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#627486 - 12/04/20 03:55 AM [RealBand] Is 2021 Worth the money.
Registered: 11/26/16
Posts: 375
jonel Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/26/16
Posts: 375
PG Music are charging quite a hefty upgrade to just go from 2020 to 2021 with seemingly little to show that it is worth it. But RB going 64 bit just might.

Any opinions please?

Thanks

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#627497 - 12/04/20 05:43 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Rob Helms Offline
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Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Actually it is the same upgrade as any year. As far as the value. I think so, based on several things I would pay $179 for a package of 202 new RTs (not including the RTs in 49 pak and Xtra Pak) and the new styles. The other things are 64 bit RB, and the new Chord drag feature. These are cool.
_________________________
Lenovo Win 10 8 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2021, Realband, Studio one 4.6 Pro, Logic Pro X, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus Faderport 8, Komplete 49 key controller.

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#627577 - 12/04/20 10:43 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
There are several updates I think make upgrading worthwhile. Here are some that come to mind:

01) The audio editor can now be used on any track.
02) Hi-Q or high quality pitch and time stretching algorithm is available for RealTracks and RealDrums rendering.
03) 16, 24 and 32 bit audio is supported. The rendering default is now 24 bit.
04) Audio rendering is faster and more efficient.
05) Mute and solo mixer settings are song preferences instead of global preferences.
06) When rendering separate track audio files flat and center settings can be used for each track instead of the mixer settings.
07) A track setting enables BiaB to automatically fix "bad" notes in a RealTracks chord so the chord matches the chord sheet. A user can also use the audio editor to manually fix a chord in a audio file.
08) Either the default midi synth or a plugin midi synth can be selected on a per midi track basis.
09) Multiple plugin windows can be open at the same time.
10) You can now copy and move audio from track to track the same as you midi.

Especially when it comes to audio, there is much less reason to move to a DAW other than personal preference. Many things users previously used DAWs for can now be done in BiaB. Not only is there more audio functionality but rendered audio and audio playback will sound better.

My personal opinion is this release is one of the best and most important releases. Improving the audio engine opens to door to a lot of feature improvements and changes that were not previously possible.
_________________________
Jim Fogle - 2021 BiaB (833) RB (Build 5) Ultra+ PAK
Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 2004, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Music at: http://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#627616 - 12/04/20 12:49 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
saxgentleman67 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
Half off seems like a good deal to me.

But I'm not sure about paying the same amount... $200 to get all the style paks ever made?

That's as much as I'm paying for the upgrade to Ultra-Pak plus.

How important are the style paks?

I am planning on using BIAB to record tracks to use as backing tracks for jazz saxophone for professional release.

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#628210 - 12/06/20 12:28 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: saxgentleman67]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Originally Posted By: saxgentleman67
Half off seems like a good deal to me.

But I'm not sure about paying the same amount... $200 to get all the style paks ever made?

That's as much as I'm paying for the upgrade to Ultra-Pak plus.

How important are the style paks?

I am planning on using BIAB to record tracks to use as backing tracks for jazz saxophone for professional release.



That's a personal choice question.

If you normally find a style that matches a song then no, you likely don't need the style paks. After all, they are additional styles that use existing material.

If you can find a style that feels right for a song after you switch out some RealTracks I'd still say no you don't need the style paks.

However, if you find styles that, as soon as you hear them they inspire you, or lead you in a direction you hadn't planned then I'd say yes. The styles in the style paks are inspiring. They have a different sound and feel from the standard styles. This is not a put down of the standard styles but the reason style paks exist is to inspire and offer additional choices. Standard styles exist as a basic building block.
_________________________
Jim Fogle - 2021 BiaB (833) RB (Build 5) Ultra+ PAK
Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 2004, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Music at: http://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#628298 - 12/06/20 07:03 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7959
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7959
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
If you already have BIAB 2020, just get the PlusPak for $99

It comes with the new version of BIAB and RB, plus ONLY the new real tracks and styles. Plus some bonus styles.



Some of the more expensive packages include ALL of the previous styles and realtracks... but if you already have them, why pay more to buy them again?


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#628347 - 12/07/20 02:21 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1297
Loc: UK
Bob Calver Offline
Expert

Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1297
Loc: UK
i bet the RT to midi is a program change not on the actual RealTrack itself. or the installer updates old RTs.

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#628369 - 12/07/20 06:13 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Pat Marr]
Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 1917
Loc: Lake Keowee, South Carolina
MountainSide Offline
Expert

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 1917
Loc: Lake Keowee, South Carolina
Pat, that's a very interesting question! In order to get the midi tracks for previous RT's, does one have to buy the full 2021 version paks or does the PlusPak (with the 2021 BIAB) have the engine to add midi tracks to all previous RT that I might have?

Hopefully one of our beta testers or PG direct can clarify this.

Jeff
_________________________
Win10, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2021, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive Touch, Kontakt 5.8, SampleTank 4.13

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#628389 - 12/07/20 06:50 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Bob Calver]
Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7959
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7959
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Originally Posted By: Bob Calver
i bet the RT to midi is a program change not on the actual RealTrack itself. or the installer updates old RTs.


You might be right Bob. My comprehension takes a few passes through the same information before I "get it"

;-)

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#629694 - 12/12/20 02:37 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Pat Marr]
Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
saxgentleman67 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
Originally Posted By: Pat Marr
If you already have BIAB 2020, just get the PlusPak for $99

It comes with the new version of BIAB and RB, plus ONLY the new real tracks and styles. Plus some bonus styles.

Some of the more expensive packages include ALL of the previous styles and realtracks... but if you already have them, why pay more to buy them again?



I have 2016 Pro, so I was initially just going to go to 2021 BIAB Ultra Pak Plus....thinking that was enough. But then I saw the offer to get all the extra style paks.

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#629699 - 12/12/20 02:42 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
saxgentleman67 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/14/20
Posts: 56
Very useful response Jim. I will probably eventually get them all...but I think maybe later is better than sooner. I really havn't used the program much at all yet. Probably better to see what's there first. I am hoping that the move from Pro to Ultra Pak Plus will give me greater freedom and flexibility.

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#629754 - 12/12/20 06:09 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7312
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
saxgentleman67,

Updating from 2016 to 2021 is a B-I-G jump. I can't even think of all the program changes that have been made in five years.

The most basic purchase is the 2021 Program update. This only includes the programs, no add-ons. But there have been substantial changes to the program from 2016 to now.

One big update is the program has a new audio sound engine. Not only can you use 24 bit audio but you can also use different audio sample rates. Audio renders are much faster.

Another big update is the algorithm used to change audio pitch and tempo is new. RealTracks can be time or pitch shifted more than before with less artifacts.

Both Band-in-a-Box and RealBand are available as 64 bit programs. That makes them compatible with modern plugins.

PG Music offers a no payment now, four monthly payments plan that's worth looking at.
_________________________
Jim Fogle - 2021 BiaB (833) RB (Build 5) Ultra+ PAK
Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 2004, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Music at: http://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#631229 - 12/18/20 09:20 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Pat Marr]
Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 827
Simon - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 827
I personally think 2021 is very much worth the money, as there are a ton of great new features (especially the Utility Tracks and higher quality time stretching)! Of course, I might be biased. Please see my signature...


Originally Posted By: Pat Marr
If you already have BIAB 2020, just get the PlusPak for $99

It comes with the new version of BIAB and RB, plus ONLY the new real tracks and styles. Plus some bonus styles.



Some of the more expensive packages include ALL of the previous styles and realtracks... but if you already have them, why pay more to buy them again?



I'd be careful recommending this, as the PlusPAK really only works when upgrading from the previous year's UltraPAK - it can get messy when a customer upgrades to the PlusPAK from Pro or MegaPAK, as all the previous Realtracks aren't there for the new styles to work with...


Edited by Simon - PG Music (12/18/20 09:20 PM)
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#631243 - 12/19/20 02:54 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 10/03/17
Posts: 484
Loc: Ohio
DSM Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 10/03/17
Posts: 484
Loc: Ohio
My favorite is the utility tracks!

...Deb

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#631829 - 12/22/20 07:19 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Rob Helms Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
I thought this was a RB question now i'm confused
_________________________
Lenovo Win 10 8 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2021, Realband, Studio one 4.6 Pro, Logic Pro X, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus Faderport 8, Komplete 49 key controller.

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#631902 - 12/22/20 02:07 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 20494
Loc: Mi., USA
rharv Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 20494
Loc: Mi., USA
Rob,
From RB patch release

New - program will now let you save audio tracks as Utility Tracks when saving to an MGU or SGU
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#631915 - 12/22/20 03:39 PM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Rob Helms Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Very weird
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Lenovo Win 10 8 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2021, Realband, Studio one 4.6 Pro, Logic Pro X, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus Faderport 8, Komplete 49 key controller.

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#631997 - 12/23/20 01:49 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1297
Loc: UK
Bob Calver Offline
Expert

Registered: 09/21/01
Posts: 1297
Loc: UK
maybe someone can explain why after taking a BIAB song into RB with all the extra flexibility, extra tracks, all the regeneration possibilities - midi, midi supertracks and RTs, and easier editing without complicated workarounds RB offers , you might want to take it back into BIAB?

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#632015 - 12/23/20 05:38 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: Bob Calver]
Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6285
Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 6285
Loc: South Carolina
Originally Posted By: Bob Calver
maybe someone can explain why after taking a BIAB song into RB with all the extra flexibility, extra tracks, all the regeneration possibilities - midi, midi supertracks and RTs, and easier editing without complicated workarounds RB offers , you might want to take it back into BIAB?


One opens a BIAB project in RB that was carefully constructed using Multi Styles extensively only to learn RB doesn't recognize Multi Styles...

One opens a BIAB project in RB that was carefully constructed with frozen tracks perfect for the project only to learn RB doesn't recognize and preserve frozen tracks. Back to BIAB to export....

BIAB's more fully featured than RB. It is much better to construct tracks and styles in BIAB than RB if you're into a project and find tracks lacking as the project progresses.

BIAB's StylePicker is better and more efficient than the StylePicker in RB.

BIAB's ACW is better and more efficient than RB's.

Projects evolve and BIAB does many things better at track construction than RB or any other DAW. I don't think it's at all unusual to get tracks into RB only to find they are not completely satisfactory for the project and BIAB is the right tool for that job.
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#632031 - 12/23/20 06:32 AM [RealBand] Re: Is 2021 Worth the money. [Re: jonel]
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Rob Helms Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5922
Loc: Pawling New York
Charlie, I have a question regarding frozen tracks, are not all tracks in RB actually “Frozen” since they don’t regenerate unless you specifically want to?
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Lenovo Win 10 8 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2021, Realband, Studio one 4.6 Pro, Logic Pro X, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus Faderport 8, Komplete 49 key controller.

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