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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2013
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Hi everyone
I have made a few attempts at learning at least some of the many details of BIAB. As you can appreciate, it's pretty daunting. My latest attempt has been watching the 20-video series by Groove 3. Things are getting clearer.
However, the more I learn about BIAB, the more I think about ignoring it and working solely in RealBand (which I’ve only played with a few times.) I’d like folks’ advice on this.
Here is some background:
Once BIAB 2015 arrives, I will be on my third version of BIAB starting from 2013. My experience with the software has been thus... I open something up, hunt for ideas, get blown away by some of the things I audition... but then when the works starts, of turning these ideas into properly arranged finished pieces or stems within BIAB with high degree of control, I start getting lost, or badly cramped, within the BIAB visual framework.
I am used to seeing parts as horizontal tracks, with changes visually marked somehow; whereas in BIAB, if I have several tracks with various changes going on e.g. tempo changes, style changes, patch changes etc. I find it becomes too much work to have to remember where and when these occur; I have to right click each bar to get all this information, bar by bar, instead of having a single view "song map".
This is one of the reasons I have so many works in progress in BIAB (maybe 20) but only 1-2 finished projects. (Another reason is that I tend to wander off exploring the trillions of options available, but that is my fault.)
So, because my job limits my free time a lot, I figure, if I am going to save time and brain juice by properly studying (i.e. including going through the manual, gasp) just one of the two, it should be RealBand. The DAW track layout is so much more intuitive.
I have read posts here in which people say they often do their "finishing " in Real Band, or semi-finishing, with finishing in another DAW.
I very much like the idea of working just in RealBand, as opposed to some in BIAB, some in RealBand. It simplifies things by dealing with just one program, which, from what I understand, does most of what BIAB does.
But -- and here is my main question: what are the main things which you can only do in BIAB? What would I miss by using only RB?
By the way, some more background about how I use BIAB, as this might affect your answers..
I rarely aim or want to create something start to finish using PG's tools. Rather, I will start with a bare-bones midi or audio track created elsewhere, get the chords, tempo etc info into BIAB, and audition accompaniments, often part by individual part. I'm not looking necessarily to have a full New Orleans RealStyle accompany my bare bones track, but I might be interested in, say, its bass or piano RealTrack.
I also don't care much about BIAB Melodist of Harmony functions.
I do want to be able to use Solos (RealTrack, MIDI etc) from available styles though.
Anyway, I'd be grateful for any thoughts.
Last edited by lingyai; 12/08/14 03:00 AM. Reason: Clarifying
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Since you've got the basics down, I would suggest to keep using BIAB to get started with your songs. I find you can layout your chord progression and audition styles much more quickly in BIAB. Then once you have the basic framework of the song, move it over to RealBand. There you'll have greater control over every aspect of the song.
One thing BIAB does (and this is just for RealTracks, since MIDI generation is instantaneous) is to start playing back the song much quicker than RealBand, because it continues generating the song in the background while the song is playing. RealBand needs to completely generate the RealTracks before starting to play. That's why auditioning styles is quicker in BIAB.
Do the simple stuff in BIAB, then the heavy audio editing in RealBand.
My $0.02 worth.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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JFord
Thanks for the interesting comments re: BIAB and RB.
Cheers
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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My "New Year's resolution" January 2014 was to learn to use RealBand. That's still a work in progress. That said there's a few things I've noticed.
As others have stated it is quicker to build a basic song in BiaB then RealBand. BiaB does much of it's work as background tasks so you can plug in a few bars worth of chords and try them out. RealBand builds tracks from scratch each time before it starts playback. Your wasting a lot of time between track rebuilds.
If you're making a lot of project changes BiaB seems to be more resistant to file corruption than RealBand.
RealBand seems to be more resource hungry (cpu cycles and ram memory dependent) than BiaB. The more powerful your cpu and the more ram available for use, the faster RealBand operates.
When you are auditioning styles BiaB's eight track limitation means it's real good at replacing instruments as needed. RealBand doesn't replace RealTracks. New RealTracks are added but unwanted RealTracks must be manually removed.
My opinion is BiaB excels at choosing initial style, tempo and key signature, chord entry, part markers and bars required; in other words, basic song structure. RealBand is best for track specific tasks such as editing midi, selecting midi instruments, choosing RealTracks, changing the chordsheet to modify a RealTrack's althorithm choices, using effects and mixing.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Feb 2008
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I stopped using BIAB and only use RealBand. I like it much better now that I'm so used to working in it. It works for me....give it a try.
- Rick
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Expert
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Never use BB anymore, no use for it at all.
Unless you are using BIAB for what it was designed for Auto Accompaniment:
In RB you can SEE what you are doing.
You can SEE what instrument comes in/finishes at a glance.
You can SEE if the track is Stereo or Mono.
(that's why no one knew Stereo UserTracks were generating in Mono because they use BB)
You can mix MultiTrack Drums.
You can generate re-renerate a section on any bar,s on any of the 48 tracks.
MultiRiffs any track/section.
You can mute/fade-in-out sections of track with Volume Nodes.
How could you not need all that ?
That's why I recommend to people DON'T get settled in to BB, you will become an invalid. Take the brave step as others here have and Learn RB now before it's too late.
That's why we have moved from DOS, typing in things, to Windows where you can SEE.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Soildrock I have to disagree about your view of what BIAB is "only" good/designed for (auto accompanist) - but different strokes makes the world go round (mixing metaphors). No place else can I generate a SONG or flesh out whole idea, start to finish, faster including my over dubs. In my view, the bulk of what you mentioned RB does over BIAB is what I would do AFTER I have laid down a song or tune/idea. It's what I would view (no pun), mainly, as "post" work: MIXING/polishing/correcting phase, for me the creative juices just get drained in RB (and PT and Sonar and Reaper and..) when all I want to do is lay down a tune end-to-end, albeit unpolished. Again just me (old fart, stuck in old ways - like I still think kids ought to learn to use slide rule  , or at least pencil and paper, first before calculators. FORCES the skulls full of mush young un's to at least have an idea of the concept of "order of magnitude" for the RIGHT answer (yes, Virginia there is only ONE right answer) instead of whatever gibberish their random key punching yields on the LCD "thing-a-ma-bob" display  ) Lingyai, John mentioned why he thought you might consider effort spent in BIAB first while Solidrock gives very good reasons to start RB first (and maybe only) - each have compelling reasons for their point of view. Both are long time users and always give good advice. Good Luck no matter where you go or how you use BAIB/RB Larry EDIT: PS I'm clearly now posting just simply to increase my post count - someone has to take up the slack now that Mac doesn't post 
Last edited by Larry Kehl; 12/08/14 01:12 PM.
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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No, that's fine if it's easier to make it up in BB sure. Also double click on a chord in BB then RB and see how long it takes to play. 
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I'd like to thank everyone for the different perspectives.
Soidrock, I must admit there's a ring of full-throated manifesto in your first post that I like.
As I mentioned, my main intended use is not to create things start to finish, but rather, to import something from outside the PG universe, like a midi track which already has a formed, set structure and known key, chords and tempo, and then audition single-part accompaniment candidates, and then pick one or more best candidates for mixing in.
So in Realband, at any given time I will be able to see all my candidates (some of which might be muted) and then arrange the winners visually, using clip length trimming, volume automation and what-not. Losers eventually get deleted.
For this kind of workflow, then, I think RealBand will be best for me.
By the way -- the last RealBand manual I saw was for the 2013 version, with a separate "What's new in 2014" pdf. Does anyone know if they ever got woven together, or even if by chance there is a 2015 version available?
Thanks again to everyone. Though please keep posting on this topic if you wish -- I learn a lot from listening to y'all.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Edit: when I posted below I saw your post (a minute before).
For you, in that situation and with those desired workflows, it does sound like RB would be a good choice for you.
original post:
Speed/Value depend on the workflow.
There is no doubt BiaB generates and lets you try many many ideas faster. So sometimes I use it for just that purpose. But as soon as I have the basics down, I'll move to RB so I can add/subtract what I want in more detail. For me it doesn't take long to hit the point with BiaB where it becomes more efficient (for me) to move to RB.
I think it's because I have the 'linear' mindset of a song, as you described in your original post.
I wouldn't 'avoid' BiaB, but rather learn what RB does and let your workflow decide how you proceed. If RB is more comfortable it'll be evident right away to you. It was for me, but I come from an old school 'track' oriented mindset. The more tracks I have to work with the better!
If I know what I want a song to do before I start, I go ahead and start in RB .. but if I'm tinkering for ideas or styles I start in BiaB.
From your (admitted) tendency to tinker, you may need to learn when to change to suit your workflow/needs. But there's no reason to abandon one for the other.
Last edited by rharv; 12/08/14 02:32 PM.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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By the way -- the last RealBand manual I saw was for the 2013 version, with a separate "What's new in 2014" pdf. Does anyone know if they ever got woven together, or even if by chance there is a 2015 version available?
Have a look at this RealBand_User's_Guide.pdf have not been through it, might just have the 2015 New Features pasted in the top ?
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Daunting as it may be BB should be used for the bulk of use of laying down and live play and use RB for the audio adjustments etc.
Jazzman
BIAB - RealBand - 2022
Windows 10 64
Zoo computer with 7i processor- SSD 1TB -2TB HDD
Roland keyboards
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I've posted this before...
This is how I work.
I write and compose in BB since the software lends itself to the composing process really well. Once I have the song constructed like I want, with everything where it needs to be, I close BB after saving the file.
I open the BB file with Real Band. I use RB to create new tracks and the other tracks that don't generate naturally in the BB style with it's 5 track limit.
Once I have these tracks rendered in RB, I export them to a folder and load them into Sonar X1.
I prefer to work on the mixing and editing in Sonar where I can see things in the track view format, and where I know how to easily cut and paste, as well as drop in FX and envelopes. I set up bussing there as well. I do my final polishing in Sonar using the tools in my DAW.
I export that "finished" mix to the song's folder and open it in a third party wave/MP3 editor/converter. I do final levels and trim the start and endings to loose silence and count in clicks.
So, to me, each program has a specific job that it does well. I use them for their strong points.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Like Solidrock, I work exclusively in RB and never boot BiaB at all.
Maybe it's because I came to BiaB after years of being a Powertracks user, so I already understood the basics of RB. As I see it, RB will do everything that BiaB does, but with the addition of all the editing and mixing power of Powertracks. Just having access to the amazing mixer window is enough to ensure I don't move out of RB, but being able to start a project and carry it right through to mastering in the same program is wonderful.
At the end of the day, it's a personal thing - you use what feels right.
ROG.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Like ROG, I learned Power Tracks, and then when RealBand came out, I switched. I did use BIAB when I first started, but once I switched to Power Tracks, I had no reason to go back. So I guess that's why I like RealBand so much.
- Rick
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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As I mentioned, my main intended use is not to create things start to finish, but rather, to import something from outside the PG universe, like a midi track which already has a formed, set structure and known key, chords and tempo, and then audition single-part accompaniment candidates, and then pick one or more best candidates for mixing in. This is EXACTLY why I've told people for years to learn RB. Taking an already produced midi track and adding stuff to it or edit the midi file itself is way easier in RB. One thing said earlier that I disagree with is I NEVER open a Biab file in RB unless it's all midi, it takes forever to generate. No, what you do is render the Biab tracks to audio first then D&D them into RB. Much quicker. If you discover a need to recreate a Biab part you can do that easily in RB. Also say your original tracks are a set number of bars like 65. You decide you need another 12 bar bridge or whatever. Go to the Bars Window in RB and simply copy/paste the extra bars wherever you want them no need to regenerate anything. You're simply manipulating an audio track like you can in any other DAW. Once you have a Biab audio track inside RB you can do anything you want with it. Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
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You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
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-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
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- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
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- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
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- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
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- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
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New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
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New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
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XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
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