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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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I'm considering getting a Mac Mini to learn more about Macs. I'm a former comp. sci. prof but I haven't used an Apple computer heavily since 1996. I don't need anything with any speed or power because I have my other Windows computers for that.
1. Can BIAB run successfully on the lowest-spec Mac Mini?
The specs are:
1.4GHz dual-core Intel Core i5
4GB memory
500GB hard drive1
Intel HD Graphics 5000
2. On a PC, we can run the free utility, Geekbench, to see the single-core score and compare to a recommendation from PG Music. Is there a comparable utility and recommended score for a Mac?
Thanks.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Hey Matt, I'm not sure what kind of performance to expect from that particular model, but luckily Geekbench is cross platform and there is a Mac version so you could actually compare "Apples to ...well... non-Apples, I guess"  There is also an app called MacTracker that runs on Mac and ios ( http://mactracker.ca) that lists Geekbench scores for most Mac models. I looked up the 1.4 i5 Mac Mini specs in Mactracker and it gives Geekbench 4 scores of 2966 for single core, and 5223 for multi-core. Hopefully this helps. - Jay
MacPro 5,1/12 core@3.46GHz -- OS X 10.15.7 -- ATI 7970 -- 32 Gig RAM -- Crucial 500GB OS SSD -- Samsung EVO 1TB Audio/Sample SSD -- BIAB 2024 -- Logic Pro X -- Cubase Elements 14 -- Too many plugins
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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You didn’t Say what year yours is but any i5 Mini can run the latest OS. It’s not as fast as an i7 for many tasks but it’s more powerful than the bottom of the line Core Duo versions that are past end of life for many apps—but not BIAB. As BIAB is still 32 bit only, the system and OS requirements shouldn’t be much of an issue. As it turns out, they’re not: BIAB Mac System Requirements System Requirements Mac OS X 10.5 and higher. Intel Processor. Minimum 512 MB RAM Screen Resolution: 1024x768 or higher At least 2 GB recommended for the main Band-in-a-Box® program. More space is required for RealTracks, depending on which package you buy... RealTracks & RealDrums: ~100-400 MB per set Pro RealCombos: ~10 GB MegaPAK RealCombos: ~20 GB Full UltraPlusPAK/EverythingPAK when installed to internal hard drive: ~100 GB (another ~90GB is required for the installation files when downloading the UltraPlusPAK or EverythingPAK) Hard Drive versions of the EverythingPAK or UltraPlusPAK do not require any hard disk space when run directly from the external hard drive they are shipped on. Optical drive for shipped versions of the Pro or MegaPAK version.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Thank you both; great info. I’m all set.
I would be buying a new Mac Mini. It does look like it’s well beyond minimum specs for BIAB. That 2966 Geekbench score is higher than I would have thought. On a PC, the only folks who report problems seem to be below 1700 or so.
About the Core 2 Duo, yes, I still have one of those and it does run BIAB fine. I just use the slow PC options in Preference, RealTracks.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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No problem Matt, I was a bit surprised by those numbers too.
Although It's kind of depressing to think that the entry level Mini has slightly better single core performance than my top of the line 8 core Xeon from just a few years earlier.
Ah well, I reckon that's what's called progress.
I see no performance problems with running BIAB on that setup, as long as like Mike said you have enough disk space and RAM.
4 Gigs of RAM should be sufficient, although I would think that 8 would be better.
I upgraded my 2011 Mini to 8 Gigs a while back and it did make a noticeable difference.
Hopefully it is upgradeable and not soldered to the motherboard like the laptops are.
Much cheaper to do it after the fact, IMHO, than to pay Apple's outrageous prices for RAM upgrades.
- Jay
MacPro 5,1/12 core@3.46GHz -- OS X 10.15.7 -- ATI 7970 -- 32 Gig RAM -- Crucial 500GB OS SSD -- Samsung EVO 1TB Audio/Sample SSD -- BIAB 2024 -- Logic Pro X -- Cubase Elements 14 -- Too many plugins
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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The RAM above 4GB would help me only if I used a software synth, and I have a spare Roland Fantom XR. I assume in the Mac world a 32-bit program can’t address more than 4GB unless JBridge or some equivalent works.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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You are exactly right Matt, as long as you are just running BIAB you shouldn't have an issue. I was forced to use my Mini exclusively for a couple of weeks about a year ago, while my main machine was broken and waiting for parts. Where I really noticed the big slowdowns, (with 4GB) was when I was running both BIAB and Garageband, to drag and drop tracks from BIAB to GB (something I do a lot). I'm thinking a SSD would have helped a lot too, since IMHO that little laptop 5400 RPM drive is definitely the weak link in the Mac Mini. Switching from one app to another with 4GB was painfully slow, you could hear that little drive working like crazy to page all that VM to and from the disk. Since I was only using the Mini temporarily, I didn't transfer all my plugins over, but I imagine using a lot of plugins could affect performance as well (especially "jbridging" 64-bit plugins as you said). For just messing around with BIAB itself you should be fine, but for serious work I would consider upgrading the RAM. Just my $.02 though, YMMV, I'm not trying to talk you out of it (really I'm not). Hopefully it should be enough RAM for what you want to do then. - Jay
Last edited by JayO; 01/29/18 01:50 PM.
MacPro 5,1/12 core@3.46GHz -- OS X 10.15.7 -- ATI 7970 -- 32 Gig RAM -- Crucial 500GB OS SSD -- Samsung EVO 1TB Audio/Sample SSD -- BIAB 2024 -- Logic Pro X -- Cubase Elements 14 -- Too many plugins
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Thanks Jay. The primary reason is to reacquaint myself with Mac OS so I can assist my wife who uses her Mac for everything. I just thought, why not put something I really like on mine? Otherwise playing with it would be boring.
I was fully checked out on Apple computers from 1977 to 1996. I used an Apple in the early 90s to do music notation, but then the program was released for the PC.
I figure one or two things may have changed since 1996.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Going forward, the Mini is dead but the late 2012 i7 Quad is a kickass little machine. All 4 models can be upgraded to 16G RAM and a 2T SSD—you can drop two 2T SSDs into the Server versions without adapters. FireWire, USB 3, Thunderbolt and HDMI ports. Minis on EveryMac Unfortunately, Apple toned it down for late 2014 with dual processors instead of quad and non-upgradable, soldered RAM. It’s not a bad machine but pales in comparison to the 2012.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Thanks. I know it’s a dead model. It will do for my purposes.
The original Mac Mini was quite a surprise, though.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Just a followup.
I bought a very nice old iMac for $400. It has a 2.5 Ghz i5, 4 GB RAM (room for 4 more), 21.5" screen (lovely!!), 2 TB drive, and even a CD player. I'm writing this on it. High Sierra 10.13.2.
I connected my Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 (1st gen) and all is good.
BIAB runs fine.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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$400 is a great price. The 21.5” iMac will last through the next OS at least—after that, I don’t know but I expect quite awhile.
Because it has to be dissembled, it is difficult to upgrade these to an SSD and install more RAM but any Mac tech can do it. The speed increase is more than worth it when the time comes—which it will as the heat cooks hard drives.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Thanks Mike. I already upgraded to 8GB RAM.
Yes, an SSD would be great, and I have put one in every PC. Apparently to do it on this iMac, I would have to take the monitor apart. Luckily, the Apple dealer is nearby.
Boy, it does spend a lot of time with a beachball doing updates. I just connected it to the Internet and I've read High Sierra takes hours for some people to finish these actions. I disabled the iCloud and things are better.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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High Sierra is faster and smoother. Apple’s desire to have you store all documents and data on the cloud is just nuts for most of us. I disabled that pronto. This is not to be confused with using iCloud to share Contacts, Notes and Photos among your various devices—that works quite well. The other requires fast, reliable internet at all times—no thanks especially when storage is so cheap. You don’t say what year your iMac is. All are fairly easy to get into if you’re ok with tools and have a little patience. I do this job one-handed (no joke—I lost the use of my left arm in 2009) but, if not comfortable with the idea, have it done. Late 2009–2011 use magnets and screws while 2012-on use pre-cut double-stick foam tape. In both cases, tools and the kits are readily available as well as the adapter bracket and special heat sensor from OWC. Here are the instructional videos. Find the correct year for yours. OWC iMac Install Videos There are 2 heat sensors: 2009–2010 and 2011-on. They are not interchangeable nor are the optional (the software solutions cause the Mac to roar during startup and you have to control internal temperatures manually—not a solution in my book). OWC sells them with and without toolkits. iMac Drive Heat sensors Besides the SSD, this is the bracket: iMac HHD to SSD adapter As much as I like the Samsung 850 EVO, the new Crucial MX500 is nearly as good and quite a bit less. The 2T is $499 on Amazon and has a 5 year warranty. The MX300 is ok but is a little slower and has a 3 yr warr. — if the price is good, I wouldn’t hesitate.
Last edited by Mike Halloran; 02/05/18 07:29 PM.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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Band-in-a-Box for Macintosh
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Again, thanks Mike. I should have posted that I added 4 GB and the beachballs went away. All is good now and plenty fine for my purposes of just learning MAC OS to help my wife on hers. BIAB 2017 works very well.
I've built all my own PCs - dozens - since 1983 so I could tackle such a project with ease if needed, but my local Apple dealer is a wiz and I'll probably just have him do it since this would be new to me. I won't pay more for the SSD than the whole iMac, though! By the way, you asked: it's a Mid-2011.
We can sign off this thread. I'm all set, thanks to some great help here. Appreciate it!
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Matt, I know you wanted to sign off, but do I understand correctly that you have installed High Sierra on your iMac with a standard HD drive, not a SSD?
I thought that High Sierra, at least when it was first released, required a SSD, though I heard that a later update would work on HDDs. I just recently upgraded to Sierra on my iMac, but held off on installing High Sierra.
Incidentally, I DO have a bootable external drive that runs Sierra, but when I tried to install High Sierra on it, I was told that it could not install on that drive.
Ron
UltraPAK 2021, 27" late 2012 iMac, 16 GB RAM, OSX 10.15.7
Logic Pro X 10.6.3
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My Mac expertise is all of one week old, but yes, I have High Sierra running successfully on a 1 TB standard hard drive. The dealer did the upgrade from Sierra so I don’t know what hitches, if any, were involved. He’s a wizard.
Since then I did quite a bit of reading, and Apple said the hardware requirements for High Sierra were the same as Sierra.
This iMac I have clearly did not have a 1 TB drive when it was built in 2011.
Does that help?
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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1T was the largest drive available in the late 2011. These usually have a WD Black and those drives are past end of life. Not one of my clients still has one installed. These were great drives but generate a lot of heat and the iMac is an oven. The late 2011 is my favorite. FW and Thunderbolt, USB 2, and was th first year of the SATA III 6G bus (for the drive only—the optical is on a 3G bus). The 27” has a spare SATA bus that yours doesn’t—not an issue now that 2T and 4T SSDs exist. My wife has one. High Sierra installs fine but the HHD cannot be formatted APFS. It makes a difference on some drive intensive applications such as Digital Performer but not the huge difference that going to an SSD will. APFS was optionalonly during the beta period so I was abl to test it both ways. It’s possible that if your drive was replaced, it already has the OWC heat sensor. In that case, you only need the SSD and bracket. If not, you need the 2011-on sensor. Besides the huge speed and performance boost, an SSD reduces the internal heat. A Micron 1100 is the same drive as the Crucial MX300. It is only sold to systems integrators and OEMs and has a 90 day warranty (their cost takes this into account). SIs sell these on eBay, sometimes at great prices. TRIM is part of the Mac OS but disabled on 3rd party SSDs by default. After installing an SSD, run the following in Terminal: sudo trimforce enable. Click through the Apple CYA warnings. Disable App Nap globally. Many apps do not play well with it. It’s sole purpose is to preserve battery life—not an issue with an iMac. Disable App Nap
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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Got it! Thanks for all these great tips.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
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The 2025 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2025 49-PAK!
Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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