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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
Hello:
I have traditionally used the stand-alone instance of BiaB and my workflow is to create chord progressions, apply a style and play the sequence created. I can then quickly change a style and playback to audition different styles to find good fits. Once I have the progression correct & have applied the correct style I can generate the digital audio, which is handy.
When using the VSTi it seems like I have to generate the digital audio each time after changing a style to allow playback. Is this correct? Is there some way to just use the VSTi as an in-DAW sequence generator/MIDI sound source?
Thanks in advance,
J
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
PS- really what I am looking for is just a quick "audition" of chords & style within my DAW using the BiaB VSTi, without the constant need for extended periods of track regeneration even after a simple set of changes to the chords or style.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,974
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,974 |
If you want to use your actual chords in your song (rather than just hear a pre-made demo) then it does need to be generated and rendered before you can hear it. One thing you could do is (temporarily) reduce the number of bars/choruses in your song while your demoing styles.
Andrew
PG Music Inc.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
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...Is there some way to just use the VSTi as an in-DAW sequence generator/MIDI sound source?
Thanks in advance,
J You can just generate up midi tracks that is very quick, Generate > Custom > All pages (midi only) you set the tracks to sync by double clicking on the track drag icon until it turns blue you can chain a gm soundfont player or Apple DLS synth after the BiabPlugin or create a midi send with them on another track.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
andrew/pipeline:
thanks for your replies. its unfortunate that the vsti doesnt have the same capability as the stand-alone (although the vsti has some not found in the stand-alone).
pipeline: it does sound like there are some workflow workarounds. can you help me understand the suggestion you made, please?
* generating midi is quick, is there any way to automate it? maybe after each style change (which is kinda what i think the stand-alone does)?
*can you explain the track sync you mentioned in your second item, please? ive searched on this and cant quite understand.
* i have ni kontakt libraries that i can use as a sound source with midi generated in biab. how can i create the midi send from biab that i can route to a kontakt track?
im also trying to understand if i might be better to use the standalone biab app and route this to my daw.
thanks in advance,
j
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 354
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 354 |
Hi Jaschoon,
I have dealt with more or less the same issue, but in my workflow I've started using Song Form Dialogue in BIAB Stand Alone.
I create my parts A, B, C etc just using either Piano or Guitar to have as little of each part to render as possible. Once I'm happy with the chord progression in each part, then I choose instruments or styles until I am satisfied. I usually save a master SGU file, and work in a copy where I replace the instruments. I never use more than 4 tracks in BIAB for rendering....for my Old 2011 MacBook Pro QUAD Core - this has proven to be quite time saving.
I know it was not the exact solution, but maybe gives a hint or an idea for changing your work flow - or realizing that your flow is far superior than mine :-)
Last edited by Peters Garage; 04/24/20 07:55 AM.
MacMini M1 - BIAB2021 - Logic Pro X - iZotope Music Production Suite - Scaler 2 - far too many Waves plugins and Line 6 Guitars and boards + a fantastic Yamaha THR10ll mini Amp - Avid MBOX Studio
Peters' Garage is available on all major streaming services
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,974
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,974 |
* generating midi is quick, is there any way to automate it? maybe after each style change (which is kinda what i think the stand-alone does)? If you select a MIDI style in the StylePicker (you can identify them because they do not start with an underscore character), then song generation will indeed be quicker because RealTracks do not need to be generated. If you are trying out different chord progressions, you could temporarily select an all MIDI style to audition your chords quickly, and then switch back to your RealStyle (with RealTracks) once you are happy with your chord sequence. With a RealStyle, song generation time depends on the length of your song, and the number of RealTracks you have. In the Band-in-a-Box program (not plugin), song generation seems quick, because the program starts playing after it has generated the first few measures. It then continues generating "under the hood" while your song is playing. So you might simulate this by temporarily making your song really short, say 4-8 measures - just while you are auditioning. I would not be a bad idea for us to have an option to generate just the first four bars automatically. Pipeline may have a different idea but about this, I'm not sure. *can you explain the track sync you mentioned in your second item, please? ive searched on this and cant quite understand. Yes, if you are using the plugin inside a DAW, then you can double-click on a track icon inside the plugin (it will turn blue), and this will "sync" that track to your DAW. So when you press Play in your DAW, then plugin will start playing that track at the same time. This is useful for example if you haven't dragged the track into your DAW and are still experimenting with different instruments. * i have ni kontakt libraries that i can use as a sound source with midi generated in biab. how can i create the midi send from biab that i can route to a kontakt track? Well.. with the Band-in-a-Box Plugin, you cannot select a MIDI synth to play your track. While you are auditioning inside the plugin it is playing rendered wave files. If you have MIDI tracks, you can drag them into your DAW. Inside your DAW you will choose your VSTi / MIDI synth, or whatever is available for MIDI playback from your DAW. In the full Band-in-a-Box program you can choose a specific VSTi for each MIDI track similar to how you can do in your DAW. You would click on the Plugin tab of the Mixer Window and click on where it says "[none]".
Last edited by Andrew - PG Music; 04/24/20 08:16 AM.
Andrew
PG Music Inc.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
everyone: thanks very much for your thoughts. i am going to spend some time this weekend working through all of the suggestions. ill report back soon!
cheers!
j
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
one other last thought-
in the initial stages of song development im not planning to use real tracks, just midi. the first part of the process (similar to my previous process using older versions of biab) will be just entering chords and auditioning styles with these. my hope is that i can minimize and automate quick style auditions.
once i find a progression/song and style that i like i will likely save the file as a biab project, whether stand-alone or vst. from there i will copy the midi file from the stand-alone to my daw and route through kontakt for midi playback OR i will drag real audio tracks from the vst.
the question will be stand-alone vs. vst- how can i do the chord/style audition in the quickest, most seamless way.
thx
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
Veteran
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Veteran
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Posts: 7,954 |
Yes if you just use Midi Styles/Tracks it's quick to regenerate changes. If you have Kontakt just load it after the Biab Plugin or create a midi send from the Biab track to another track with Kontakt on. I don't know what DAW/s you are using to create a midi send. *can you explain the track sync you mentioned in your second item, please? ive searched on this and cant quite understand. That has been asked a million times. I have asked PG for over a year to make this easy to sync play tracks and have solo and mute buttons on the track but for some reason they have refused to do it and would rather users be confused and give up with the plugin. I haven't tried it on Mac but with "Generate > Custom > All pages (midi only)" it generates midi only for the first page but the other pages it generates up the wav as well so there is a bug that needs fixing as this will take a lot more time generating. Look in the Win Plugin forum there are lots of guides. Send Midi Out of BiabVst to Kontakt..the midi tracks on the first page of the BIAB VST output to the standard BIAB midi default channels:
Track Channel
Bass 2
Piano 3
Melody 4
Thru 5
Guitar 6
Strings 7
Soloist 8
Drums 10
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
Veteran
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Veteran
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im also trying to understand if i might be better to use the standalone biab app and route this to my daw. I'm have been asking PG to create a small vst that will sync Biab main app to any DAW, so you simply load that vst in your DAW and it will send the transport messages to the Biab app. The audio can be sent with AUNetSend AUNetReceive plugins that come with mac.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10 |
sorry about the delay in replying. i have done some work with both interfaces and am close to the thoughts i have on each/both.
i can say, pipeline, that i agree with your idea right off the bat. there is a disconnect between the full biab app and the in-daw vsti. one quick win would be make the full app capable of syncing with a given daw. the longer solution is to flesh out the vsti to have all of the functionality of the full app.
id also like to see non-rendered midi playback in the vsti, which i use in the full app.
i hope to have more thoughts shortly.
j
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Newbie
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OP
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2014
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one other thing- i am really happy overall to be using band-in-a-box again. it IS a pretty outstanding tool. 
Last edited by jaschoon; 05/07/20 11:59 AM.
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