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I just saw this. It doesn't mention music but it's a pretty good insight into what people do to get noticed and get paid. The biggest thing for most here who ask about this is you have to have over 1000 subscribers and over 4000 hours of watch time. I do a lot of YT surfing and pretty much everyone asks to please subscribe and to link all my friends. Now I know why. This is an example of why social media is so critical if someone is really trying to market themselves online. People hate Facebook, fine but it's vital for that. People hate Twitter, it's vital too. People disparage people who seem to live on their phones, it's vital you do that too. People above ahem <a certain age> will say none of their friends do any of that so what else can they do? Well... dunno. http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2018/04/04/how-youtube-influencers-make-money-and-lots-it-on-platform.htmlBob
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eddie1261
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eddie1261
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I do visit youtube, but I do not subscribe, link, like or share as they beg you to do. And here's why.
For for example, there is a guy who has a channel about RV life. All he does is make videos for youtube, run a Patreon account, and beg people to buy Amazon products through his link, as he makes money from those sales.
Just his youtube income is $72,000 a year. Then his Patron and Amazon goes on top of that. In my mind, that is little more than standing at the end of an off ramp with a sign and a cup, and I will not participate. Someone please explain to me how this isn't another form of welfare.
Because he posts videos? That is nothing more than playing with a video camera and a computer all day. That is certainly not worth $72,000 a year, is it?
Quick tip. If you don't want to participate, cut off the view of the video before it ends. If you don't watch all the way through, they don't get credit for a view. Also install Ad Block for Youtube. That stops the ads, and if the ads don't run, they make no money.
If you want money from me, come and mow my lawn.....
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That is nothing more than playing with a video camera and a computer all day. That is certainly not worth $72,000 a year, is it? Oh Eddie, you're so OLD... You're joking right? How much do you think video game developers make? Anything of material value in this world is worth EXACTLY what someone will pay for it. There's a guy I happened on last year who's sailing his yacht around the Caribbean with his cute girlfriend. I didn't pay attention to the exact numbers but I remember he has five digits worth of subscribers. I'll bet he's paying for all that sailing from this. And no, it's totally legit. He's not posting porno's or anything, she keeps her top on it's just the two of them sailing around with a drone showing all the cool places they're visiting. One great use for the drone was to help him navigate shallow water with hidden coral heads. That drone looks straight down from about 20-30 feet up and you can see everything. If YT subscribers are helping him pay for his boat and maintenance, I think that's great. And I'm insanely jealous... Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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"Just his youtube income is $72,000 a year. Then his Patron and Amazon goes on top of that. In my mind, that is little more than standing at the end of an off ramp with a sign and a cup, and I will not participate. Someone please explain to me how this isn't another form of welfare."
It isn't another form of welfare no more than someone spending hours, days, weeks or months writing, recording, mixing, printing and selling a CD album. But it is entertainment. The fact that one may do just that and write and record a CD but not capture the ears to earn $72,000 does not take away that they worked for the money they did earn.
It takes imagination, time, skill, labor and money to be able to consistently keep viewers attention and draw new viewers. It takes a certain amount of talent. People can learn the techniques and never attract more than a 100 views, others may draw a million in a week. It may take this guy 40 hours a week to put a video together when all that goes into it is considered. A sign and a tin cup is not a product. The guys YouTube videos are delivering just as much a product as "The Voice" or "Roseanne" on TV. Just as much a product as what a musician delivers when they play in a band.
Last edited by Charlie Fogle; 04/04/18 12:27 PM.
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I think it is really unfair to say that people who make a living from their YouTube videos don't deserve it. They aren't just "playing with video cameras and posting videos all day" - it is strategic, and not to mention there is a huge risk factor involved. It isn't like this is an easy way to make money. Otherwise, we'd all be doing it.
At the end of the day, aren't we all just "playing with computers and instruments"? I don't think anybody here would argue that anybody in these forums doesn't deserve financial success. There is much more than meets the eye. These people making a living on YouTube have spent hours learning how to use video equipment, and some have spent thousands of dollars on the video equipment. Them making a living off this is totally valid in my eyes. I imagine it like they are making their own TV show almost. I would sooner pay for an independent artist to make a living with their craft than pay for cable, personally.
You could argue this logic in almost any field. Athletes are "just throwing a ball around all day." DJ's are "just playing records all day." Chefs are "just playing with pots and pans all day."
These are hard working people who have put lots of work into their craft. If somebody has put hundreds hours into their craft of making YouTube videos and that is their livelihood, I am in no position to criticize them.
Say you spent 12 years of your life learning the in and outs of computers and music software. If ever there was an opportunity to make this your full time job would you take it?
Or would you mow your neighbor's lawn for 10 bucks.
Last edited by Deryk - PG Music; 04/05/18 05:02 AM.
Cheers,
Deryk
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The life of a Youtuber isn't as gloriously easy as it seems.
Considering how many hours of their time they have to put in to writing their scripts or what they want to say, doing set arrangements, getting their lighting done, and editing their videos and content -- not to mention the minute they are done making a video they are on the next one -- Youtubers easily put in a full work day. They have to constantly pump out new, high quality content in order to stay relevant. You're looking at crazy long work days for professional Youtubers. If you don't make videos, you don't get paid.
Uploading the video is the easy part. They work hard to portray a certain image to their audience and provide entertainment. They craft an illusion and a persona that they have to maintain. And let's be clear -- not everyone gets paid for posting Youtube videos. This isn't about the average Joe who randomly decided to start a youtube channel. You already have to have a large following in order for Youtube to even offer to start paying you for your videos. You don't get a following by just uploading your videos without thought or reason. You get a following by marketing yourself and knowing the demographic you want to go after. Anyone who is really serious about making a career out of vlogging needs to be smart about their choices. It's still a business, and they definitely deserve every cent.
They are working in the entertainment business. It is definitely not welfare.
Last edited by Ember - PG Music; 04/05/18 05:34 AM.
Cheers,
Ember
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That is nothing more than playing with a video camera and a computer all day. That is certainly not worth $72,000 a year, is it? Lots of folks would say people playing their guitars and singing isn't worth being paid either. Quick tip. If you don't want to participate, cut off the view of the video before it ends. If you don't watch all the way through, they don't get credit for a view. Also install Ad Block for Youtube. That stops the ads, and if the ads don't run, they make no money. Those are just dick moves. You want to enjoy their content but want to take steps to make sure they don't get paid? Sounds kinda like if I were to make copies of your CD and give 'em away!
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eddie1261
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eddie1261
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Well, J3, here's my perspective, though I know you will not agree. You have never agreed with me about anything and I don't much expect that to change.
Let's say that someone here who plays guitar, whichever guy you want to pic (or gal), gets Gibson's new model guitar that sells for $10,000. Gibson sends that guitar to that person free, with a letter that is carefully worded to say something like "We here at Gibson are happy to provide you with this guitar for no charge. We hope you enjoy the sound and the way it plays, and hope that you will share your opinion in a video review with your 25,000 youtube viewers."
That is payola. And all the big time youtubers do this. In my case, as I view RV channels as research, I see it for RV communication equipment the most. Wifi repeaters, cell phone boosters, load balancing routers, all that kind of stuff. Knowing that they have already been paid with products, I do not feel not compelled to pay them again, particularly when, having been employed by a newspaper briefly and received items to review (and I returned every one of them), I find payola to be unethical and disgusting at the utmost level. If this guitar player example wants to keep that new guitar, the proper, ethical thing to do would be to send Gibson $10,000.
THOSE are the channels I am referring to. I don't give a half a toss about someone posting their little vacation videos and making $40 a month from their viewers. The guy I mentioned in my initial reply that makes $72,000 is one of those who accept payola and has absolutely no conscience at all about doing it. If he really wants the widget he was given at no charge as payola in exchange for a positive review (no matter how bad the widget might be) he should pay for it.
I have a youtube channel. It is private. It is mainly for me to rant and vent about how sad the world has become. It will never get anywhere near the minimum user count (is it still 1000?) to be monetized. And I don't care. I don't need charity. No free GoPro cams, no free solar equipment, no free anything. If I want a new GoPro camera, I will buy it. These e-beggars get away with this because they are willing to sell their dignity for free stuff. If they can sleep at night, god bless them. I want nothing free from anybody. This entitled generation who believe the world owes them a living while they do nothing to earn it makes me happy I am old and near the end of the ride.
I'm out of this discussion now.
Last edited by eddie1261; 04/05/18 09:34 AM.
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Eddie, you seem confused about trade. When I deliver something of value to you and you respond by delivering something of value to me a transaction has occurred and we both benefited (hopefully). In the example you gave, the youtuber has something of value, his/her audience and they have worked hard to build that value. Gibson has something of value, a shiny new guitar that retails for $10,000 (and prolly costs them less than $500 to make). Youtuber and Gibson reach an agreement whereby said shiny new guitar goes to the Youtuber in exchange for a positive review/promo to the audience.
Did you really think Shaq uses Goldbond? Or that all those country legends gave two craps about whether their biscuits were made with Martha White flour?
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eddie1261
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eddie1261
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Gibson has something of value, a shiny new guitar that retails for $10,000 (and prolly costs them less than $500 to make). Youtuber and Gibson reach an agreement whereby said shiny new guitar goes to the Youtuber in exchange for a positive review/promo to the audience. What of the guitar stinks and the review is all bullsquirt? That's where the ethics comes into play. The arm twisting that goes into the payola is what I am addressing. If you are good with payola, that's your call. I find it extremely unethical. Those network TV ads you refer to are apples and oranges. You are talking about Joe Average taking a guitar to give a positive review that can NEVER be accepted as any kind of honest as long as there is any doubt that the review may have been positive because that expensive guitar, to Joe Average, is like a 7 figure contract is to a national personality. I ran into this SO often working for that paper and actually watched 3 people walked to the door for it. One took a free weekend at a B&B and wrote a GLOWING review of the place. And it may have been the best B&B she had ever ever seen, but as long as there is the slightest shadow of a doubt that the review was given in exchange for the visit, it will always be suspect. (I went to see it, and it was a manure pile.) If you want to stay with Shaq, he signs a contract to get a lot of money and goes on TV and plugs the stuff. There is no question that he was paid for his endorsement. However, youtubers who don't have 20 bucks in their pocket and will salivate like Pavlov's dog when someone dangles a shiny new toy in front of them are NOT Shaq signing a contract. The youtubers, IF they state in their comments that the item was provided free to them, are covered legally. If they do not state whether they got the item free, I will suspect that the review was bought and paid for 100% of the time. Have you not seen the fine print on TV ads that say "compensated spokesperson"? You can do whatever you want. send youtubers GoPro cameras if you like so they will mention you on youtube. Donate money to Patreon channels. Keep supporting able bodied people who have no intention of ever working for a living. (I don't know you, and for all I know you may even be in that group.) I will not contribute to people who do unethical things, and payola in any form is unethical. Wife #3 was the local food reviewer. Restaurants all over town tried to pick up our dinner checks. In all the years together, she declined every time. I also saw her shut down at least 5 restaurants because of her honest negative reviews, and because of that, they all feared her so they tried to buy her off. That is one of the very few things I give her credit for was her integrity. "Trade" is not payola. And what Shaq does is not what the youtubers do.
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To be fair, Youtubers who do not have 20$ in their pocket aren't the ones getting the free stuff from big companies. That's because you need to be successful in the first place to attract that kind of attention in order to strike that kind of a deal.
Cheers,
Ember
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