you don't ever have to be the best...just good enough and in the right place at the right time! Ringo was a fine drummer. the only reason this is even a topic in our culture is some people just love to hate and there's a big ol' helping of jealousy mixed in there as well!
I cannot ever recall listening to my Beatles albums and thinking "this would be great if only they had a better drummer"!
Of course, despite the subject 'title', the whole intent of the post was not if Ringo was the best, it was centered on the genius quip (true of false maybe) from John Lennon. Many unfortunately didn't actually identify that, and concentrated their debate on defending Ringo's percussive ability.
Regardless of the "who's who of drumming", the Fab Four certainly gave the world absolute genius musicianship. Collectively, it took all of them to do that.
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I have long believed that Ringo was a great drummer. Not so much for his technical skills but for the melodic attributes of his drumming. His fills and accents were a huge part of a "Beatles:" arrangement. Just listen to "Please, Please, Me" and imagine it with any other drummer.
Phil Collins said Ringo was underrated as a drummer I agree..but we arent talking technical drummers are we? Buddy Rich is recognised as the best in that category but Ringo had a unique sound at the time and was as much part of the Beatles sound as McCartneys unique playing of a left handed bass or Harrisons guitar style.
Boy, I wish had I named this post: "What John Lennon said (maybe)"
The post has actually got nothing to do with Ringo. It was all about John (maybe). Not everybody (in fact hardly anybody) picked that up, unfortunately, mainly coming in droves to the defense of poor hard-done-by Ringo
I tried to explain that before, many times, but not everybody apparently followed the content / intention of the thread, and only focused on the words used in the title (groan....)
Now what was that saying? Something about 'Never judge a book by its cover'?
OK, so to clarify: it's about what John might have said, and not a bit about Ringo, who is still probably the best drummer in the entire Universe.
And yes, I've worked in bands where drummers both imploded and exploded. Never nice.
And sure, please just go and read the very original post if you are not sure what the subject is really about - and please try to read between the lines.
Thanks
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Following the release of the White Album in 1968, in which Paul McCartney had played drums on a couple of tracks, John Lennon was asked in an interview if Ringo Starr was the best drummer in the world.
Lennon quickly responded, "In the world? Ringo's not even the best drummer in The Beatles!"
Back to the OP. Lennon was a notorious wiseguy. It could have been a defense mechanism to mask his secret feelings of inadequacy (doubtful), or just John being John - a clever, amusing jerk. The class clown. Many of his "quips" were actually very hurtful to the targets of his remarks.
Boy, I wish had I named this post: "What John Lennon said (maybe)"
The post has actually got nothing to do with Ringo. It was all about John (maybe). Not everybody (in fact hardly anybody) picked that up, unfortunately, mainly coming in droves to the defense of poor hard-done-by Ringo
I tried to explain that before, many times, but not everybody apparently followed the content / intention of the thread, and only focused on the words used in the title (groan....)
Now what was that saying? Something about 'Never judge a book by its cover'?
OK, so to clarify: it's about what John might have said, and not a bit about Ringo, who is still probably the best drummer in the entire Universe.
And yes, I've worked in bands where drummers both imploded and exploded. Never nice.
And sure, please just go and read the very original post if you are not sure what the subject is really about - and please try to read between the lines.
Thanks
I think Ringo was a fine drummer!
(you can probably change the title on your original post if you wanted to!)
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You can pick it up cheaply too for a few dollars here and there.
Being brought up on country music I came late to the beatles music, Lennon and Mcartney sure wrote some memorable songs, but I think at the end people idolised them so much they could have put the alphabet to music and people would have bought it, and they knew that too!
As reagards lennon a fascinating guy and maybe even a crackhead and jerk (such was his dependence on drugs) but for some obscure reason, maybe his untimely death a truly fascinating guy to read about and look at his interviews on youtube.
And reading about his life and his untimely death I am sure he would have even given up the whole beatles thing just to have those extra years.
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Well, even if the comment was not from John, it was the kind of thing he was likely to say but I do not think his quips were anything other than the kind of humour that Brits used in those days. Certainly he did not intend to be cruel or hurtful as somebody suggested. Remember, it was the days of the Goons! Many countries outside of Britain would find some of that humour a bit difficult to understand - not all, but some. The American reaction to his comment "that the Beatles had become more popular than Jesus Christ" would be typical of how he was often misunderstood. That was just John and British humour. There was little consternation about the remark when originally published in the UK.
John happens to be a huge political hero of mine mainly for his (and Yoko's) one-couple peace movement, the bed-in, etc. "Give Peace A Chance!" Who can forget that? A wonderful epitaph for the man!
As to Ringo and his drum technique: He picked up on the important characteristics of the American Rock beat at an early stage in his playing and then put his own stamp on it. He was an extremely tight drummer and he really did "ROCK"! You only have to listen to how the other British drummers copied his style to realise how influential he was on the whole of the British music scene. You overseas types can call it the "British Invasion", if you like.
Ringo was good, but only one person in this topic mentioned the best Rock drummer, in my opinion, who was Charlie Watt of the Stones. The Stones had the most screwed-down rhythm section ever! And still do! I think that had a lot to do with Charlie's previous jazz drumming and then his involvement with the early Rhythm and Blues bands (Alexis Korner); out of which style the Stones developed. I knew Charlie in the days when he was moving from the amateur jazz scene to more popular music. I used to sit-in with his jazz mates at the Kingsbury Arms hotel in North London. Later in life, I purchased and enjoyed the jazz recordings he made with his own band. He was still a member of the Stones, of course. He certainly used all he learned from jazz when playing with the Stones and his adaption of those skills to Stones-style Rock is certainly one of the important factors that makes that band so good.
Although I'll never forgive those guys for killing off our wonderful Trad Jazz Boom of the late 50's early 60's.
John happens to be a huge political hero of mine mainly for his (and Yoko's) one-couple peace movement, the bed-in, etc. "Give Peace A Chance!" Who can forget that? A wonderful epitaph for the man!
I think what made Ringo one of the best drummers in the world, was his sense of taste. While not a 'flashy' drummer. He could always keep the beat. And he came up with perfect drums for every song the Beatles recorded. In many songs he acted more like an orchestra drummer..
Almost anybody can play four on the floor.. But only Ringo could come up with those tasty often very subtle parts.. One of Paul's songs, he just played his palms on his legs, the perfect accompaniment..
John and Paul's songs were always very tight and compact.. None of their recorded product had extended solo's of any kind. If you listen to the end of the medley on Abbey Road, George, Paul, and John are each taking 2 bar solo's for a while.. This is the only song to have a drum solo too.. It would have been amazing to hear them at the end of their Germany days, they were perhaps the tightest they ever were.. They stretched stuff out, and improvised a lot.
The main thing to consider, is the personalities of the Beatles. Their was a pecking order, each one had strengths and weaknesses. I don't think anyone but those six (Brian Epstein, and George Martin) and several other key personnel could have achieved what they did.. If you read several Beatles books (which I have).. It started to unravel the day Epstein died.. They held on to it for so long, cause their accountants were telling them to do so, and they really didn't know anyone else but each other.. Lennon freaked out on one of his Solo Plastic Ono band gigs.. He was one of the most famous musicians in the world, and we had never played with anyone else but the Beatles. He was scared Sh#$%$#^less.
Many people go between two poles -Ringo? Charlie Watts - the style of drummer that gets the job done excellently, or the Buddie Rich - everyone listen to me type style.
One Drummer I particularly admire is Steve Gadd - who has both in his kit bag, never pretentious or in your face but has it all there if you need it - every style. A complete Drummer, he even featured in the Buddy RIch Orchestra, plus a list of names so long I wont include them here.
Here is a greate Utube list, including some lessons from him that got a point across to me about my piano playing - not just for drummers....
Many people go between two poles -Ringo? Charlie Watts - the style of drummer that gets the job done excellently, or the Buddie Rich - everyone listen to me type style.
One Drummer I particularly admire is Steve Gadd - who has both in his kit bag, never pretentious or in your face but has it all there if you need it - every style. A complete Drummer, he even featured in the Buddy RIch Orchestra, plus a list of names so long I wont include them here.
Here is a greate Utube list, including some lessons from him that got a point across to me about my piano playing - not just for drummers....
Zero, you make a great comment with mentioning Steve Gadd, there are few better.
One of my favorite drummers also for a long time now (besides Ringo of course) is Jeff Hamilton - an absolute virtuoso of technique.
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Getting off topic I know but there is a stunning rhythm section on this album by Norah Jones - special sounds a miasma of dreams similar to Sgt Pepper....wheeeeeeew!
When it comes to drummers, it is always subjective. I agree Gadd was a master, as well as Watt, Bonham, and others. Buddy Rich; my experience with him was far from favorable, so I'm biased.
However another true gem (often overlooked) is Peter Erskine. I've seen him many times with many different bands and he always impressed me.
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