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Hi group. I am a real newbie with my first install and having a great time learning. I bought the program because of the quality of the RealTracks to make backing tracks for myself.
I am super impressed with how the RealTracks do sound.
That brings me to the question of why would one would want to use the MIDI tracks or MIDI combined with RealTracks styles? I realize that all the MIDI offerings are there from previous releases of the software. And clearly for some there must be benefits to using MIDI styles as I have picked up from forum comments. But I am totally naive as to why that would be so considering the superior sound quality of the RealTracks.
Can the board help me appreciate these simple but "new to me" nuances?
Thanks so much!
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Both MIDI and RealTracks have their advantages. The advantage with MIDI is that you can create your own specific runs, and effects, change just about anything, while RealTracks are generally pre-recorded music passages. With MIDI, you can change the instrument from a jazz guitar to a rock guitar with relative ease, and you can also record your own tracks through a number of different MIDI instruments (e.g. a keyboard or even a digital saxophone. ) That being said, the latest BiaB incorporates 'Playable RealTracks' which is another game changer. Nevertheless, MIDI has an important place in the BiaB product.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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I think for me, I use some midi tracks because they are easy to modify. Also if I don't like the sound they produce, which is 99% of the time, I can change that tone with the many VSTs I have.
I assume there are a lot of other reasons that people who have been using midi for years have that I am unaware of.
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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OK, VideoTrack and Planobilly, those comments were helpful for understanding, Since I have never worked with MIDI (That I know of ! LOL) your comments helped open the doors to new understanding. Thanks for that 
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Here's a partial explanation that occurred to me, perhaps it may be of some value.
Say you have a really nice acoustic guitar thing you just improvised (on a real guitar!) and recorded, recording in two forms: audio and MIDI.
The audio recording captured however you sounded when you recorded it, on whatever real guitar you played. You can add post-production effects, reverb and such, but the underlying audio is fixed. It's what you played on that guitar.
The MIDI recording, on the other hand, can be rendered in production however you please, as a guitar or piano or violin or saxophone orchestra or 1950s electronic sounds or maybe a flock of sampled geese.
Consider how you might use those two recordings as material to slice and dice and recombine, for use in different creative projects going forward.
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Another advantage I've learned with using Midi besides the ability to change patches (instruments) and edit riffs and melody's, is the ability midi has to capture the feel and dynamics of a song.
For instance, assume you want to write an original song 'in the style' the Bee Gee's "How Deep Is Your Love". Loading a Midi of the song in BIAB will replicate the instruments, chords, tempo, key signature and feel of the original song. It will sound 90% like the original recording.
The user can use BIAB RealTracks, a VST, input new chords and create an original song using the midi file as a template to create an original composition 'in the style' of without having to start from scratch.
BIAB can easily handle a song file that's using both RealTracks and Midi in the arrangement.
Charlie
Last edited by Charlie Fogle; 12/02/21 05:12 PM.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Mark Hayes and Charlie Fogle - Fascinating. I had no idea and I see a yawning rabbit hole opening up before me! Looks like it might be very fun to go down.
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and if a song has a 'signature riff'- say the horns on dancing in the street - you can easily replicate that in midi. even with the new editable realtracks it probably won't be as easy with realtracks. haven't tried the new editable realtracks yet but until now you were restricted to what the artist had actuallly recorded.
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Here's a partial explanation that occurred to me, perhaps it may be of some value.
Say you have a really nice acoustic guitar thing you just improvised (on a real guitar!) and recorded, recording in two forms: audio and MIDI.
The audio recording captured however you sounded when you recorded it, on whatever real guitar you played. You can add post-production effects, reverb and such, but the underlying audio is fixed. It's what you played on that guitar.
The MIDI recording, on the other hand, can be rendered in production however you please, as a guitar or piano or violin or saxophone orchestra or 1950s electronic sounds or maybe a flock of sampled geese.
Consider how you might use those two recordings as material to slice and dice and recombine, for use in different creative projects going forward. An interesting aside to Mark's suggestion above is this process of combining audio and midi has been possible in BIAB for quite some time but mostly overlooked and underutilized. These new upgrades and improvements to BIAB 2022 may bring new life to long existing features. Quote from forum post by Andrew with PG Music staff on 12/04/13 (Nearly 8 years ago to the day!)
7. Artist Performance Files. These are audio files, that you put on a track, that can also have the MIDI transcription of it. People hear the audio, and see the MIDI in notation/guitar tab etc. For example, if you are a great bluegrass fiddle player, you could put your songs in this format. People can listen to your real playing, see the notes on screen, slow them down etc. - all inside Band-in-a-Box where they can do other things like solo/mute other tracks, mix them etc.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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In addition to the previous mentioned reasons here are a few more:
1- With MIDI you can change the tempo without adding artifacts to the sound. One can go from 10 BPM to 300 BPM and the sound will sound the same and only the tempo will change.
2- You can change any chord into another in MIDI. If you want an Am7b5#9 you can either play it or write it. All chords are possible in MIDI
3-You can change the length and/or pitch of any chord or note in MIDI.
4- You can add or delete vibrato with MIDI
5- Using filters you can change a sound while it it playing in MIDI. This is great for programing sweeps.
6- You can have each drum on a separate track. This each track can be modified,i.e. different effects on each track, write/play your own fills, etc. (This may be possible with RTs in BiaB 2022, don't know....yet)
In other words MIDI has a lot of advantages going for it. However it takes a few bucks to get good MIDI sounds and a learning curve to achieve good emulations.
RTs have their place but so does MIDI.
Just my thoughts.
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MIDI is thousands of times more editable than audio. If you have a good MIDI synthesizer, it can sound 95% or more as good as the real instrument. If you have a cheesy synth, you will have cheesy sounds. If you have a great synth, you'll have great sounds. You can export a MIDI track to a Sequencer or DAW and make the music more expressive. The average listener listens to expression more than tone, which is why singers like Dr. John, Stevie Nicks, John Lennon, Blossom Dearie and others can sell zillions of records with voices that are not considered great sounding. And what is great tone? Take guitar is in Hendrix? Burrell? May? Hall? Slash? Beck? Clapton? Armstrong? Satriani? And on which guitar? Jimmy Page plays better on an el-cheapo Danelectro than most others do on top-of-the-line premium guitars. Here is a short list of what you can do with MIDI that you cannot do with audio: http://www.nortonmusic.com/midi_vs_loops.htmlAnd here is a link to the continuous controllers that you can use to coax more expression out of MIDI http://www.nortonmusic.com/midi_cc.htmlI make backing tracks for my duo, The Sophisticats http://www.s-cats.com, that would be impossible to make with RealTracks. I'll use BiaB MIDI tracks and add the song specific licks and other parts that a generic BiaB style can't do. And BiaB styles need to be generic. If you had a style with an obvious signature lick for one song, it would only be good for that song. Music is a journey, life is too short to learn it all. But that makes it interesting, as you can learn new things forever to keep it from being boring. Your first inroads into MIDI may be baby steps, but sooner or later you will be able to make better music with MIDI than you can with audio loops. But remember, there is more than one right way to make music. The RealTracks are fantastic, and although I prefer MIDI, when a RT is just right for what I need, I'll use it. It's good to have an assortment of tools in your tool chest. Insights and incites by Notes
Last edited by Notes Norton; 12/03/21 03:57 AM. Reason: Typo
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Thank you for the valuable insight into MIDI.
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I don't use midi in the traditional sense but i do like the MidiSuperTracks. The are almost identical to their RT counterpart and I can easily put one of the many sounds on the track that comes with my DAW (Logic Pro). I've been particularly pleased with Logic's Grand Steinway on MST piano tracks. For our blues rock centered productions I can typically find a MST to work with.
This is very primitive compared to the folks who as described about use midi to the max.
Bud
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos are here on our website.
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Remarkable and educational comments and answers. I will follow the links and explore. There is a whole world out there/here that obviously I do not know about. This community is amazing.
I just upgraded to UltraPak and am loving the learning curve.
I especially liked Norton's quote:
"Music is a journey, life is too short to learn it all. But that makes it interesting, as you can learn new things forever to keep it from being boring."
Learning is what I like most in life.
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A couple of quotes on MIDI:
Excerpt from Electronic Musician (EM) February 2013 by Craig Anderton:
…Thirty years ago, at the 1983 Winter NAMM show, a Sequential Circuits Prophet-600 talked to a Roland JX-3P and MIDI went mainstream. Since then, MIDI has become embedded in the DNA of virtually every pop music production (yes I stole that line from Alan Parsons, but I don't think he'll mind)…
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Excerpted from Keyboard magazine, March 2014 by Craig Anderton:
…Today you can easily record 100 tracks of digital audio on a basic laptop, so MIDI may seem irrelevant in the studio. Yet MIDI remains not only viable, but valuable, because it lets you exploit today's studio in ways that digital audio still can't.
…
Deep editing. Digital audio allows for broad edits, like changing levels or moving sections around, and editing tools such as Melodyne are doing ever more fine-grained audio surgery. But MIDI is more fine grained still: You can edit every characteristic of every performance gesture: dynamics, volume, timing, the length and pitch of every note, pitch-bend, and even which sound is being played. MIDI data can tell a piano sound what to play, or if you change your mind, a Clavinet patch. With digital audio, changing the instrument that plays a given part requires re-recording the track….but MIDI can do much more…
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I feel that I can take a BiaB MIDI file, download it to a MIDI sequencer or DAW, add a few things, subtract a few things, move a few things around, change the inversion of a chord so the melody note comes out better, change a couple of voices (patches), add a real intro, add a real ending, and so on, then turn the already very good output of Band-in-a-Box into something ready for prime time.
I learn how to improve from things I try that work, and I learn what not to do from things I try that don't work.
The result is the backing tracks I make for my duo today are much better than they were in the 1990s because I've learned so much since then.
Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
The 2025 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2025 49-PAK!
Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
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