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#624010 - 11/19/20 10:36 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST
Registered: 02/05/15
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Pipeline Offline
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With Biab it generates up the track into RAM then plays from there,
BBW4 (Biab) will do the same for the Plugin then writes it to a wav file.

If I drop a wav/wma from my RealTracks folder into Reaper, slice it up, change the pitch, stretch and rearrange it, (Non Destructive Editing)
when I play it back it will still be playing the same original untouched source wav file.
Couldn't you get the Plugin to do the same ?
Rather than all the time waiting for it to be generated to wav files,
it should be way quicker to generate up just the reference data and play direct from the wav/wma source files.
Then the time would be just in the render to wav when you finally get what you need, rather than all the render time for something that may not be right, not to mention all the SavedTracks hard drive space.
That's why with the Vol/Pan and more audio sends it can be all done in the Plugin without using any hard drive space or long render times.
I know if I generate a track in Reaper with a script pulling the needed sections out of a wav file to fit the chord track it's instant,
it's only simple random matching where as Biab will do more musical calculations but it should be near as quick, it would have to be as quick as generating midi.
So moving just the necessary generate code from BBW4 into the BiabVST code would give you instant play.

It's like if I freeze all the tracks in Biab and save to SGU it will store all the reference data for the tracks: file, bar/s, time start/time end, transpose and stretch amount.
So if I open this SGU in the BiabVST it should be able to read and play those section direct from file without generating into RAM then rendering to wav.

See pic below Reaper is just pulling out sections of wav that match the chord track, it will just play direct from the source until I render it.

Then this is the render time in the next pic, it will render all those sections to a new wav on your hard drive.



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#624121 - 11/20/20 02:37 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
Registered: 05/19/20
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Simon - PG Music Offline
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I believe part of the reason is to keep system requirements down as low as possible.

Currently Band-in-a-Box will run on just about anything - pretty sure it'll run on a potato. If we program BB to render everything in realtime, then our users who are still running some very old computers will need a faster CPU, more Ram, faster hard drive, etc.

Granted, I would support having "realtime" as the default and keeping the old "generate" as an option for those who are still running potatoes. But I'm not in development so I have no idea how much coding it would take to do it all in realtime.
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#624126 - 11/20/20 02:59 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Simon - PG Music]
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Originally Posted By: Simon - PG Music
...then our users who are still running some very old computers will need a faster CPU, more Ram, faster hard drive, etc. ....


We are talking about the BiabVST not Biab that old users with old PC's with a Pentium 100 use, we are talking about users with high end DAW's not PowerTracks, this is what the BiabVST was made for. You can't hold back modern day studio users with high end DAW's because of old users from the 90's.
That's why I said get all the generate code into the BiabVST then development will be at the speed of light away from the old BBW4 code.
There will still always be a Delphi Band In A Box for all those users that are comfortable and at home with it.
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#624274 - 11/21/20 01:26 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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Here's a video playing back the 24bit 48KHz files that are pitched and stretched with non destructive editing in real time, these files are all on a USB 3.0 drive same as RT/RDs.
So if the BB Plugin can move to this method there won't be any wait time, it will play a frozen SGU from Biab instantly in your DAW.

I put all this info up as there are big (good) changes coming so I might be doing other things and might not be around too much.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/szd9wcytf2vgv78/Reaper-24bit-48KHz.mp4?dl=0


Edited by Pipeline (11/21/20 06:39 PM)
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#624496 - 11/23/20 01:11 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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This is an actual RealTrack playing direct from the Biab RealTracks folder:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/maxphbq184wg3sx/Reaper-RealTrack.mp4?dl=0
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#626142 - 11/29/20 04:17 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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Now with the Audio Sends you would be able to leave the tracks in the Plugin as data without having to render to wav and drag into the DAW tracks, you just render the DAW project.
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#628080 - 12/06/20 02:32 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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Here's 1/8 changes with a RealTrack playing direct from the bb\RealTracks folder, so it should be easily doable in the Plugin.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6lpq2hoes8eqe84/8th-Chord-Changes.mp4?dl=0

Same deal with the RealDrums playing direct from the bb\Drums folder

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#634588 - 01/05/21 01:18 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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Another thing, using track data you should be able to highlight a section of chords, right click copy data, then paste data over the same chords in another section.
So if you have a riff you like playing in one spot you can copy it to another, all without wav rendering time same as I can in Reaper.

To give you an example how easy this works I put a RealTrak and RealDrum in a Reaper project, just remove the .mp4 from the download below.
RT 372 & NashvilleSwing Example wav.rpp.mp4

The project will look for
\bb\RealTracks\Guitar, Acoustic, Strumming Hank Sw 120\AcG011.wav
bb\Drums\NashvilleSwing8^\nashvilleswing8^_110_Style.wav
so point Reaper to those folder when prompted.
If you don't have wav just convert those two files from wma to a wav also.


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#635295 - 01/09/21 06:50 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
Registered: 01/07/20
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justanoldmuso Offline
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pipeline.
happy new year.
notice your graphic before the last one ?
showing reatrak at bottom ?
wouldnt it be great if my bb chord view wish showed all those different reatrak song sections as matching tabs at the top of biab chord view ?
see what i mean ?
best.
muso.
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#635411 - 01/09/21 03:35 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: justanoldmuso]
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YES, I think have the Tab name/color whatever you name and color the song section as, this way you are not limited to a set of names and colors.
It's a good idea, it's all doable and other users have been requesting it also, but what can you do ? hope wish pray ??
If Biab had scripting we could make it up right now.


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#635640 - 01/10/21 05:37 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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justanoldmuso Offline
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pipeline.
yep wish bb had scripting.
frankly i'm teed off.
i'm not bothering posting suggestions in wishlist anymore, cos it seems other users dont care much.
i mean c'mon tabs in chordview is obvious. like above in reaps. also obvious is changeing the oddball chorus feature.
i feel we are both "tilting at windmills".

sorry but i think i'm going to be on here less.
careing bout this stuff isnt worth it.
just this week i had to do more workarounds.

regarding support for ancient pc's, thats why i hinted in the
wishlist to have an early warning system so people didnt
crash etc etc when trying to load in some cpu hogging crazy plug ins.
but noone seemed to support that idea.
one person maybe. sigh.

keep up your great work, and much respect to you.
muso.




Edited by justanoldmuso (01/10/21 05:46 PM)
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#635647 - 01/10/21 06:23 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: justanoldmuso]
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Pipeline Offline
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BB needs to hire The Workarounds but Reaper don't it goes solo.
I went through years of frustration and stress until I found Reaper and scripting and now with the BBPlugin I think just about anything you can conceive of, you can create in Reaper.
Rather than hoping wishing praying cursing.. for it in BB you can get it started now in Reaper.

With the Song Section Tool I made up, I could add that with the Chord Sheet so whatever song section it's on it will display that without any BBPlugins showing.
This would also work without the BBPlugins.



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#673905 - 09/19/21 11:55 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
Registered: 09/13/21
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swingbabymix Online   content
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I can't understand. My English level is too poor. If I only rely on translation, I really don't understand.
But it feels like you're doing a great thing. come on.
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#673974 - 09/20/21 08:39 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: swingbabymix]
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Jim Fogle Offline
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Originally Posted By: swingbabymix
I can't understand. My English level is too poor. If I only rely on translation, I really don't understand.
But it feels like you're doing a great thing. come on.


Reaper is a DAW that supports user enhancements by script programming. Pipeline enhances Reaper with script programs.

If you use the Band-in-a-Box Plugin in the Reaper DAW, Pipeline will program a script to add almost any feature you can imagine.

Pipeline has already created a large number of scripts so Reaper can work better with the plugin.
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#673987 - 09/20/21 10:31 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Jim Fogle]
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That's great. Talent!
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#677513 - 10/12/21 02:12 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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Pipeline Offline
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It seems I have to keep posting on this as it's not being understood by some and is being knocked. A lot of it's got to do with PG being scared stiff of offending old users with this modern software because they are still running really old computers and may be just be using the BBPlugin in PowerTracks on Win98.

In the demo below Reaper is using 76meg RAM 0% CPU Reaper-Host32bit 13meg playing direct from a PG WD USB 3.0 hard drive, using EnergyXT 32bit 2005 VSTi playing 1 RealDrum & 8 RealTracks of random sections, would do a lot more but takes too much time putting them all in.
This is how the BBPlugin needs to work to give INSTANT GENERATE & PLAY. At the moment there is too much time waiting for it to generate up unnecessary wav files filling up the hard drive.

If you still have to use bbw4 though I would recommend getting away from it, you could get bbw4 just to write the section data to the SavedTracks folder (like the same data that is saved for frozen SGU) that would then give the Plugin the sections to play from in the original files. bbw4 would need to append the current track's section data file in the SavedTracks folder if a new section of it is regenerated in the BBPlugin. So rather than having wav files filling up the SavedTracks folder bbw4 will just do the first step without generating up to RAM then rendering to wav it will just generate the txt files for each track, the txt files will contain the wav/wma/m4a file name, the start and end time of the section, the transpose and stretch amount, the BBlugin will then playback those sections same as EnergyXY VSTi in the pick below.

All you have to do is download Reaper (free to try n try) and try what I have show, learn how it works, you can't learn from RealBand how it works as it's destructive editing.

Full Screen


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#677526 - 10/12/21 03:48 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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If you can't get away from bbw4 and do it all in the BBvst at the moment then this is how it can be done:


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#677803 - 10/14/21 01:21 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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and this is XP playing RealTracks/Drums Direct from USB 2.0 hard drive:


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#678120 - 10/17/21 04:45 AM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Re: Instant Generate & Play of RealTracks/Drums in BiabVST [Re: Pipeline]
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When you generate a song in Biab main
1. It will choose random sections that will fit the chords of the track from the RT source files.
2. It will join those sections together into RAM creating 1 linear track and plays that back.
3. bbw4 takes it one step further and renders it to a wav file in the SavedTracks folder that the BBPlugin then reads.

If you Save the Biab main to SGU frozen that is the same as the text file as it contains all the randomly chosen parts in a linear formation.

If I open the frozen SGU and just re-generate bars 5 to 8 then Save as a frozen SGU again that is the same as appending the track's text file in the SavedTracks folder.

The pic below is just a Reaper project file I simplified as an example, if I copy a section from one saved project to another it will have a new section of track when I play it back same as when I regenerate a section in Reaper it will append the sections in the project file with that new section in the text.
If I generate the whole track then it will write all new section of text.
It's like a media player song playlist, you can add all new songs to the play order or you can just change a few different songs in the middle, so the media player knows what items to play and in what order.
In the project text file it has the position, start pos in wav, end pos in wav,
PLAYRATE 1 1 0 -1 0 0.0025 (tempo and pitch amount)
and file source.

So if bbw4 will
1. It will choose random sections that will fit the chords of the track from the RT source files.
2. Write these sections direct to SavesTracks as
Guitar, Acoustic, Strumming Hank Sw 120.txt
3. BBPlugin will read and playback the "playlist" of all the different sections listed in the text file directly from the source wav\wma.

It's like if you just generate midi it is super quick as it just writes a text file (.mid)
the mid text file triggers sounds in the sound font or wav sample in the sfz in Sforzando.

With direct play the text file will trigger a sample section of wav/wma to be played in the source file.

THAT'S IT



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#678541 - 10/20/21 03:43 PM [Band-in-a-Box VST and Pro Tools/AAX DAW Plugin (Windows)] Text Play Demo [Re: Pipeline]
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Here's a demo of how the Play Direct works.
The Chords Playlist.m3u is in the mp3 folder, you can drag it into Notepad to read.
The media player plays the section back the same way the plugin will just by reading the text playlist but will play those section's from the time position start within the RT files.
remove .mp4 CoolPlayer+Portable.zip.mp4

You can drag the items in the playlist up/down to rearrange.
Code:
Strum E.mp3
Strum D.mp3
Strum D.mp3
Strum F#m.mp3
Strum F#m.mp3
Strum A.mp3
Strum Bm.mp3
Strum F#m.mp3
Strum F#m.mp3
Strum A.mp3
Strum A.mp3
Strum E.mp3
Strum E.mp3
Strum Bm.mp3
Strum Bm.mp3
Strum A.mp3
Strum E.mp3
Strum D.mp3
Strum A.mp3
Strum Bm.mp3
Strum D.mp3


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A Look Back... Band-in-a-Box® 2015 NAMM Demonstration #TBT

Watch Tobin (and Charlie!) demonstrate Band-in-a-Box® 2015 for Windows at the 2015 NAMM Show: Play video...

Tobin does a great job of showing just how easy it is to create a song with Band-in-a-Box!

This video was posted on January 23, 2015 to the Keyboard Instrument Chops and Gear YouTube Channel.

Enhance Your Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Windows Installation

Attention Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Windows users - update for FREE today!

We've added a new "record using" option within the Audio Settings dialog, and updated many existing features based on user feedback.

This free update also includes the most recent build of our DAW Plugin (3.9.12).

Learn more about this free update and download it today.

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Band-in-a-Box® File Associations

You may have noticed when you were installing Band-in-a-Box® for Windows that you were asked if you would like to Associate Band-in-a-Box songs and styles with Band-in-a-Box? But, what does that mean?

It's actually pretty simple - basically, if you select this option while you're installing the program, files with the extensions .SGU, .MGU, and other Band-in-a-Box files will open directly in the program if you select them from outside the program.

Missed this option during your setup, but you'd like to apply it now? Go to File | File Utilities | Associate File types with Explorer within the program.

New Update for RealBand 2021 Available!

Do you use RealBand (included in all Band-in-a-Box® for Windows purchases)? Download the latest free update, which resolves a small viewing issue for Windows 11 users.

When you download the latest update for RealBand 2021, it will add all the updates we've made this year. See the full list here.

Ear Training Games in Band-in-a-Box® for Windows

October 1, 2021 is National Kids Music Day!

Head to the Practice Window in Band-in-a-Box® for Windows, and you'll see fun games that are fun ear training options for kids: Music Replay & Pitch Invasion.

Of course, you don't have to be a kid to like these games, I think there a fun way to learn at any age!

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If you like a classic arcade game, then you'll love Pitch Invasion! We've managed to incorporate aliens with pitch-recognition skills in this exciting game, where you'll match the pitch of the alien ship descending towards your planet trying to destroy your collection of instruments - match the pitch and you've saved your instruments, make a mistake and the ship keeps coming... you'll have a few tries to get it right, if you're quick, but if all your instruments are destroyed - it's game over! The game speeds up as your skills improve, and you'll earn points along the way, with bonus points available throughout the game.

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These ear training games are also included in Musical Arcade for Windows.

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Band-in-a-Box® endorsing artist Nick Kellie recently got his hands on the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2021 for Mac, and put together this video showing off just how easy it is to make backing tracks in Band-in-a-Box®!

Band-in-a-Box Demo - How to make backing tracks

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