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#622501 - 11/10/20 02:04 AM [RealBand] Windows or Mac...?
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
I'm looking to buy BIAB in the next few weeks.

Now I understand that the Mac version of BIAB doesn't come with RealBand.

I have access to both Windows and Mac but much prefer Mac for everyday use.

So my question is this, how much easier is it to use RB over CakeWalk, Garageband etc..?

I'm really not used to using software to create music and to be honest, I'm not looking forward to spending hours learning how to do it. I'd rather be playing guitar...!

I don't play keys and I want to use BIAB to create backing tracks for my acoustic based duo.

I've researched the web for clues, but can only find people saying you should use whichever DAW you find easiest, which doesn't really help me. I get that there is a learning curve for each and that they will all do the job.

So is there a good case for going with RB, bearing in mind my desire for ease of use...?

Looking forward to your opinions.

Graham

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#622508 - 11/10/20 03:30 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1242
Loc: UK
Bob Calver Online   content
Expert

Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1242
Loc: UK
you are going to have to learn to use any new program. BIAB and RB work so closely together I'd suggest RB. it opens BIAB files, has BIAB generation capabilities and offers easy access to all your RealTracks.

and just a bit of advice, the Windows version of BIAB 2021 will be coming out earlier than the Mac version.

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#622509 - 11/10/20 03:32 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
MY GODS HONEST OPINION GRAHAM.
ive been into the crazy song gig for too long. lol.
i do it cos i'm a sucker for work. lol.
but if you LOVE it like i do. one just gets on with it.
the TRUTH is there is a learning curve to whatever platform
(win or mac) that you choose, and whatever software you choose.
there is no way to sugar coat it mate.

to do it properly, you need to understand well your computer environment (my advice keep your music computer off the net.)
AND you need to understand well the tools you will be useing.

so the best thing is, to do it in bite sized chunks you can handle. and take it easy , one step at a time.

the above is THE TRUTH.
i sincerely wish you every happiness in doing your music.
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#622512 - 11/10/20 04:27 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Thanks Bob, good advice as usual.

Speak soon..!


Old Muso, thanks for your honest advice. I hadn't considered keeping a computer just for music production, I'll consider doing that if I go down the Windows route.

I'm prepared for the learning curve that goes with any new system but for now I'm more interested in the relative advantages of using RB over any other DAW in respect of integration with BIAB.

Graham

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#622526 - 11/10/20 06:34 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 15247
Loc: Hamlin NY
MarioD Offline
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Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 15247
Loc: Hamlin NY
Hi Graham,

IMHO if you are familiar with Cakewalk then I would stay with the Mac. The only thing the 32 bit Realband has over Cakewalk is that it can use native BiaB files. I think Cakewalk is a much better choice then RealBand. YMMV

Also remember that you can use the BiaB VSTi in Cakewalk and possibly Garage Band.

This is just my opinion. I am strictly a Window's user and I have little Mac experience. Hopefully Matt, who uses both PCs and Macs will shine in on this thread.
_________________________
I'm the best man at my buddy's second wedding. Is it appropriate to open my dinner speech with "Welcome back Everyone"?

64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB and RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software and some hardware.

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#622577 - 11/10/20 09:34 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Hi Mario

Just to clarify, I'm not used to using any software when it comes to creating music.

I downloaded Cakewalk last week just to try it out with a MIDI controller I bought in preparation for getting BIAB. I haven't got a clue what I'm doing with it and I don't want to go further down that rabbit hole if I'm going to end up using RB.

My brain is easily overloaded so I'd like to keep it clear for the system I'll eventually be using...!!

So you see, I'm starting with a blank sheet and I'm happy to use whichever DAW works easiest with BIAB.

My MIDI controller came bundled with Ableton Live Lite, so yet another option

I'd prefer the Mac but if RB is easier to use with BIAB then I'm happy to use my Windows laptop.

Hope that explains things a bit better.

Cheers

Graham

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#622602 - 11/10/20 11:55 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 15247
Loc: Hamlin NY
MarioD Offline
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Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 15247
Loc: Hamlin NY
Since you are starting with a "blank sheet" then I change my opinion to Windows and use RealBand. It is a perfect match for BiaB and number of members here produce pro sounding songs with it. If in the future you want to pursue other DAWs the transition shouldn't be that hard.


Edited by MarioD (11/10/20 11:56 AM)
_________________________
I'm the best man at my buddy's second wedding. Is it appropriate to open my dinner speech with "Welcome back Everyone"?

64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB and RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software and some hardware.

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#622633 - 11/10/20 05:16 PM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: MarioD]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
graham.
question.
do you already have a low latency usb asio interface
of some sort ? or yet to buy an audio interface
for your machines ??

also read this thread sometime bout buying refurbs
(maybe for future use.) where pg simon and i discuss refurbs, and why they are good rather than buying new machines.
https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=621858#Post621858
go down a few posts to "amazeing xeon refurb deals"
then read further down etc. just in case you ever need a machine again.
you will have the same in france i'm sure.


best
oldmuso.
ps i used to love haveing b'fast in the little freanch cafes.
i miss them.


Edited by justanoldmuso (11/10/20 05:22 PM)
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#622666 - 11/11/20 12:35 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: MarioD]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: MarioD
Since you are starting with a "blank sheet" then I change my opinion to Windows and use RealBand. It is a perfect match for BiaB and number of members here produce pro sounding songs with it. If in the future you want to pursue other DAWs the transition shouldn't be that hard.


Thanks again Mario...

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#622667 - 11/11/20 01:24 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Hi Old Muso

I have one of these...

https://www.roland.com/uk/products/tri-capture/

Would that be ok for me...?

I bought it a few years ago as a "that might come in handy one day" moment....!

I've used it a couple of times, although not for recording.

I read the thread about buying refurb machines, unfortunately for me you guys are talking a different language. I tried using Google Translate, but it didn't help much...!!

I have a couple of old laptops, one running Win 10 and an older one running on elastic bands. But my financial adviser has ruled out me buying any new gear. She's told me it's strictly 'one out, one in' for the time being, although she might make an exception if I'd like to buy her a new dress..

So it's an existing laptop for me, or my Mac. I'm leaning now towards keeping with Windows for BIAB.

Cheers

Graham

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#622669 - 11/11/20 02:25 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
graham. bonjour.
on the surface that tricapture looks good.
tres bien. make sure you have latest drivers.
looks very nice.
you will only know by trying it.
remember in windows you need to set it up as your default device. THEN in your recording software in preferences
you must point the recording software at it so the
recording software knows to use it instead of built in sound.
one thing you might do is test its latency.

also i would advise use of a condenser mic cos they dont need as much mic pre gain as dynamics.
do you have a condenser mic ??
problem is a lot of audio interfaces dont have mic pres with lots of gain.

graham.
if you DO need a cheap good condenser mic.
1. isk pearl amazeing price. 30 buks !
heres singer examples.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-hWUSM20VA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTI1NKbMdIk


2. mxl 770 cheap.under 100 buks.
heres a singer example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBmEXZoRSPo

if you want lotsa info on gear/computers (for people with little money for gear)
check out the low end theory and music computer forums at gearslutz.com

also please open up realband on your win pc, and run the feature "TEST AUDIO PERFORMANCE". tell me how many traks are reported s'il vous plait. merci.

also in your win and mac machines do you have solid state drives ? details on your machines processors //drives//ram
would help.

if no ssd on win pc for example do you have a usb 3 or superspeed usb port on it ??
note DO NOT use the 96k setting on the tricapture.
its only half duplex it looks like.
ie not record and playback at same time.
stick to 44.1.

best.
muso
ps would suggest you go on the net, and do lots of research bout optimising computers for studio work etc.
as well as google tricapture any problems/latency issues.
and buy your wife that dress. well thats what my wife the boss told me to tell you. lol.





Edited by justanoldmuso (11/11/20 04:16 AM)
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#622677 - 11/11/20 04:59 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Thanks Muso

Interesting point about latency. The other evening, I connected the controller to my laptop vis usb and there was huge problem with latency, nearly half a second...!!

It was ok to explore the sounds on Cakewalk, but it's impossible to actually play a tune. I'll hook up the Roland tonight and report back.

I have a couple of condenser mics, a Neumann and an EV. I've used the Neumann live for years, it's way ahead of any other mic I've ever used.

The Ti-Capture provides 48v, so no problem there.

I'll be buying BIAB in the next few weeks, so I'm still deciding which version to get.

I've looked underneath my laptop, it's a Toshiba C660D-140. That's all I know about it, I bought it a couple of years ago and I believe it's about 5 years old. Sorry if that doesn't help any.

If it's not up the job, I'll have to explore the possibility of buying another machine, but I really don't want to.

You'll have gathered by now that technology is not my strong point.

But show me a guitar and an amp with knobs on and I'm away..!

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#622679 - 11/11/20 06:06 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
graham.
ok lets see what we can do with what you have.
without spending any money.
1. mics good. neumann.
2. i looked up your laptop. difficult to tell without more info.
lots of toshiba satellites over the years. did you buy it new ??
is this yours.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Toshiba-Satellite-C660D-140.60521.0.html
but lets work with what you have.
3. VERY IMPORTANT OPEN REALBAND IN TOSHIBA.
(when you get biab/rb)
at top of RB is ACTION. go to action>>test audio performance.
TELL ME WHAT RB DISPLAYS AS POTENTIAL NUMBER OF TRAKS.
THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT SO I CAN HELP YOU.
4. VERY IMPORTANT TELL ME HOW MANY USB PORTS OTHER THAN USED BY MOUSE ETC. ie NO OF FREE USB PORTS.
5.. do you have headphones and some monitoring speakers ??

adieu
muso.


Edited by justanoldmuso (11/11/20 06:20 AM)
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#622705 - 11/11/20 08:52 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Thanks Muso

Yes, that seems to be my machine.

I have two usb ports, one is used for the mouse.

As mentioned earlier, I bought it about two years ago and I think it's about 5 years old.

I hope to get BIAB in the next few weeks, I hope there'll be some offers in time for Christmas. I'll be using headphones for monitoring.

I'll get back to you with the other information once I've purchased BIAB.

Graham

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#622719 - 11/11/20 10:31 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
graham.
please could you tell me the model of mac you have, and
as much info as you can ? i'm trying to get a complete picture.
mac mini ? macbook ? imac ?? processor model/ram/drives ssd ? etc.

how bout this for an ACTION PLAN plan as the win laptop is a possible iffy situation.
(ill explain in a sec.)
explain to pg that you might have to return the win version of biab if its a problem on your win laptop and then try the mac version. (but of course no realband on mac. but there
are other fine programs on mac like logic pro. but they dont have the unique realband accompaniement feature.)
you have 30 days to return.

although your win laptop probably meets biab basic pc requirement its not ideal.
(i use i5 laptop with ssd plus external ssd. plus several usb ports.)
i have the following concerns with your win laptop.
given the info you gave.
1. looks like it uses the older amd processor.
2. a slow older internal hard drive rather than an ssd.
3. if thats your laptop in the picture, then only 2 gigs of ram.
4. the one spare usb port only.

its your choice of course.
maybe the prudent course as you dont want to spend money,
is just try biab on the win laptop as it stands, and see how much you can do with it ?.

bit of a problem this one lol.
anyhoo give me that mac info please. so i can offer alternatives.

best.
muso.


Edited by justanoldmuso (11/11/20 10:31 AM)
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#622728 - 11/11/20 12:39 PM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
My iMac is a 27" mid-2011.

Its current OS doesn't support Logic but Garageband works fine and I know BIAB will be fine with that.

But from what I'm picking up so far, Windows is looking good from the apparent ease of integration with RB. Which is my main concern.

I'll also contact PG Music to see what they say.

Cheers

Graham

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#622734 - 11/11/20 01:46 PM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
graham.
this your imac. i assume.
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/specs/imac-core-i5-2.7-27-inch-aluminum-mid-2011-thunderbolt-specs.html

good machine. but apple class as vintage it seems.
pretty decent i5 processor.
will also take ssd's it looks like.

tell pg you have this machine.

please tell me how long to boot from turning power on.
also how long does gband take to boot up.
is everything instant/snappy ??
or takes long time.

did you put any options in this imac when bought originally ?? did you ever do any upgrades ??//add ons ??

for lots of info on your imac go to.
www.gearslutz.com and in search enter 2011 imac.
loads of info. studio people/tecchies useing it in the past and probably still today etc etc.
but talk to pg as i said.


best
muso


Edited by justanoldmuso (11/11/20 01:55 PM)
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#622752 - 11/11/20 04:08 PM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: justanoldmuso]
Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 589
Simon - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 589
Originally Posted By: justanoldmuso
graham.
this your imac. i assume.
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/specs/imac-core-i5-2.7-27-inch-aluminum-mid-2011-thunderbolt-specs.html

good machine. but apple class as vintage it seems.
pretty decent i5 processor.
will also take ssd's it looks like.

tell pg you have this machine.

please tell me how long to boot from turning power on.
also how long does gband take to boot up.
is everything instant/snappy ??
or takes long time.

did you put any options in this imac when bought originally ?? did you ever do any upgrades ??//add ons ??

for lots of info on your imac go to.
www.gearslutz.com and in search enter 2011 imac.
loads of info. studio people/tecchies useing it in the past and probably still today etc etc.
but talk to pg as i said.


best
muso


I'm personally using a "vintage" 2012 Macbook Pro (15" Retina, quad i7, 8gb, 256gb SSD) and another "vintage" 2009 Mac Pro (heavily upgraded of course - GTX 960 4gb, 48gb ram, 512gb ssd + 2tb HDD, stock 8 core 2.93ghz for now), and BB works great (as well as Logic and other apps). A 2011 iMac should be fine, as it's at least got a quad core and can have it's ram upgraded. I'd suggest replacing the hard drive with an SSD, of course.


Edited by Simon - PG Music (11/11/20 04:10 PM)
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#622753 - 11/11/20 04:20 PM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Simon - PG Music]
Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
justanoldmuso Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/07/20
Posts: 398
simon.
i'm really glad you responded.(lotsa respect.)
i was hoping you would.
the only thing is he wants RB also.
thus a problem.
note the roland tricapture interface he has.
needs to be set up correctly // drivers for mac etc.

by the way simon. ever checked this out.??
(win//mac//ipad).
has its devotees includeing a very old user on pg from years ago called funnily enough pg user mac !!
he loved MTS.
ive only ever tried on pc. so i dont k now how good on apple.
www.multitrackstudio.com
very large active user forums.
pay once, free upgrades.
give it a go sometime mate. and tell me what you think
but STILL REALBAND IS UNIQUE IN MULTITRACKERS.


graham.
listen to simon.
his info is grrreat,


Edited by justanoldmuso (11/11/20 04:27 PM)
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#622795 - 11/12/20 12:19 AM [RealBand] Re: Windows or Mac...? [Re: Graham W]
Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Graham W Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/02/20
Posts: 17
Loc: France
Thanks for the input guys, unfortunately all the techie talk is waaay above me...!!

It's a mid 2011 iMac, that's all I know. They all look the same to me..!

I did ask for a 2TB drive when I ordered it so that's the only non-standard addition. I regularly update it and it works fine, much faster than either of my Windows laptops.

I'm in the UK at the moment and the Mac is in France so I can't help with further info.


Getting back to my original question, how important is the inclusion of RB in the version I eventually buy...?

As you know, I don't want to spend unnecessary hours on the technical side of things, I just want to create my backing tracks. I'm far more of a musician than a computer guy. But I'm forever grateful for guys like you who understand these dark arts...!

If RB makes my life easier, then that's the version I want. I'll sort out the hardware to actually do it later.

Cheers

Graham

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