I found these comments really helpful in telling me what's what. That is the kind of perspective and knowledge I didn't have. It's all beginning to come into focus. And I am honing in on what I want with the program. Thanks so much.
If I can help you in any way feel free to ask. I will do my best I can to answer any questions that you may have.
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
I have been using VirtualMidiSynth for years now in BIAB. Here is how I do it and it works 100% of the time for me in both 32bit and 64bit. I also use VirtualMidySynth for my midi sound output in TablEdit. In fact, it will drive both BIAB and TablEdit at the same time.
1. Download VMS and install it. 2. In BIAB go to your midi drive setup and chose VMS. Make sure that you don't check the Use VSTi/DXi Synth box 3. I had to set my latency to around 200 MS
VMS is not a VSTI device at all. VirtualMIDISynth is a software MIDI synthesizer implemented as a Windows multimedia user driver, accessible as a standard MIDI Out device. You can set it up to use 4 audio output devices. I have BIAB using #1 and TablEdit using #2. That way they do not conflict at all.
I think what confuses most people is that they think it is a VSTI device. It is not.
BIAB2025 Windows 10 Pro WA6NCB No Longer on a Crappy Laptop!
I have been using VirtualMidiSynth for years now in BIAB. Here is how I do it and it works 100% of the time for me in both 32bit and 64bit. I also use VirtualMidySynth for my midi sound output in TablEdit. In fact, it will drive both BIAB and TablEdit at the same time.
1. Download VMS and install it. 2. In BIAB go to your midi drive setup and chose VMS. Make sure that you don't check the Use VSTi/DXi Synth box 3. I had to set my latency to around 200 MS
VMS is not a VSTI device at all. VirtualMIDISynth is a software MIDI synthesizer implemented as a Windows multimedia user driver, accessible as a standard MIDI Out device. You can set it up to use 4 audio output devices. I have BIAB using #1 and TablEdit using #2. That way they do not conflict at all.
I think what confuses most people is that they think it is a VSTI device. It is not.
Thank you for pointing this out. I've been using VMS for many years, but was unaware of this configuration option. I just set VMS to allow the max (4 devices).
A big mug of Christmas cheer to you!
To repeat what I mentioned in a different thread on this subject, I use the Arachno soundfont (download link on the VMS download page). I also use the JJazzLab soundfont available on the JJazzLab download page.
I just set JJazzLab to use the VMS #2 device. Never thought of running BiaB and JJazzLab at the same time, but I can now. Since JJazzLab does not use an audio driver, there will be no conflict with BiaB using my ASIO driver.
QUESTION: How did you arrive at 200 mS of latency?
Last edited by TheMaartian; 12/20/2107:49 PM.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2025 Ultra Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7 Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
To get the most out of them you have to add some continuous controller (CC) data. In other words you have to emulate the sound you are after via CCs, pitch bends, and the mod wheel. For example take a MIDI track sax. To make it more realistic you must add pitch bends, vibrato, volume, etc and play it like a sax, i.e. no polyphony, stay within the sax's range, etc. You will either need a MIDI controller of some kind or add them via manual input. A MIDI controller keyboard with sliders and knobs is the best option IMHO.
Is there a guide somewhere of how best to do this?
I presume one can "overdub" MIDI CCs onto the Melody and Soloist tracks, though I have yet to try that.
AFAICS, the "all tracks are equal" doesn't yet have them equal enough to do that on other tracks.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful. AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11 BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software. Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts .
I arrived at the figure of 200ms by watching the onscreen metronome in BIAB as it counted 1,2 1,2,3,4 and listening to the midi drum count-in. It was obviously off so I adjusted the latency so they matched. I guess you could also by clicking on the Latency Adjust... in BIAB under MIDI/Audio Driver Setup.
That figure of 200ms applied to my particular setup. Don't be surprised if yours is either different or does not even need to be changed at all.
Also, BIAB has a habit of periodically letting me know that VMS is a software synth and the latency should be set to Zero. I just ignore that and I wish it would mind it's own business about how I set things up.
BIAB2025 Windows 10 Pro WA6NCB No Longer on a Crappy Laptop!
Note that some are universal like volume, pan, etc. But all the others are left up to the software program you are using. They can be assigned to a variety of different controls in your synthesizer/sampler/effects units. Common mappings include adding vibrato, or adjusting filter cutoff.
I can not answer your other questions as I do all of my MIDI editing in my DAW, Studio One Pro 5. My workflow is to sketch out a chord progression and style(s) in BiaB then immediately drag and drop them into Studio One.
I hope this helps.
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
I can not answer your other questions as I do all of my MIDI editing in my DAW .... I hope this helps.
With hindsight, it was perhaps a bit dumb of me to presume you did it in BiaB. DAWs are already set up to handle it and are probably the best place for it.
Yes it helps. Thanks.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful. AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11 BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software. Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts .
I can not answer your other questions as I do all of my MIDI editing in my DAW .... I hope this helps.
With hindsight, it was perhaps a bit dumb of me to presume you did it in BiaB. DAWs are already set up to handle it and are probably the best place for it.
Yes it helps. Thanks.
No you were not a bit dumb. You had no idea what my workflow was. Others can help with those questions because they do a lot more intensive work in BiaB than I do.
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Roland Sound Canvas VA VST2 64 what I usually use for midi listening on BIAB 2022 64bits. little cpu consumption, multitimbric, sound customization, 63 drum kits, 1600 sounds, 16 racks for instruments and 64 notes of polyphony. lifetime license and 5 activations. If you are looking for something like Coyote Forte Dxi, this is better it costs about the same. Install and I forgot to look for someone else. No complaints.
Greetings
To the one who gets up early, nobody makes him breakfast.
I arrived at the figure of 200ms by watching the onscreen metronome in BIAB as it counted 1,2 1,2,3,4 and listening to the midi drum count-in. It was obviously off so I adjusted the latency so they matched. I guess you could also by clicking on the Latency Adjust... in BIAB under MIDI/Audio Driver Setup.
That figure of 200ms applied to my particular setup. Don't be surprised if yours is either different or does not even need to be changed at all.
Also, BIAB has a habit of periodically letting me know that VMS is a software synth and the latency should be set to Zero. I just ignore that and I wish it would mind it's own business about how I set things up.
Thank you for the explanation.
ThinkPad i9 32GB RAM 7TB SSD; Win11 Pro; RME Fireface UCX II; BiaB 2025 Ultra Bitwig Studio 5; Studio One Pro 7; Melodyne Studio 5; Acoustica Premium 7 Gig Performer 5; NI S61 MK3; Focal Shape 65; Beyerdynamic DT 880 & 770
I agree with MarioD and others who say MIDI will still sound like MIDI without some data massaging and controller information added to emulate the dynamics and articulations of the instruments. So I use TTS1 for my default MIDI source just to get decent, quick previewing for a lot of instruments, but wouldn't use it for a final product at least for most instruments. Most of my music (jazz/bossa nova influenced) uses a specific set of instruments - acoustic piano, nylon guitar, vibes especially - and I've invested in some dedicated VST plugins for those. I play most piano stuff myself, but have found that the MIDI generated from many of the acoustic guitar real tracks sounds very good going thru my Ample Sound classical guitar VST. I also find the piano RealTrack audio often sounds too compressed and choppy. (In general I don't find RealTracks of polyphonic instruments with a lot of sustain render all that well.) But sending that MIDI to my Pianoteq 7 plugin sounds great and gives more control. I've just started going down this path, and find that the RealTrack MIDI sounds much better and less mechanical than a MIDI-only track coming from a MIDI style. Quality of transcription may influence this.
Your experience may vary, especially depending upon what musical styles you are working with.
Chuck Wiggins
BIAB 2023 Win UltraPak, Cakewalk, Windows 10 Pro Custom AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core, Focusrite Scarlett 4x4 interface
XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
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Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
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These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
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This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
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Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
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-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
Playable RealTracks Set 4
RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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