I have many Steinberg and Native Instruments VST's. Quite a few of them get used daily. Very few ever showed up in BIAB. Even with VST2 support. Only ...
Dark Planet Symphonic Orchestra Triebwerk
Symphonic Orchestra (VST2) will load but won't change patches or play.
I can not scan or use any VST3 that I have. BIAB just crashes when I scan. I can locate and get, for instance Halion Sonic VST3 in the list but BIAB crashes immediately if I try to use it.
I'd have to say that VST support, of any kind, just hasn't worked here.
Last edited by dathho; 12/08/2411:16 AM. Reason: Correct grammar
BIAB Audiophile 2025, Cubase 14, Ardour, NI MK3. i7, 32GB, 5TB. RME, Focusrite Yamaha, Novation, and Roland
RustySpoon# has asked an excellent question. We need to know what version / build you are running as this makes a big difference to how helpful replies can be provided to suit your version. New features and functions are added every year.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Professional & Windows 11, Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors
Thank you for reporting the issue with VST3 plugins in BIAB. I’d like to gather more details to troubleshoot this effectively:
Are you trying to add a VST3 plugin to an audio track or a MIDI track? Keep in mind that in BIAB: Audio tracks only support FX plugins. MIDI tracks only support instrument plugins. If you’re not seeing your instrument plugins in the VST3 list, it might be because you’re working with an audio track instead of a MIDI track.
Does BIAB crash when scanning a specific plugin, or does it fail to scan any VST3 plugin on your computer? If it’s a specific plugin causing the crash, which one is it?
As a test, could you temporarily remove the problematic plugin(s) from the VST3 folder and try rescanning? This will help us determine if the crash is plugin-specific or a broader issue.
You mentioned that Halion Sonic appears in the list but crashes when loaded. Can you confirm if this happens consistently or only under specific circumstances?
Once we have more details, we’ll work on getting this resolved for you. Thanks for your patience!
>>>Are you trying to add a VST3 plugin to an audio track or a MIDI track? I understand this difference, VST3 instrument to a MIDI track.
>>>Keep in mind that in BIAB >>>Audio tracks only support FX plugins. >>>MIDI tracks only support instrument plugins. All of the other tools I use with VST support separate Instruments and Effects into different lists.
I have basically 3 Instruments I'd like to use in BIAB. NI-Kontact, Steinberg-Halion and The Grand. Halion, Steinbergs flagship Instrument has 3 versions., Halion Sonic SE, Halion Sonic, and Halion Sonic 7. None work for me. Attached is a list of my VST3 directory....
>>>As a test, could you temporarily remove the problematic plugin(s) from the VST3 folder and try rescanning? This will help us >>>determine if the crash is plugin-specific or a broader issue.
Since the BIAB scanner can be directed to the individual .vst3 files or directories this is easy. I had tried this extensively before posting. I can get NI-Kontact8 to work in this manner. Other NI Instruments never show up in the list. The Grand 3, ( a great sampled Piano I'm very used to.) will load into the list but crashes BIAB when chosen. It does flash the plugin GUI for a second first. Some other Steinberg plugins will show up in the list but crash BIAB when chosen. Halion Sonic SE will show up in the list and display the GUI when chosen but crashes before an instrument can be chosen.
Last edited by dathho; 12/09/2404:12 PM.
BIAB Audiophile 2025, Cubase 14, Ardour, NI MK3. i7, 32GB, 5TB. RME, Focusrite Yamaha, Novation, and Roland
I don't have your particular Kontakt pianos, but I've tested Kontakt 6, 7 and 8 with different stock pianos. The Giant, Una Corda, the Grandeur. All seem to work fine.
Halion is giving me headache. I've saved crash log and will forward it to support.
Hey guys, my experience so far, after only little time spent with Biab 2025: I am also having issues with Steinberg VST3s. Halion7, HalionSonic and PadShop are crashing Biab immediately when trying to load them (after scanning without problems). The only Steinberg VSTi that works yet -as far as I have tried- is Retrologue. A bunch of other VST3s are working: AmpleSound, Native Instruments (as far as I have tried them yet), MeldaProduction, ... There seem to be certain plugins that can crash Biab upon scanning, though I have not yet found out which ones, but this leads to a crash when trying to scan the complete VST3 directory. At the moment it seems to be a good idea to scan single plugins or subfolders one by one, adding only the plugins that are really going to be used.
e-licenser doesn't work too(that is what I use) for now. Only Halion6 /Sonic 3 work as VST2 in BIAB. I've reported to devs. Hopefully they will figure it out soon.
I have the same problem already exposed by Dathho and Max.Noise. Halion Sonic SE was my favorite GM player in Biab until 2022. It worked fine and you chose it through the menu "Options/preferences/midi driver...." But in 2023 Steinberg released Halion7 and Halion Sonic 7. (both vst3), removing the SE version (vst2). They no longer worked with Biab, neither did the old Halion Sonic SE. No problem, never mind. Coyote is not bad
Now, in Biab2025 I tried replacing Coyote (vst2) with the latest Halion Sonic (vst3) via the "options/preferences/midi driver menu". But this was not possible because Biab does not include vst3 in the list of GM players. It only allows you to add a vst3 on individual tracks. And sure enough, the program closes when you try to put Halion on a individual midi track. I would love for Halion to work in Biab2025
Element will let you load Halion as your default synth, it will let you chain any midi or fx plugins, once you have your routing set up you just "Save Group" then "Load Group" the Element setup you need or in Element > Settings > "Save Session". You are too limited to what you can do with the Biab routing/chaining/sends. You can load VST3 in the VST2 version.
It is free, but it also is not very stable. I believe PGM is investigating Steinberg issue at this time. I am confident they will fix, as many people who use BIAB use Halion / Sonic.
I'm also optimistic. We have to be patient with the hard work of the experts. Biab is a great tool, regardless of specific problems. Encouragement to PG Music workers
Update: The latest Biab build (1123) is still crashing immeditately when trying to load Halion7 or Halion Sonic. Interestingly Padshop is working now, which was not the case when I tried it before installing the update. I've also tried all other Steinberg VSTis that I have: The Grand => crash, Groove Agent => crash. Backbone gave an access violation at first, but on the 3rd or 4th try it loads fine and works. @Rustyspoon: no e-licenser any more, everthing is on Steinberg Licensing.
It was mentioned that developers are working at this time to address the issue that is causing Steinberg plugins to crash. It's likely a high priority item as Steinberg plugins are popular among BIAB users. I am confident they will issue fix soon.
"@Rustyspoon: no e-licenser any more, everthing is on Steinberg Licensing."
Not entirely true. e-licenser will continue to work until May 2025. Also, it will continue working on your computer, unless it breaks I would imagine it would take quite some time for people to migrate existing licenses. I will do a separate post on that later, after PGM fixes the issue. Post will include some feedback I received from Steinberg rep not too long ago.
Yeah, you're absolutely right, my wording was misunderstandable, I meant 'everything is on Steinberg Licensing ON MY COMPUTER'. I am not a native English speaker I am confident that PG Music will figure out and solve that problem soon.
I get a crash on scanning VST3 so quickly I cannot see which one is crashing it. No errors logged.
Bootup was optimal, set to fast [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Bootup time in milliseconds =1,745 [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Time to scan unknown VST plugins = 2 ms [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Time to scan known VST plugins = 21 ms [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Time to scan AU plugins = 0 ms [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Time to scan ALL plugins = 23 ms [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] Scanning for plugins... [2025.1123.0, 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM] **** New Session started at : 12/15/2024 7:59:22 AM
Hello. I also get the crash closed when I ask it to scan the vst3 folder. However, yesterday I managed to get Biab2025 to recognize practically all the vst3. I will explain how to do it although I warn you that you have to go one by one of the no recognize vst3 . I also note that I have not checked that all vsts work, simply that they are now listed.
I first loaded a style with Realtracks. And in the "Plugins" tab of the mixer I right-clicked on any of the inserts of tracks that contain audio. Then I select "Choose vst3 plugins..." and a list of the FX vst3 that you have already recognized will appear. Go to the "options" button at the bottom left of that list. Click and choose "Look for vst3 plugins" Then the file explorer will open so that we go to the folder where the vst3 are located. Usually on Windows it is: Program files/Common files/VST3. You can now check whether or not all FX vst3 have been recognized by Biab. We must know how to distinguish the FX vst from the Vsti and select an FX vst3 that is not recognized. When you select it, it will appear in the list. I didn't have any crack with this procedure To add the Vsti3 (virtual instruments) is the same, but we will right-click on an insert in a midi track. Most Vsti3s are in the same folder as the Fx Vsts. I hope it helps
Same problems here. bb2025 1123 Scan crashes scanning vst3 in windows vst3 folder. Steinberg Halion crashes sometimes at load. There must be a huge bug in the BIAB plugin routines. All my other software with no problems.
We are currently testing an update to the VST3 handling - crashes with Steinberg (e.g. Halion), Native Instruments, and the other few reported problem plugins seem to have been resolved, and the patch update will be available once testing is complete.
Yes, I have already installed the 1124 update and indeed there is no crash anymore when we insert Steinberg vst3 plugins into an individual track. It is an undoubted improvement. But we still can't replace Coyote with any other GM Vst3 multichannel instrument, like Halion Sonic for example. This should be possible via the menu: "Options/preferences/midi driver/VSTi-DXi synth". But we can't access vst3 plugins in that menu. I can understand that there are technical reasons, so I pose it as a simple wish for future updates
I've tested it with Halion sonic7 and now the problem is that I can't get it to respond to program changes when loading or changing midi styles. I will investigate the matter further. Thanks Moultipass, Noel96 and Rustypoons
Yes, seems Noel solved that (thank you Noel) , but it was definitely not obvious from pop-up in Preferences.
"I've tested it with Halion sonic7 and now the problem is that I can't get it to respond to program changes" Do you have "program changes" enabled in Sonic?
P.S. I was considering Sonic 7 when it came out and was beta testing for another audio software. We were able to populate GM instruments when MIDI composition called them out, but it would not do program changes. I use previous Sonic / Halion 6. Seems to work OK.
At your question : Do you have "program changes" enabled in Sonic? Yes. In Halion Sonic, in the options tab, the "Prog changes" checkbox is set to "GM Mode".
About Sonic / Halion 6 : I think it was Halion Sonic SE 6 (vst2) that worked with Biab until 2022. Nothing has worked since then.
No. As I said earlier, Halion Sonic SE (vst2) stopped working when Halion Sonic7 came out. Now it is not even recognized when biab scans the "Halion Sonic SE.dll" file. But, no problem. Coyote can do the job well. Thank you Rustyspoon for your help. Best regards
Unfortunately, I still get a crash when I try to load a VST. The same crash happens when I attempt a rescan.There are a few listed but nowhere near as many as I have on my system. Is there anyway to tell (in a log or crash report) why this is happening? Any other DAW I have (Reaper, Cubase) does not have this problem. My PC is up to date BIAB 2025 and latest Windows.
Same here with the newest update: Unfortunately, I still get a crash when I try to load and start Halion7 VST3. Any other DAW I have (Reaper, Cubase) does not have this problem. My PC is up to date BIAB 2025 and latest Windows.
Loading is ok, but the first click on Halion7 window and then BIAB vanishes (ends task).
Last edited by Genos Keyboarder; 12/18/2407:54 AM.
I cleared all VST's from the list and restarted BIAB and my PC. Then tried rescanning to load an instrument. This is the result. It sometimes loads more than this before it crashes but not all the VST instruments I have.
There is no specific plugin. Sometimes I manage to get 5 or 6 then if I try to load an instrument from, say, Halion 7 it hangs then crashes. This is with the latest patch from BIAB.
Thank you for your suggestion but no way am I scanning 194 VST plugins individually! As an example, I've just cleared the cache and list of VST's from Reaper and rescanned. Not one error. 194 plugins scanned and listed. It can be done so why not in BIAB? I have also encountered some plugins which do not load properly. In that case the plugin has been disregarded and the scan continues. Is this feature not implemented in BIAB?
I've tested it with Halion sonic7 and now the problem is that I can't get it to respond to program changes when loading or changing midi styles. I will investigate the matter further. Thanks Moultipass, Noel96 and Rustypoons
I tested this as well and found that Halion Sonic 7 does not respond to program changes when loaded into other programs - Reaper for example.
I've been updating and upgrading every year since 2020. I bought Omnipak 2024, so I had (almost) all the contents available at the time.
Every December there is a renewed promise to solve bugs and to have a more streamlined process (seasoned with some "interesting new features"). And in practice I buy. Every year. I spend some money and a lot of limited time trying to define a NEW work flow. I don't need it to be perfect: No software is. But I do my work to use, let's say, a brand new DAW plug-in that looks very promising to put RealTracks in my Reaper project. This is different every year. Every year I am closer and closer. But not yet there.
At the end of the painful process I end up with a NEW mediocre workflow requiring even more complexity and less time to make music, less time to properly use a small % of the GOOD contents delivered through years.
So I will buy BiaB-2025 (and Real Band, and DAW plug-in, and there is even a Standalone plug-in!) when it looks as if it will SAVE my time using the contents. Maybe using 3rd party scripts, or a combination of PGMusic tools. That's not ideal, but is OK.
So I will not buy BiaB 2025 software during the promotion days. There is little incentive for me to be an early adopter of the software. Exactly 10$ (~12€ with VAT and exchange rate + fees). And a LOT of time and frustration being a beta tester.
And the contents? This year I will limit myself to use "only" 95% of all BiaB contents ever delivered. The 95% I already have.No need to hoard the brand new 5%.
When / If the program some day (in 2025 or 2030) is stable and efficient, I'll happily buy the missing content.
Today someone was so kind to remind me about "resolved" bugs. This rang a bell. And ultimately triggered a rational decision, right or wrong.
It's true that the first weeks of December are usually very tiring, intellectually and nervously, since I'm always determined to explore Biab's new features in depth, and you feel like you're just another beta tester. For example, I went back to the Plugin that works well for me, 6.3.8. But every day, with a new idea, I reinstall 7.04 to give it a chance. And finally I go back to 6.3.8. It's a sound sync problem with 7.0.4.
For VST3, it works pretty well, except with Halion which crashes again and again.
No "50 new features" this year, I think the message got through: let's improve what already exists before adding complexity. So I'm pretty happy with version 2025. The program is so vast that I rediscover new audio wonders every time. But I absolutely understand your position, there is no rush to finally save a few euros. You will save yourself a lot of mental fatigue.
parapente, Please don't see my post as I am defending PGM. I try to stay neutral. I agree that more needs to be done to address a loud chorus of requests that fall under 3 main topics: Previous bugs fixed, Complete existing features, UI / Workflow. In my opinion, 2025 fell short on most of these requests.
Having said that, for the most part BIAB is a stable program, especially considering how many different "moving parts" it has. The $59 it costs to just update the core programs during this promotion is not a lot of money by any means. It has enough new features to justify this very reasonable price tag. If you want to wait until most known issues with release are addressed, you can purchase the software while on sale and wait a few weeks until PGM irons out known issues. Some people do that.
Please don't view this particular thread as a deal breaker. VST3 for the most part is very stable. There are a few things PGM has to address that are described in these posts, but most likely they will not affect you.
Three items that I feel where "unresolved" in this threads are: 1) Initial scanning for VST3 plugins crash BIAB for some people - I believe some safeguards are needed. For example continue the scan despite errors and upon finish produce a list of those plugins that failed scanning, so a user or PGM can investigate. ( I think most crashes happening because people try to scan their whole computer for DLL files, instead of specific folders). 2) Halion 7 crashing. 3)Halion7/Sonic7 doesn't do Program Changes.
Since Sonic/Halion is considered to be kind of a gold standard VST for General Midi / program change playback, and many people use that plugin with BIAB it is very important that PGM finds a solution.
Do not take me wrong, I agree 100% with you MoultiPass and Rustyspoon# in every line.
@ Moultipass: Exactly, I had the stress to read in the forum to what extent the new plug-in is offering advantages over my previous workflow, before Dec-31st. My recollection is "good ideas, but for an urgent task, better to use 2024 version (6.3.8)". You confirm it. I also agree it is very little money, I already spent near 1000$ in BiaB and adding 49$ with or without December discount is not a problem. Or saving the 49$. Not a big deal, literally.
I appreciate there is no hype with the "50 new features". I did not notice. This is a move in the right direction for me.
@ Rustispoon# I honestly did not know that VST3 was solved for the most part. And I truly appreciate that the issue is now not-resolved. I remember the same situation when debugging some issue in version 2024 (I cannot remember if it happened to me or to anyone else). This premature closing of bugs triggered my decision. But I agree with all your comments. VST3 is not a deal breaker for me (the DAW plug-in is, any way to put the features of BiaB in Reaper is).
Hi, The latest pre v7.04 BBPlugin I can access from my account is v6.1.13 Is v6.3.8 still available? Thanks
Brian Cadoret BIAB 2025 Pro build 1125e with BIAB2023 UltraPAK . Samplitude Pro X4 Suite. Mixcraft 10.5 Pro Studio Focusrite 2i2 Scarlett Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3470 CPU @ 3.20GHz 3.20 GHz Installed RAM 8.00 GB
Hi, There is no update 1114 on PGMusic's site only 1113 ? Thanks
Brian Cadoret BIAB 2025 Pro build 1125e with BIAB2023 UltraPAK . Samplitude Pro X4 Suite. Mixcraft 10.5 Pro Studio Focusrite 2i2 Scarlett Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3470 CPU @ 3.20GHz 3.20 GHz Installed RAM 8.00 GB
I've tested it with Halion sonic7 and now the problem is that I can't get it to respond to program changes when loading or changing midi styles. I will investigate the matter further. Thanks Moultipass, Noel96 and Rustypoons
I tested this as well and found that Halion Sonic 7 does not respond to program changes when loaded into other programs - Reaper for example.
I spent a long time looking into it and found out that only Cubase as a DAW can send the Program Change commands correctly to Halion. This is due to the latest VST3 specification from Steinberg, which has not yet been implemented correctly by other programmers. You have to have the specification, read it and possibly contact Steinberg.
I spent a long time looking into it and found out that only Cubase as a DAW can send the Program Change commands correctly to Halion. This is due to the latest VST3 specification from Steinberg, which has not yet been implemented correctly by other programmers. You have to have the specification, read it and possibly contact Steinberg.
Good to know, I'll pass that on to the developers.
Wow, biab is still buggy after 2 years with no fix. I was considering upgrading to the 2025 but I think I'll stay with the 2023 version. If Pg music is not interested in fixing what does not work, I am certainly not giving them any of my money. Stop giving me new features and concentrate on making everything work smoothly, other apps work really well and any fixes needed get addressed fully and quickly. Oh well, I guess they don't need my money.
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