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I select ASIO4ALL as the driver, and i want to use BANDSTAND as my default VSTI plugin, ive tried selecting Microsoft MIDI Mapper, No midid drivers for output at all, you name it, still these messages,
and the weird thing is - sometimes after all these warning it actually DOES play audio, even though the warning dialol says i shouldnt expect any audio!.
I select BANDSTAND ( last release ) as the default MIDI - but i thing the issue happens even with coyote.
I would like to know definitively - which options should i choose ?
I have an M audio driver working fine for MIDI input.
I use ASIO4ALL.
What should the rest of the settings be ?
I have NO external synths - i dont need MIDI to go anywhere than to my RB tracks.
Something is buggy here.
This is the latest Release.
Last edited by dstenning; 08/20/11 02:00 PM.
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Unless you NEED ASIO use the WDM/MME drivers. If you NEED ASIO try the Delta ones first. ASIO4ALL should be your last resort.
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My issue with MME drivers is that the mixer reacts very slowly. When I need to boost or cut something on the fly I have to guess how many beats lead time I need before I will hear the boost or the cut. I was able to get ASIO to work one time, and that day the mixer responded in real time. The next time I hit play, I got the standard "ASIO is messed up" error.
Now as we follow these driver threads, there are 2 camps. One camps suggests using the ASIO no matter what it takes to get them to work, and use the MME as a fallback if the ASIO doesn't work. Now we see someone say "last resort".
Is there a definitive article somewhere that addresses this? We ought to put this debate to rest already.
In my case, 4 different people told me to update drovers for my M-Audio interface. I have had the latest M-Audio drivers all along. This batch says right on the M-Audio site that they are THE drivers for ASIO use with the M-Audio and there will never be an issue if you use this driver. I installed them and got the same error I had with ASIO4ALL.
Is ASIO4ALL supposed to be a generic ASIO driver that will solve world hunger? I have not really seen any feedback here that says it works consistently or not.
Can we get some people weighing in on that specific topic? What you use as far as sound card/interface and driver? I tried ASIO4ALL. I put them on my Dell, loaded RB, for the first load and launch it was fine. Worked with the mixer, the volume responded in real time. Muting and soloing of tracks happened immediately when I clicked. When I loaded the second song in and hit play, I got ASIO errors. I don't have enough experience with this topic to know better. Can we have some meaningful discussion? I really loved the 5:24 everything worked in real time. The next minute started the "not so much" part.....
Thoughts?
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ASIO4ALL is for those without REAL ASIO drivers.Thus the "last resort" See the other post about the mixer Eddie. BTW I have 3 different sound cards I use in the Toshiba. 1. The internal AC97 card BUT I use these drivers for it. http://members.home.nl/nahutec/AC97ASIO/ac97asio.htm2. An Audidgy2ZS notebook with KX drivers 3. IKMultimedia with their drivers that BTW are only ASIO they have no others. Flawless operation with all 3.
Last edited by silvertones; 08/20/11 03:02 PM.
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Don't know if this will work for you and don't know why it works, but this seems to work for me. I installed MidiYoke, which gives you several virtual MIDI ports. If I'm using a software synth (DXi or VSTi), I never select the default Microsoft synth, but instead select the MidiYoke port, and then assign the DXi or VSTi. ASIO4ALL is set to the laptop's soundcard (or I select the M-Audio ASIO driver when using my FastTrack Pro). I've not had problems with stutter since I started doing that. Just something to think about. And there are no conflicts between MIDI ports and Microsoft's handling of audio. Just a thought. May not work for you but works for me.
Using MIDI yoke also lets me connect standalone softsynth interfaces by selecting a MIDIYoke output on the application and the same MIDIYoke input in the softsynch interface.
YMMV.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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PG Music Staff
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Hi, What exactly do these error messages say? If it's something like "Your MIDI Output Driver is installed correctly but is in use by another program", and then something about your Audio and MIDI Output being silent, it's because of a conflict between ASIO4ALL and the Microsoft GS Wavetable. Selecting MIDI Mapper is basically the same as selecting the Wavetable, so that'll do it too, and so would not selecting anything at all. The easiest solution is to go to http://nerds.de/en/download.html and download the Loopbe1 driver. In Band-in-a-Box (or RealBand, or PowerTracks), select Loopbe as your MIDI Output Driver, and restart the program. That usually does the trick. If that wasn't it, please let us know the exact words of these error messages, and I'm sure we'll figure it out. Thanks Kent PG Music
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See, John and John, here is where I get lost. Now we add MidiYoke to the equation. Coyote, Leopard, Panther, Armadillo... whatever.... I plug my M-Audio into my USB port and I hit play. I don't use soft synths, I don't add this 3rd party software or run that widget.... when I need supplemental instruments I play them into my computer myself through my MIDI interface, and record them as audio tracks into RB. (Mainly so I don't forget how to actually play since this software is so good it plays better than I can.)
Now here's another aspect. I call my M-Audio my MIDI Interface. What I consider my sound card is that RealTek stuff that is built onto the motherboard. Back in the day I had a Soundblaster AWE Gold 64 that made the Windows beeps and blips and played radio stations and that is what I considered to be a "sound card". Anything I can plug MIDI cables into I call a MIDI interface, and I am getting lost in some of these conversations because of terminology. Yes, sound comes through that M-Audio MIDI Interface, so I guess that makes it my "sound card" as well as my MIDI interface.
So now, for my specific application, my big concern is that the mixer does not respond when I slide the sliders. It takes a good 4 beats. Silvertones John told me about buffer size, and I have not tried changing that yet. IN the past, however, someone told me that if I changed to ASIO drivers, that latency issue would go away with the driver change, and it did for the 5 minutes the ASIO driver worked. Now also know that the M-Audio site says:
Q: When I launch my recording application, I get an error message indicating The ASIO sample rate is not supported . . . Please check your sync settings in the Control Panel. How do I resolve this?
(That is the error I get as well. How do I change the ASIO sample rate to one that IS supported? This driver comes from THEIR web site for THEIR hardware, and says it is not supported.)
A: There is currently a known issue with the device drivres for M-Audio USB interfaces that affects multi-client operation. This error can occur when launching an ASIO application and another application, or in some cases the Windows operating system, is trying to access the device. If you are receiving this error message, quit your recording application, then go to the Windows Control Panel and select your computer's built-in sound card as the default playback and recording device. This will allow you to use your M-Audio device with your ASIO application.
When you would like to use your M-Audio device for non-ASIO applications (e.g. iTunes, Internet Audio, Windows Media Player, etc), you can set your M-Audio device as the default playback device from the WIndows Sound Control Panel.
Now, reading that, I have 2 issues.
1 is that when posters here say "control panel", do they mean WINDOWS control panel or the BIAB/RT audio setup "control panel"?
2 is that under no circumstance would I ever use the computer's built in sound card for anything.
I really don't see why we would ever be required to be switching back and forth. We should be able to set it one way or the other and have it function universally.
What am I not understanding here? All I want to do is have the mixer respond to the gradual changes to the piano or guitar track as I slide the slider, not 4 beats later. I can't mix with a 4 beat gap. I HOPE Silvertones suggestion about the buffers will resolve it but it is really difficult to deal with that latent response.
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Quote:
See, John and John, here is where I get lost. Now we add MidiYoke to the equation. Coyote, Leopard, Panther, Armadillo... whatever.... I plug my M-Audio into my USB port and I hit play. I don't use soft synths, I don't add this 3rd party software or run that widget.... when I need supplemental instruments I play them into my computer myself through my MIDI interface, and record them as audio tracks into RB. (Mainly so I don't forget how to actually play since this software is so good it plays better than I can.)
Now here's another aspect. I call my M-Audio my MIDI Interface. What I consider my sound card is that RealTek stuff that is built onto the motherboard. Back in the day I had a Soundblaster AWE Gold 64 that made the Windows beeps and blips and played radio stations and that is what I considered to be a "sound card". Anything I can plug MIDI cables into I call a MIDI interface, and I am getting lost in some of these conversations because of terminology. Yes, sound comes through that M-Audio MIDI Interface, so I guess that makes it my "sound card" as well as my MIDI interface.
So now, for my specific application, my big concern is that the mixer does not respond when I slide the sliders. It takes a good 4 beats. Silvertones John told me about buffer size, and I have not tried changing that yet. IN the past, however, someone told me that if I changed to ASIO drivers, that latency issue would go away with the driver change, and it did for the 5 minutes the ASIO driver worked. Now also know that the M-Audio site says:
Q: When I launch my recording application, I get an error message indicating The ASIO sample rate is not supported . . . Please check your sync settings in the Control Panel. How do I resolve this?
(That is the error I get as well. How do I change the ASIO sample rate to one that IS supported? This driver comes from THEIR web site for THEIR hardware, and says it is not supported.)
A: There is currently a known issue with the device drivres for M-Audio USB interfaces that affects multi-client operation. This error can occur when launching an ASIO application and another application, or in some cases the Windows operating system, is trying to access the device. If you are receiving this error message, quit your recording application, then go to the Windows Control Panel and select your computer's built-in sound card as the default playback and recording device. This will allow you to use your M-Audio device with your ASIO application.
When you would like to use your M-Audio device for non-ASIO applications (e.g. iTunes, Internet Audio, Windows Media Player, etc), you can set your M-Audio device as the default playback device from the WIndows Sound Control Panel.
Now, reading that, I have 2 issues.
1 is that when posters here say "control panel", do they mean WINDOWS control panel or the BIAB/RT audio setup "control panel"?
2 is that under no circumstance would I ever use the computer's built in sound card for anything.
I really don't see why we would ever be required to be switching back and forth. We should be able to set it one way or the other and have it function universally.
What am I not understanding here? All I want to do is have the mixer respond to the gradual changes to the piano or guitar track as I slide the slider, not 4 beats later. I can't mix with a 4 beat gap. I HOPE Silvertones suggestion about the buffers will resolve it but it is really difficult to deal with that latent response.
The midiyoke thing is a trick. A lot of people only have VSTi/DXi synths. In the output drivers all that is listed then is either:
1. MidiMapper
2. MS wav table synth
3. none
You are forced to choose one of these even if it's not really being used. This is what seems to mess up the ASIO. By installing a virtual midi driver like midiyoke it gives you a fourth choice. By choosing this fourth option it seems to let ASIO work better.
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Note that even M-Audio is saying it is a Windows issue. Not RB or BiaB, but windows causing this. We all have to do whatever workaround is necessary to get past the windows issues as the come along. Again, it happens with ASIO, not MME. You can see that ASIO has faster response but comes at a cost. Most computers were not designed for what we are doing with them. Recording uses a LOT of read/write actions compared to most other apps and strains the system more. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do to make things work.
I doubt windows developers even look at whether new changes will affect recording apps. We have to adapt to keep up. If support says just installing MIDIYoke or Loopbe fixes the issue, try it, instead of worrying about why windows does that. Then keep tracking.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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+1 to that Bob!
The trouble is that guys like us that have used BIAB, RB PT, Sonar etc for years and years know all these tricks and work a rounds. I started with DAWs from the ground up. Some one just coming into the game can get frustrated. I'm a little out of the loop at this point but I doubt you'd see major studios and pros using any Windows products for the reasons you mentioned. I bet it's still Mac & Pro Tools.
When the whole world was using VHS the pros were using Beta Max.The reason there are so many Windows DAW programs for Windows isn't cause Windows is better it's because they can sell more programs . More Windows users.
Another example.I used to use Windows on my Internet computer. I shifted permanently to Linux a couple of years back.Being a computer geek I really miss Windows on that machine. I had lots to do fixing & fussing. Running scans etc.,etc. Now with Linux it just works. ALWAYS
Just to be fair. My Win 7x64 machine works quite nicely with all of my DAW programs. Better then XP.
Last edited by silvertones; 08/21/11 01:08 PM.
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RealBand
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Joined: Dec 2002
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OP
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Quote:
Hi,
What exactly do these error messages say?
If it's something like "Your MIDI Output Driver is installed correctly but is in use by another program", and then something about your Audio and MIDI Output being silent, it's because of a conflict between ASIO4ALL and the Microsoft GS Wavetable. Selecting MIDI Mapper is basically the same as selecting the Wavetable, so that'll do it too, and so would not selecting anything at all.
The easiest solution is to go to http://nerds.de/en/download.html and download the Loopbe1 driver. In Band-in-a-Box (or RealBand, or PowerTracks), select Loopbe as your MIDI Output Driver, and restart the program. That usually does the trick.
If that wasn't it, please let us know the exact words of these error messages, and I'm sure we'll figure it out.
PG Music
thanks Kent, i’ll give that a try. not near computer now so cant tell you the exact message.
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