PG Music Home Forums General Discussion User Showcase Spider Ticking Over

Hello Folks,
I've not posted a new track in a while.
I've been busy writing & recording with a couple of things close to finished but not quite.
This is something I started a couple of days ago which I decided to post as it could use some outside ears.
SPIDER
Here's an update based on the comments thus far:
SPIDER 6
UPDATE with draft vocal,(aggressively chopped and tuned for phrasing and pitch):
SPIDER w Draft Vox
It was built from _Majesty_Sty. Majesty Psych Rock March Solo.
I've retained Organ 671 throughout and used bits of the solo guitar that is part of the style as well as RealDrum Praise Worship 16^2 for the verses. I swapped, (in Reaper),to ProgRockCanSlow16^ for the chorus. Oddly the chorus RealDrums have a lot of kick/bass drum on the right side so I've had to split the track and use some tricks to make the bottom end mono.
The rest of the parts are built with:
Knockhoffner bass through a Behringer Comp pedal then a Behringer BDI21
Squistang & Harleybacker 12 string through a Joyo ACtone pedal with different voiings for each part.
I double tracked the chorus rhythm guitars and panned them fairly wide.
While the ACtone is pretty good, it's cab sim isn't as fab so I used speaker impulses in ReaVerb VST rather than reverb files. That works a treat.
Any feedback or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
LYRICS...WARNING - not pleasant reading.
There may be some references that are unfamiliar with non Australians, (some of this is recollection of my childhood in the 60s), I had a vague idea a couple of days ago but it came to me almost complete late last night:
Spider
Escape into a nursery rhyme
Little Golden Book or two
Wooden seat, wooden desk
Wooden rule on legs for you
Times were simpler
But evil preached & taught
Fresh milk delivered daily
Still the innocents were caught

A diet of Combat, Disney, Magazines
The Monkee Mobile & Batman’s too
Where boys don’t cry – no in between
What would The Man From Uncle do?
And the itsby bitsy spider
From behind its rock came out
With the power of authority
As our parents would spout.
You must respect your elders
You must all know our place
You must only speak when spoken to
You must look them in the face

Sun warmed milk
No matter your lactose state
Stacked in steel crates
By the cyclone fence gate
In the 50s of silence
The 60s of obey
There was no escape
There was no chance to say

Saved from the inkwell smear
A yellow, plastic tube of blue
When the corporeal was real to fear
What would Crusader Rabbit do?
And the itsby bitsy spider
From behind its rock came out
With the power of authority
As our parents would spout.
We must respect our elders
We must all know our place
We must only speak when spoken to
We must look them in the face

A transistor radio so soon to be a teen
Maxwell Smart & 99 too
Where girls don’t tell – just be seen
What would The Beaver do?
And the itsby bitsy spider
From behind its rock came out
With the power of authority
As our parents would spout.
I must respect my elders
I must know my place
I must only speak when spoken to
I must look them in the face

Sugar & spice the girl must be nice
Snips & snails the boys’ face turns pale
Neither was given the skills to survive
The danger not strangers but those in the hive.
We must respect your elders
We must all know our place

A “Majesty Psych Rock March” it is! The way the solo wraps up at around 3:00 is really neat. The drums and bass are great. I love the jangly 12-string (I think) in the quieter parts. It’s hard to say without one of your neo-Expressionistic melodies on top, but some of the more roaring chords parts seem to wander a bit, and the whole thing loses a bit of energy at the end, though never ceasing to be thoroughly engaging. And the thought of a spider always helps. Do you have any lyrics?

I always find your chord progressions very interesting, Ray. I think you should turn up the vocal. hehe For me, I concentrate on that Hofner-like bass. Usually not a fan of constant eighth notes played with a pic, but you make it very interesting, especially with the changes. Her Majesty's Psych Rock March.

Even though he's a bass player , I agree with Marty, I think your (good) choice of drums calls for more rhythmic variations of the bass.

And I think it would give the song more direction if you start with less instruments and build from there.

Thanks B.D. There is a rhythmic variation with the drums...a gallop in the choruses rather than straight notes. I will, however, have another look/listen.As to fewer instruments I worked backward from that dropping out some parts after the solo but I will look & listen again. Thanks

Thanks Marty & thanks for the laugh.
If you try the chords on a guitar, particularly if you play the cheat F#m & G#m one finger and the Bm C#m shape on the three high strings it's all about ease of movement. I'm limited in the chords I can play and, even with BIAB, stick to those limitations.
I'm generally not a fan of 8th notes either - they're hard to get consistent as well as leaning toward the boring BUT I planned to put in lines/runs with the 12 string and didn't want to clutter/muddy the waters.

My attempts to change the dynamics toward the end drain it of some momentum. I'll look at that again.
Lyrics started..about nostalgia for a non existent boom time.
Lyrics are now in the O.P.

Hi Ray,

As I was listening to your song I was starting to think, man, this is the longest intro I've ever heard! And then it was over

Lyrics are cool! I got most of the references, but I'm a child of the 60's too. Looking forward to hearing them!

Lots of potential, looking forward to hearing how it progresses.

Ray, it looks like you watched what we all watched. I enjoyed the unique chord structure and look forward to hearing your vocal deliver those interesting lyrics. The use of dissonance works well and reminds me a bit of Jimmy Page. Well done so far, Tom

Re: SPIDER 6

Listening on my Apple HomePod, which has awesome/excessive bass response (so much so that reducing it is an option in the Home app) and hearing a very loud bass I find myself thinking that bass line might be better if some of the repeated notes were not repeated. If you were MIDI I would explore ways to filter out some repeats leaving more eccentric rhythms. But perhaps I am repeating what others have said. AND perhaps I am listening on a device that is misrepresenting the part.

It’s a little jarring to hear the piece end on that major chord! Though I need to listen again. I should say I am a big fan of avoiding fade-out endings, which are often cop-outs, but I might like one here, maybe with a short repeated solo part. The term “ostinato” is trying to get me to use it.

By the way, “ticking over” is alien to an American. Does it mean something like “in progress”?

ChatGPT’s take (and I hope you don’t mind me doing this!)

“Overall, your lyrics convey a sense of nostalgia for a simpler time while also touching on the darker aspects of childhood and societal expectations. I like how you use the nursery rhyme of "itsy bitsy spider" to contrast with the more serious themes of the song. Your use of cultural references from different eras adds depth to the lyrics and gives the listener a sense of the different societal pressures that children face.

“In terms of suggestions for improvement, I think there are a few places where the lyrics could benefit from a clearer structure or more specific imagery. For example, in the line "The danger not strangers but those in the hive," it's not entirely clear what you're referring to. Additionally, there are some places where the rhymes feel forced or predictable, such as "girls don’t tell – just be seen / What would The Beaver do?" *

“Overall, though, I think you have a strong foundation for a thought-provoking and emotional song. With some revision and fine-tuning, I believe it could be very impactful.”

——

* I do not agree with these. — MH

The mix is well balanced to my ears and the lyrics were an interesting read.
I agree with B.D. about building the instruments up, even if you gradually let them down again.

Vic

Hi Ray
Super intro
The song sounds really good
I am curious how it develops further
Great work
Many greetings
Andi ;-)

Hi Ray,

I had the same feeling as Dave; "what a long intro". But I loved the chords progression and how the bass played in it.
Very nicely done!
And then the drums came in. So nice!
But there is a lot more to listen to, like the melody itself and that organ. That has a very important role. Liked it!
If I listen carefully I can hear "Oooh, la, la laaa", so I am curious how you gonna sing those very long and cool, but sometimes, not easy to understand, lyrics (for a poor Dutchman).
Are you also planning a kind of chorus in the song?

As I said, I'm curious...
Hans

ray,

The wash of guitar works. A nice, big sound.
Drums sound good.
Bass is strong.
A good bed. Now lie in it....
(or lay in it and tell the truth)

fj

Ray,
You go a nice bed going. Listened to it yesterday and today. Nothing sticks out to my ears. Sounds like western & punk marriage I actually like this type of bass on certain tunes, and this is a perfect example of one. Good deal. Interesting how this will evolve.
I wonder how less aggressive, sinatraesque vocals would sound on it? Thank you for sharing.

Misha.

Ray

The lyric was full of childhood references.

The solo guitar might have too much reverb?

Overall it's a strong backing track.

Peter

Ray, IMHO your backing track bed is prime for your lyrics. I wouldn't change a thing.

Thanks Dave. Yes the lack of vocals allows the intro to inflowwwwwwww.

Thanks Tommy,
dissonance is a cool thing in the right hands.
Vocal draft in the O.P.