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#671877 - 09/07/21 04:07 AM
[Off-Topic]
New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
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Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 2161
Loc: Lake Keowee, South Carolina
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Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 2161
Loc: Lake Keowee, South Carolina
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I think we've discussed that BIAB and perhaps RB make use of multi-core processors. I think, but perhaps I'm wrong, that the consensus was that BIAB does take advantage of multi-core capabilities.
Here's what I'm wondering: it seems that newer processors are constantly upping the number of cores and threads, is BIAB and RB keeping up with this and do they take advantage of this? If I go from a 4 core processor to a 6 core, 12 thread processor would I expect to see and difference?
Jeff
_________________________
Win10, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2022, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive Touch, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.16
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#671892 - 09/07/21 05:35 AM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 23450
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
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Registered: 07/12/00
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Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
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BIAB does use all four cores in my older i7. I don’t know about more recent CPUs with more cores than that.
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BIAB 2022 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Swam horns, Audition, Notion 7; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors
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#671915 - 09/07/21 08:32 AM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Expert
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
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I have been experimenting with few animation programs. It is scary how much you can spend that is actually useful for processing video.
$2500 for a video card, $2500 for a processor, $1000 for a motherboard. AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3970X 32-Core, 64-Thread Unlocked Desktop Processor...$2600 WOW
8K plus for a machine ready to go. Then of course you need the latest iPhone to go with it. The new phone is actually useful.
The only good news is that Blender software is free and can do almost everything that Maya can. The industry standard is called Maya and costs a mere $1700 a year...lol
It is totally amazing to me the quality of animation that one can create in a home studio.
Well, in the scope of things I guess it is pretty easy to spend 10K on a good piano. So everything is relative I guess.
Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas
"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."
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#671970 - 09/07/21 01:18 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
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Registered: 07/10/15
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Loc: Miami, Florida
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To answer Jeff's question, yes. I saw speed of use increase with the new i9 computer I built. I have no idea if BIAB is using all the cores. Things load faster and render faster as far as I can tell.
But... whatever performance increase I got with the i9 over the old i7 4770 was not all that useful for BIAB.
If my old i7 computer would have not started to give me issues I would not have built a new one. If I was forced to build a new one again I would still buy an i9 because the price difference between the i7 and the i9 is not much.
I also just finished building a new i5 machine. BIAB runs on it faster than I can think...lol
All these more complex CPU/GPU devices make a large difference with video. With the type of audio stuff that most of us are using everything ran fine on XP with i7 processors. If BIAB was my only consideration, buying really faster CPU's does not buy you a lot.
Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas
"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."
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#671976 - 09/07/21 01:39 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 23450
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 23450
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
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Since graphics cards were mentioned, it has always been the case that this is at the bottom of the list for BIAB hardware. Now, I don’t use any of the video functions BIAB introduced a few years ago. Not much is discussed here about that. But for audio and BIAB, that’s the last place I would spend any money; instead I would upgrade to an SSD then the CPU then RAM.
Billy, there are some hardware-monitoring utilities that show the activity of each core while running a program. Give it a try on your best CPU and let us know if all are being used.
_________________________
BIAB 2022 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 5 Pro, Swam horns, Audition, Notion 7; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & A5X monitors
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#671988 - 09/07/21 02:48 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: Planobilly]
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Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
PG Music Staff
Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
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I think we've discussed that BIAB and perhaps RB make use of multi-core processors. I think, but perhaps I'm wrong, that the consensus was that BIAB does take advantage of multi-core capabilities.
Here's what I'm wondering: it seems that newer processors are constantly upping the number of cores and threads, is BIAB and RB keeping up with this and do they take advantage of this? If I go from a 4 core processor to a 6 core, 12 thread processor would I expect to see and difference?
Jeff I've used BIAB on an 8-core machine, and IIRC it did use all the cores available. Honestly, I've tried BIAB on slow dual-core laptops, my 6-core gaming machine, and my old 8-core monster, and never noticed much difference in speed. Yes, I can measure a difference (sometimes a significant difference), but seeing or feeling the difference? Not much. If you want to upgrade, try putting in a nice NVMe SSD, that will likely give you the most noticeable difference. Well, in the scope of things I guess it is pretty easy to spend 10K on a good piano. So everything is relative I guess. It's also easy to spend $10k on a not very good piano as well. I've played a few in the $10-20k range that I didn't particularly care for. That said, I've also played one that was $150k, and was much happier with the one across the room from it that was $25k. Whatever floats your boat I suppose  Billy, there are some hardware-monitoring utilities that show the activity of each core while running a program. Give it a try on your best CPU and let us know if all are being used. There's one built into Windows - the Resource Monitor. It can give you a graph of what each CPU is doing - see my screenshot.
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Edited by Simon - PG Music (09/07/21 03:05 PM)
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#671991 - 09/07/21 03:02 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Expert
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
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 With BIAB running a demo song. I thought Task Manager would show the cores but I don't know how to make it do that. Billy In resource manager, it shows all 8 cores being used. Less than 2% CPU use and 2 gigs of ram being used if I understand what I am looking at.
Edited by Planobilly (09/07/21 03:21 PM)
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas
"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."
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#671995 - 09/07/21 03:27 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 21045
Loc: Mi., USA
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 21045
Loc: Mi., USA
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Task Manager doesn't, but Resource Monitor does and costs just as much (nothing).
Some systems seem to have it, some seem to need to have it installed (download from M$ via SysInternals), but it is an excellent tool for troubleshooting and other fun stuff, as Simon showed.
Sometimes, once installed, Resource Monitor actually shows up inside Task Manager as a button to launch it. Sometimes you need to make a separate shortcut, never bothered to learn whatever trick makes it appear, maybe it's simply OS dependent.
*Edit-
I see you found Resource Monitor (I assume, though you said Manager, which is for servers), great. This post may help others know how to find it so I'll leave it for now.
Edited by rharv (09/07/21 03:34 PM)
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.. I do not work here, and the benefits are still awesome
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#672002 - 09/07/21 03:54 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
PG Music Staff
Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
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Billy - most likely your CPU's are too powerful, and only need to exert 2% of the power to get the job done. BIAB typically starts playing before the entire song is generated, so it likely is programmed to not use 100% when it's not necessary.
Realistically, there is likely something else bottlenecking BIAB. It could be a power management setting, could be storage speed, who knows. I personally don't often see BIAB using absolutely 100%, usually topping out at 50% on my ancient computer.
Rharv - I've always seen the Resource Monitor linked from the Task Manager, so I didn't know that there was the possibility of it not being there. Maybe it's not automatically installed with Windows 10 Home - every computer I personally use with Windows 10 is running the Pro version.
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#672013 - 09/07/21 04:16 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Expert
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
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Resource Monitor is at the bottom of the performance tab in task manager on my system. I just did not see it at first and went to the control panel to find it.
The Radeon RX 570 GPU is the only thing on this system that gives me any issues. I have had to reload the driver after an update a couple of times.
Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas
"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."
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#672025 - 09/07/21 06:00 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: Simon - PG Music]
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 21045
Loc: Mi., USA
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 21045
Loc: Mi., USA
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Yeah it may be OS dependent.
I work on a lot of different machines, many of them servers, so my experience will likely be different than most users.
If it isn't there on a given machine, it's a free download/install.
That was my only point. It's worth having.
_________________________
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, and the benefits are still awesome
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#672087 - 09/08/21 08:12 AM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: Planobilly]
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 2394
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 2394
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
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I thought Task Manager would show the cores but I don't know how to make it do that. Billy, Task Manager does show the cores. See my screenshots. Highlight the Performance Tab, choose CPU, right click on the graph and choose Change Graph to-->Logical processors.
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 Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 1 TB SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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#672103 - 09/08/21 08:51 AM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
Expert
Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 1923
Loc: Miami, Florida
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Thanks, Steve, that is a pretty convoluted process...lol  Billy
_________________________
Sears, Roebuck and Co guitar, Black Diamond Strings, RCA Victor Radio ASCAP Writer/Publisher IPI Number: 1117481473 Songwriters Guild Of America And All My EX'S actually do LIVE IN Texas
"Never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."
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#672104 - 09/08/21 08:55 AM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 2394
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 2394
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
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It is but your PC will remember that you have it set that way and it will be useful in seeing which CPUs are being used.
_________________________
Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 1 TB SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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#672129 - 09/08/21 02:00 PM
[Off-Topic]
Re: New muti-core, multi-thread processors....
[Re: MountainSide]
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Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
PG Music Staff
Registered: 05/19/20
Posts: 1497
Loc: Victoria, BC
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Good trick Steve, I forgot about that!
Also I need your CPU. I currently have 4 cores, no HT.....
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