Yes, by George I think you've got it. You had my head spinning since there are so many ways to think about this stuff.
To move a major scale up a half step (C to C#) every note in the triad moves up a half step and likewise to move the scale down a half step every note in the scale goes down a half step (C - Cb). Then, just like you did you have to clean up the accidentals. for example. (F## = G).
Yes, by George I think you've got it. You had my head spinning since there are so many ways to think about this stuff.
I just have 1 bone to pick. We need to change your name from MusicStudent to MusicTeacher ! The mark of a good teacher is to recognize what his students don't know and you have that skill my friend!
Here are the major chord spellings with sharp root notes. I think I can produce the corresponding table for the flat root notes.
So for the rest of the list in my original post should I use one of the websites you provided?
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
I think a light bulb went off. If F Major is F-A-C and F# Major is F#-A#-C# Then is C# Major C#-E#-G# = C#-F-G#?
And D# Major D#-F##-A# = D#-G-A#?
If so, does the same work Xb Major? Just flatten the notes of the natural major chord notes?
Yes, it works exactly like that. What's important is the intervals between the notes .. the intervals are always the same on and same type of chord, no matter on what note they start. It's true of all the notes in a chord, including the various 9ths and so on. Notes may sometimes be moved to the same note in a different octave. Learning how to find them quickly and easily is part of the challenge.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful. AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11 BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software. Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts .
Actually, technically, there is no key of D#. It'd be Eb. Comprised of Eb, G, Bb. (The 1-3-5 of the Eb scale. Reference back to the "counting" method and the 'wwhwwwh' scale structure I shared in that PM.)
Familiarize yourself with this.
C is "neutral". As you move left, you add a flat. As you move right, you add a sharp.
Also note that as you move left you move from the root note to the 4th of that scale. As you move right you move from the root note to the 5th of that scale.
When you hear that the progression is "1-4-5" from whatever your start key is, 4 is one to the left, 5 is one to the right.
The green letters in the inner circle are the 6th step of the scale, called the relative minor. The famous "Don't Stop Believing" chord riff is 1-5-6m-4, lifted from Pachelbel's Canon in D. Using that Circle of 5ths chart you can wing that song in any key. Or play at any blues jam, which are mostly going to be some variation of 1-4-5 with that occasional 6m tossed in.
It's all about repetitions. The more golf balls you hit or rounds you fire, the better you become at whatever the skill is. If you want it, you'll get there.
Thanks to all for helping me. Especially MusicStudent (aka MusicTeacher). Going back to my original post, here is the 1st of 15 tables I was hoping to find in a book or website. Clearly it took some effort to build this table but I find this table very easy and fast to read.
At some point, I'd like to build the other 14.
Some of the motivation behind this endeavor is that the currency that BiaB uses is the chord. So I'm thinking that it might pay dividends for me to know how these chords are constructed and spelled. This table does exactly that and it was fun to build.
Am I barking up a wrong tree here? Is this table useless for the theory newbie?
AudioTrack, hopefully you see now what I was trying to say in my original post regarding sharps and flats. I apologize for not having the necessary music vocabulary to express all my thoughts crystal clearly.
Unless I have a typo, I think you can confirm in this table that the 4 enharmonics are maintained at the chord level. FbMaj = EMaj E#Maj = FMaj CbMaj = BMaj B#Maj = CMaj
I realize that all of these chords (and others) may not be used in making music, but as an educational exercise I wanted to be complete and understand how note and chord names work. Eddie points out that technically the key of D# doesn't exist. OK, but I'm interested in chords because BiaB uses chords. The relationship between chords and keys will be a subject in the future. I'm just trying to understand chords at this time.
I really appreciate all your help. And I know I need a Music Theory course at a local Community College but that's not possible at this time.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
Lenovo YOGA 900 Window s 10 Home 64bit M4 pro Mac mini 1tb HD 24GB mem casio wk7500 presonus audiobox i2 usb interface casio wk-7500 biab & realband 2025 everything pk both with Current builds
This table does exactly that and it was fun to build.
Am I barking up a wrong tree here? Is this table useless for the theory newbie?
You already acknowledged "it was fun". Can't ask for anything more. An by the way, making this table is essential for a theory newbie!
So now keep moving forward. You will discover that after a while you will not need this table since you will now understand how the table is made. I suggest you now pick up your instrument (Bass?) and find all these notes (apreggios) on the neck. You will discover these all have the same pattern up and down and across the neck (major triads). This will provide a new reference point for you in identifying the intervals which will reinforce what the tables have told you. Then yes, Scales next!
You already acknowledged "it was fun". Can't ask for anything more. An by the way, making this table is essential for a theory newbie!
Thanks "Teacher"
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
FWIW, I searched for "bass guitar chords", rather than piano. Much of the time a bass player will play arpeggios, rather than chords, but as arpeggios comprise the notes from the chords, that's fine. It also fives the opportunity to see helpful fingerings/voicings.
Incidentally, I note he refers to the 10th. That's a little unconventional, at least when referring to piano chords, but it's just another way of describing the 3rd and octave up.
Last edited by Gordon Scott; 09/10/2212:56 AM. Reason: added note about the 10th.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful. AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11 BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software. Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts .
Incidentally, I note he refers to the 10th. That's a little unconventional, at least when referring to piano chords, but it's just another way of describing the 3rd and octave up.
FYI - Around here the 10th is quite common among pianists.
I'm in a fitness protection program. I'm been hiding from exercise.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
FYI - Around here the 10th is quite common among pianists.
Oh, OK. Unknown to me. Nothing really wrong with it, anyhow, I guess.
Does it follow the other usual convention and imply also the dominant-7th and 9th, or is it just a voicing guide?
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful. AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11 BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software. Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts .
The old conventions are less important to the younger newer musicians who never learned them. In this information society, anyone can setup a website or contribute to a forum and then pass on information which is limited to the knowledge they possess. Kinda what I do....
FYI - Around here the 10th is quite common among pianists.
Oh, OK. Unknown to me. Nothing really wrong with it, anyhow, I guess.
Does it follow the other usual convention and imply also the dominant-7th and 9th, or is it just a voicing guide?
As far as I know it is just a voicing guide. JonD's father was a music professor at a local university and he always talked about the 10th. JonD also talked about the 10th as well as the guy whom tunes our piano. I take to mean any chord that has the third an octave over the last note of the chord. As a guitarist I don't worry about those kind of things.
I'm in a fitness protection program. I'm been hiding from exercise.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Incidentally, I note he refers to the 10th. That's a little unconventional, at least when referring to piano chords, but it's just another way of describing the 3rd and octave up.
FYI - Around here the 10th is quite common among pianists.
Martin Taylor teaches finding the 10th when he teaches fingerstyle jazz guitar.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
Incidentally, I note he refers to the 10th. That's a little unconventional, at least when referring to piano chords, but it's just another way of describing the 3rd and octave up.
FYI - Around here the 10th is quite common among pianists.
Martin Taylor teaches finding the 10th when he teaches fingerstyle jazz guitar.
Interesting. Thanx for the info.
I'm in a fitness protection program. I'm been hiding from exercise.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
From what I remember from college, the 10th falls in a symmetrical line of semitones. Don't quote me though. College was almost 50 years ago and I am having more and more days when I don't remember where my car is when I come out of Walmart.
My BRIGHT ORANGE car!!
Parked right by the door in a handicapped space!!
Yet I remember the house phone number from when I was a little kid. And that was back when there were "word" exchanges rather than all numbers. Our area had EXpress, ENdicott, GArfield and many more.
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