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#665958 - 07/27/21 05:55 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
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JohnJohnJohn Offline
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Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.

Dan, if you get this figured out lemme know how you do it! I bought one of their loop packs about 6 years ago and could never really figure out how to use it. smile I installed it in Kontakt and I can play around with the loops but never really ever figured out how to use these in a song. There doesn't seem to be any real documentation on how to use them so I'd love some tips!

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#665966 - 07/27/21 06:48 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
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Loc: Wauconda, Il.
MusicStudent Offline
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Will do.

I actually am not looking to purchase more loop packages. I am sure if I look around my hard drives I will find loop collections which I already have. So I am hoping this will work with what I have. What caught my attention here was a statement that "...just insert loops and they fit themselves into your arrangement within the DAW. So I am hoping this is that missing tool I need to make loops work for me.
_________________________
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BIAB2021, Dell XPS 8920 Intel Core I7-7700 @ 3.60GHz 16GB RAM
"...My goal is not to create backing tracks for my music, but rather to get more of me in my music."

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#666017 - 07/28/21 11:33 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 7863
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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Momentum is a sampler that can be used instead of Kontakt. Plus, it is free.

Samples and loops have many different features. The biggest is some loops have embedded pitch, tempo and key signature meta data and some don't. Those that do typically identify as "Acidized Waves". You'll also find loops with features specific to a certain program like FL Studio, Halion, Rex and Reaktor.

Loops and samples that take advantage of all the features Momentum offers will be identified as KLI or Momentum compatible.

Big Fish has multiple free loop sampler packages available for download. You will find them +++ HERE +++. Free loops is a great way to practice and learn how to use.

Just like Kontakt has a free library, Momentum has 3.8 GB of available content to practice and learn on.

+++ THIS +++ webpage has Windows and Mac download links as well as tutorial videos to help get you started.
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Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
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#666018 - 07/28/21 11:41 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: 90 dB]
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Jim Fogle Offline
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Originally Posted By: 90 dB
So, the resolution to the points made in this thread is that after paying $569.00 for the program, one would need to purchase some loop libraries. grin This is if you want to have a "modern" sound. cool


No new players, no new styles. It's a disappointment.


Regards,

Bob



Not really. PG Music provides 2,000 loops with Band-in-a-Box so we know loops work inside Band-in-a-Box. Where do you go if you want more loops or a specific loop (cowbell anyone?). I suggested a source for loops.

I haven't seen any program advertised as the only music source you'll ever need. Of course there will be new styles. There are new styles every year. There are new RealTracks every year. What we don't know is who will be the musicians playing on the RealTracks.

Maybe PG Music should avoid controversy and revert back to the alias or pseudonym of "PG Artist" that performed many of the guitar and mandolin RealTracks.

I agree new artists creating new sounds would be nice. But I haven't heard much new music that I like so I'm like a child in a candy store; I know I want something different but I don't know what it is I want. I just know that when I hear it I'll like it and will be inspired.
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#666023 - 07/28/21 12:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 5049
Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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"Not really. PG Music provides 2,000 loops with Band-in-a-Box so we know loops work inside Band-in-a-Box. Where do you go if you want more loops or a specific loop (cowbell anyone?). I suggested a source for loops."


It's called "Band In A Box", not "Loops In a Box". grin


"I haven't seen any program advertised as the only music source you'll ever need."

When did I make that statement? Never, actually.


"What we don't know is who will be the musicians playing on the RealTracks."

Really? In my experience it will be the SAME OLD PLAYERS.


"Maybe PG Music should avoid controversy and revert back to the alias or pseudonym of "PG Artist" that performed many of the guitar and mandolin RealTracks."


'...avoid controversy...'? They named the artists to cash in on their notoriety in the first place. laugh


"I agree new artists creating new sounds would be nice."

Finally; something we agree on! I would edit your statement (since you have chosen to quote a statement I never made); I would say "new artists creating new sounds would be expected for my $569.00".


Regards,

Bob

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#666031 - 07/28/21 02:18 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Loc: Miami, Florida
I am pretty happy with BIAB just like it is. I can think of many things I would like them to do.
I really like Brent Mason for country tracks. I think he is very over used on other styles and is certainly not my favorite blues player.

The price of a audiophile disk is pretty cheap for what it does, then again I don't have to consider refinancing my house to pay for it.

It's called BIAB not "live professional studio musicians will show up at your house and play for you.

The biggest complaint I have with BIAB is the difficulty in learning to use it.

Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666032 - 07/28/21 02:32 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 04/20/10
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Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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"It's called BIAB not "live professional studio musicians will show up at your house and play for you."

Really? This is from the PG Home Page:


1. What is Band-in-a-Box?
Band-in-a-Box is an intelligent automatic accompaniment program. You can hear and play along to many song ideas and go from "nothing" to "something" in a very short period of time with Band-in-a-Box as your "on demand" backup band. Just type in the chords for any song using standard chord symbols (like C, Fm7 or C13b9), choose the style you'd like, and Band-in-a-Box does the rest. Band-in-a-Box automatically generates a complete professional quality arrangement of piano, bass, drums, guitar and strings in a wide variety of styles.


Seems to me that's exactly what the program is promising.


Regards,

Bob




Edited by 90 dB (07/28/21 02:32 PM)

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#666035 - 07/28/21 03:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Loc: Miami, Florida
Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666042 - 07/28/21 04:13 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Planobilly]
Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 5049
Loc: Florida
90 dB Offline
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Originally Posted By: Planobilly
Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy




Well, Billy,

As a customer, and a long-time proponent of BIAB, I think I've earned the right to comment. You may disagree....whatever.


"Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital."


I lived in LA for 15 years. In the music scene. You take a lot for granted.


Regards,


Bob

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#666067 - 07/28/21 06:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Planobilly]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 22663
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Online   content
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Posts: 22663
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Originally Posted By: Planobilly
--- By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. ---
There's stock?
_________________________
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#666083 - 07/28/21 09:31 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Matt Finley]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Originally Posted By: Planobilly
--- By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. ---
There's stock?


Sorry Matt, I misspelled that. I don't own any socks. I live in the tropics and find no need for them.

Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666086 - 07/28/21 10:39 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 2691
Loc: South Africa
JoanneCooper Offline
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Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
Momentum is a sampler that can be used instead of Kontakt. Plus, it is free.

Samples and loops have many different features. The biggest is some loops have embedded pitch, tempo and key signature meta data and some don't. Those that do typically identify as "Acidized Waves". You'll also find loops with features specific to a certain program like FL Studio, Halion, Rex and Reaktor.

Loops and samples that take advantage of all the features Momentum offers will be identified as KLI or Momentum compatible.

Big Fish has multiple free loop sampler packages available for download. You will find them +++ HERE +++. Free loops is a great way to practice and learn how to use.

Just like Kontakt has a free library, Momentum has 3.8 GB of available content to practice and learn on.

+++ THIS +++ webpage has Windows and Mac download links as well as tutorial videos to help get you started.

Hi Jim
I’m keen to give this a go! I have only ever used percussion type loops where pitch is not important. How do these loops from big fish transpose to the right key?

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#666088 - 07/28/21 10:55 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: 90 dB]
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Planobilly Offline
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1730
Loc: Miami, Florida
Originally Posted By: 90 dB
Originally Posted By: Planobilly
Well Bob, that is their sales pitch and for the most part true. What the quality of their "complete professional quality arrangement" is does not often make me satisfied.

I paid a vocalist more to sing on one tune than the audiophile disk cost. I did use BIAB to lay out the chord structure which it did a very good job of.

Many people here say they get a finished product from BIAB. I am glad they are happy with what they get.

The last serious studio project I did cost me $30,000 in cash.

Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital.

Musicians universally complain about everything for the most part.

By the way, I don't work for PG Music or own any stock. I do think they make a pretty good product and they have been a nice company for me to deal with.

Nothing I say here is likely to change anyone's mind about anything.

Billy




Well, Billy,

As a customer, and a long-time proponent of BIAB, I think I've earned the right to comment. You may disagree....whatever.


"Get in your car and drive to LA and get a "complete professional quality arrangement" done and see what it sounds like and what it cost. It would be ever so cool if some software program could match what comes out of Sony studios or does the kind of mastering work done at Capital."


I lived in LA for 15 years. In the music scene. You take a lot for granted.


Regards,


Bob


First you have the right to say anything you like. We agree on a lot of things, Brent Mason for one. I also lived in La for many years and worked in the music business for Universal Studios and played in my band there and in Europe.
If you lived, played, and recorded in LA you know exactly what the quality of things are there and how difficult it is to get what you want even in LA with plenty of money.
No software program is going to replace that.
That is not to say BIAB has no value because it dose.

I took the time to go to Band Camp and listen to a good bit of your songs. You have some pretty nice songs. Some sound like they were created in BIAB. That is not necessary a bad thing, it is also not pro studio.

I liked 100 Miles From Austin how ever it got put together. There are people here who do excellent work. Jane Floyd comes to mind but I can assure BIAB is not the only tool he uses.

Not everything has to come our of Abbey Road Studio in London to sound good.
I have a couple of really good songs that a very well professionally recorded using top session players in LA that no one seems to have a interest in except me and a few friends.
Thake a listen,

https://soundcloud.com/planobillydfw/three-long-years

There are no guitar players on BIAB that can play like Lewis.

Cheers,

Billy


Edited by Planobilly (07/28/21 11:13 PM)
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas

"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

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#666137 - 07/29/21 08:04 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 8352
Loc: Wauconda, Il.
MusicStudent Offline
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Posts: 8352
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Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.


Downloaded and worked with this for about an hour this morning. Doesn't seem like it is for me, but I did not delete it. I will put a little more time in later to see if I can get over the learning curve of momentum. So far it don't sound musical to me.
_________________________
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BIAB2021, Dell XPS 8920 Intel Core I7-7700 @ 3.60GHz 16GB RAM
"...My goal is not to create backing tracks for my music, but rather to get more of me in my music."

SoundCloud


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#666156 - 07/29/21 09:30 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: MusicStudent]
Registered: 11/01/09
Posts: 348
Loc: Southeast USA
bloc-head Offline
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Posts: 348
Loc: Southeast USA
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
+++ Big Fish Audio +++ They also have a free sampler, Momentum, that can slice, dice and remix a sample like Reason while offering the sequencing and playback capability of Kontakt.


You don't say? This looks very interesting to me at this time. There was always a bit of a hurdle for me when I work with loops. Perhaps this is what I was missing. Thanks Jim, for the referral.


Downloaded and worked with this for about an hour this morning. Doesn't seem like it is for me, but I did not delete it. I will put a little more time in later to see if I can get over the learning curve of momentum. So far it don't sound musical to me.

I watched the "Momentum Trailer" and I thought it was lame at best... The background "music" sucked (IMHO). I recently purchased Komplete Kontrol, and am currently at the bottom of the learning curve.
_________________________
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#666170 - 07/29/21 11:25 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 06/25/12
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JohnJohnJohn Offline
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I checked my download links for the loops I bought from them in 2015, and while they say these loops are compatible with Momentum, the links for those versions are grayed out. Dunno if I would have to buy them again to get them but I won't do that in any case.

I just don't understand what to do with them unless it is to simply build a track from scratch in my DAW by copy/pasting the slices. And if that's the case this seems like more work than I'd like unless I just really need something I can't get another way.

I wish they provided a step-by-step walkthrough of creating a track using their loops. Maybe Dan will do that? laugh

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#666177 - 07/29/21 12:22 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 05/16/17
Posts: 1630
beatmaster Offline
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Demo some of the loop packs they sound excellent tho pricey, but I guess you get what you pay for !
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https://beatmaster1.bandcamp.com/releases


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#666180 - 07/29/21 12:37 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
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Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Offline
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JohnJohnJohn,
Quote:
build a track from scratch in my DAW by copy/pasting the slices
That's exactly how song construction kits works.

Here are some notes from a song construction kit I purchased:
Quote:
301 Loops

30 bass loops (5 loops in 6 pitches)
36 brass loops (6 loops in 6 pitches)
10 drum kits with variations
36 guitar loops (6 loops in 6 pitches)
24 keys loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
24 pad loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
24 piano loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
18 Rhodes loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)
24 sequence loops (4 loops in 6 pitches)
18 synth loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)
18 vocals loops (3 loops in 6 pitches)

[Tempo] BPM=90 [Harmony Table] Scale=C

Sample1=C
Sample2=d
Sample3=e
Sample4=F
Sample5=G
Sample6=a


The website page for this set includes two songs that demonstrate multiple ways these loops can be mixed together. I recorded the demo songs and placed the recordings in the construction kit folder so I can remember how the loops sound in context.

I've included some screen shots to illustrate my comments.

This construction kit was purchased from +++ Producer Planet +++. Producer Planet was Sony's original website to demonstrate and sell their Acidized loops and the site has a limited number of kits. +++ Big Fish Audio +++ also has construction kits.

Band-in-a-Box typically has one loop per track. There are ways around that limitation but one loop per track is the norm. That works well with percussion tracks. It also works well when you want a singular riff played in a section or throughout a song. Construction kits such as the one I've included screen shots from give you more instruments to use in your songs


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Jim Fogle - 2021 BiaB (845) RB (Build 9) Ultra+ PAK
Cakewalk - Zoom MRS-8 recorder
Desktop: i7 Win 10 build 2004, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD
Laptop: i3 64bit Win 10 build 21H1, 8GB ram 500GB HDD
Music at: http://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#666182 - 07/29/21 01:02 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 05/16/17
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beatmaster Offline
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Getting the hang of the loops, well that helps Jim A picture paints a thousand words, How would you know the Construction kits from normal loops ?.

Im trying to get as much info for a buy a loops pack at 129.00 so the more the merrier !! (info).
_________________________
win 10 64 bit 16gb,i7 chip, ssd 500gb, m-audio air, ,Roland BK-7M, 1000,shure sm7b,sonar,acid,mixcraft, variety of plugins.Sample tank 3,Kontakt. TC Helicon Voicelive 3 2 .
https://beatmaster1.bandcamp.com/releases


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#666184 - 07/29/21 01:08 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Biab 2021 [Re: beatmaster]
Registered: 04/07/13
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Loc: South Carolina
Charlie Fogle Offline
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<< I wish they provided a step-by-step walkthrough of creating a track using their loops. Maybe Dan will do that? >>

Also, Forum member, Mr. Henry Clarke, has put out two tutorials, one using BIAB specifically and one using a DAW.

Country Song from Samples

and

How to use use BIAB Loops to create an infectious Disco Beat Tutorial" Henry Clarke
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PG Music News
Celebrate National Jukebox Day with Band-in-a-Box®!

Happy National Jukebox Day!
(November 24)

Don't own a Jukebox? Well, if you have Band-in-a-Box®, you actually do with the Jukebox feature!

What does the Band-in-a-Box® Jukebox do?

Using the directory you choose, the Band-in-a-Box® Jukebox will provide you with background music by continuously play the entire list of Band-in-a-Box® songs within that folder! There are many options for you to customize your Jukebox experience, including: Only Play song with melodies, Change Melody Instrument, Random order Playback, Audible Count-in, Harmony Settings, and more! Plus, the Jukebox will continue to play while you use other programs, providing your favorite music for continued background listening.

To learn more about the Jukebox feature in Band-in-a-Box® for Windows, check out Chapter 5 of our online manual.
Mac Jukebox details found here.

Tell Us Your Favorite Band-in-a-Box Features

Did you know we have a My Favorite Things forum? We'd love it if you shared your favorite features in Band-in-a-Box and RealBand there, along with what features you use the most and why - we absolutely LOVE getting feedback!

Take a peak at other posts while you're there - you never know... someone else's favorite feature might become yours too!

RealTracks Artist Pat Martino

We are saddened to hear of the passing of jazz guitar legend Pat Martino yesterday.

Pat was part of our RealTracks Artist "Jazz Pollwinners 2" series in 2014. You can learn about Pat and listen to his RealTracks contribution here.

Pat had been playing guitar since he was just 12 years old, and devoted himself to music in grade ten. On top of years of performing (he began playing professionally in 1961), Pat received many awards for his playing, including the "Jazz Legacy" Award in 2016 presented by Pennsylvania State Senator Vincent Hughes and his wife Sheryl Lee Ralph-Hughes.

Learn even more about Pat Martino when you visit his website, http://www.patmartino.com/.

Band-in-a-Box® 2021 Updates!

Attention Band-in-a-Box® 2021 users - a free update is available!

Using a Windows version? Your update resolves some reported bugs involving Song Memo, RealDrums, hot-keys, etc. Learn more & download - Windows.

Running the Mac version? The latest update for version 2021 improves Edit Audio functions, allows you to stop playback when using the StyleMaker, ensures tempo changes are included when exporting MIDI, and more! Learn more & download - Mac.

A Look Back... Band-in-a-Box® 2015 NAMM Demonstration #TBT

Watch Tobin (and Charlie!) demonstrate Band-in-a-Box® 2015 for Windows at the 2015 NAMM Show: Play video...

Tobin does a great job of showing just how easy it is to create a song with Band-in-a-Box!

This video was posted on January 23, 2015 to the Keyboard Instrument Chops and Gear YouTube Channel.

Enhance Your Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Windows Installation

Attention Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Windows users - update for FREE today!

We've added a new "record using" option within the Audio Settings dialog, and updated many existing features based on user feedback.

This free update also includes the most recent build of our DAW Plugin (3.9.12).

Learn more about this free update and download it today.

Ordering Your Band-in-a-Box® is Easy!

When you order any PG Music products directly from www.pgmusic.com (or www.bandinabox.com) you'll receive immediate links to start downloading your order! Even if you choose to have a backup copy of your Band-in-a-Box® packages shipped, you'll still have the download links available to you - no need to wait!

We've made it even easier to get started with Band-in-a-Box® with the Easy Payment Plan 4 - when you choose this payment option you'll pay four equal monthly payments starting on the day of your order.

Choose your Band-in-a-Box® for Windows package & order here.

Using Mac? Order here.

When you get to the checkout, simply click on Select Easy Payment Plan 4 for this product to apply this option.

Note: This only applies to this Band-in-a-Box product, and does not apply to other products that you might have in your order, including the physical backup copy if selected.

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