help that part a lot. Still, you write a lot of specific phrases and rhythmic parts that Biab cannot do for you.

What it can do is create the overall feel of a new song using different styles and you have control of the song form. It's very good at giving you new ideas by changing those things and hearing what it comes up with including creating new melodies.

Bob
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#561946 - 11/01/19 12:32 PM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: jazzmammal]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
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Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Thanks for the answer Bob

I think I make the best out of BIAB. I type the chords, create parts, copy and paste them, try melodies over them and then I export the MIDI and audio files. I import everything in my DAW, add some new stuff, do the whole sound engineering and everything sounds good, pretty organic. The thing with the false chords, well, somehow I manage it to work around it. I think without this issues BIAB would be genious. Instead of arranging musicians, recording them (and paying them :-), letting BIAB do the job almost just as good.

Best regards, Jannis


Originally Posted By: jazzmammal
Had a very busy week and missed this post. This forum is for users talking to users nobody is staff here other than an occasional post by a staff person answering a very specific issue.

After reading your explanation of what you do and listening to your songs Biab is not well suited for you as far as a finished porduct is concerned. You do not have note level control over the RT's or RD's. They are prerecorded audio phrases. As for chord control you can turn off the Natural Arrangement function plus turn on the Jazz Down the chords function. That should help that part a lot. Still, you write a lot of specific phrases and rhythmic parts that Biab cannot do for you.

What it can do is create the overall feel of a new song using different styles and you have control of the song form. It's very good at giving you new ideas by changing those things and hearing what it comes up with including creating new melodies.

Bob
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#570655 - 12/15/19 12:04 PM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
The "new for 2019" plug-in has the capability to regenerate highlighted bars in both the Windows and Mac plug-ins.


I've installed BIAB 2020 but I haven't yet figured out how to regenerate highlighted bars only. Could you help me?

Thanks, Jannis


Edited by MusicHeart (12/16/19 12:58 AM)
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#572630 - 12/27/19 10:03 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
MusicHeart Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 21
Loc: Berlin, Germany
I've installed BIAB 2020 but I haven't yet figured out how to regenerate highlighted bars only. Could you help me?

Thanks, Jannis
Originally Posted By: Noel96
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
The "new for 2019" plug-in has the capability to regenerate highlighted bars in both the Windows and Mac plug-ins.

Thanks for mentioning this, Jim. The plugin slipped my mind.

Noel
_________________________
BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/



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#573290 - 12/31/19 06:19 AM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 02/05/17
Posts: 57
Loc: OH
wrayer Offline
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Registered: 02/05/17
Posts: 57
Loc: OH
Thanks for that info! I was not aware of the right-click option or the ability to simplify the chords BiaB created. Again, thanks for that tip!
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#574145 - 01/04/20 05:56 PM [Songwriting] Re: False chords: 3 questions [Re: MusicHeart]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 6255
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 6255
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Hi MusicHeart,

The "new for 2020" multiriffs feature in Band-in-a-Box generates 7 variations of a selected part of a song. The multiriffs are saved as 7 files and can be accessed from the Drop Station (noted by the green highlight of the [WAV] box).

To use the feature, click on any track radio button at the top of the screen. The track button can be either one with an instrument or a blank track. Then right-click (or double-click) on it and go to Select RealTracks | Generate MultiRiffs (for whole/part of song).

You will see a dialog with a list of available RealTracks. Select a RealTrack and press OK.

Choose the range of the song, or the whole song, and press OK.

The 7 MultiRiffs are generated. You can find them in your C:\bb\DragDrop folder.
_________________________
Jim Fogle - 2020 BiaB (725) RB (Build 4) Ultra+ PAK
Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 2004, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
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