Fellow “bottom feeders”, as Marty so accurately calls us, been thinking about The Who recently. Any comments on this diagram?
All these years later it might be easy to dismiss this as ho-hum, but at one point bi-amping didn’t exist. I wonder how many bands and audio engineers that came later have benefited from the Ox’s thinking?
I understand Geddy Lee and Victor Wooten were two that were influenced by him
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2026 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
Decades ago... I remember reading an article in Guitar Player Magazine on the guitar and bass rigs used by The Who on stage. Their main PA system was running over 100,000 watts. I don't remember the details on Townsend's guitar rig, just that it was extremely loud. The thing that stood out was Entwistle's bass rig. It was over 9000 watts and bi-amped. If I recall, it was loud enough that they rarely ever needed to run it through the PA, depending of course on the particular venue. Townsend became very concerned about his stage volume in later years, fearing he was going deaf from the stage volume of the early years. Ya Think? But you have to admit that a wall of Marshall amps running wide open with a Les Paul driving them sounds really, really good.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
I hear ya. Back in the day FM Djs on the coolest station on the dial would dribble in bits and pieces about The Who being "the loudest band" touring.
I too have wondered what exactly all that sound did to ear drums, some may have used plugs, but still we're talking some serious dBs. And the stage layouts had them standing directly in front of walls of cabs.
Nonetheless, they were trail blazers for sure.
"Ain't got no distractions, can't hear no buzzes and bells Don't see, no lights a-flashing, plays by sense of smell"
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2026 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
Deep Purple was the loudest band I listened to live back in the day. Some other band had a painfully loud flute, most likely Jethro Tull but I don't remember. Golden Earring had a flute player but all I remember was Radar Love with a bass line Bass Thumper likely remembers.
With today's high-quality passive crossover networks, bi-amping is of less value perhaps than in the past for stereo speakers.
The active crossover network in the drawing is perhaps a better way to do things for a really loud bass. The Sun cabinets would sound better if the low-frequency had 15-inch speakers. I assume 12s in the drawing.
With the known hearing loss, the days of an amp cranked up on 11 are pretty much over. Perhaps out in the country on a private ranch with about 10,000 acres...lol
It is a problem because nothing sounds like an amp cranked up on 11 and a guitar will never play the same as it does with the volume turned up. The cops used to come by with db meters and issue tickets for playing above a certain db level in Houston.
Billy
Last edited by Planobilly; 12/12/2405:29 PM.
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig? “Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
Deep Purple was the loudest band I listened to live back in the day. Some other band had a painfully loud flute, most likely Jethro Tull but I don't remember. Golden Earring had a flute player but all I remember was Radar Love with a bass line Bass Thumper likely remembers. The active crossover network in the drawing is perhaps a better way to do things for a really loud bass. The Sun cabinets would sound better if the low-frequency had 15-inch speakers. I assume 12s in the drawing.
Smoke on the Water was a smash with me and my "crew", I can understand how Deep Purple could blow the roof off. And I haven't listened to Radar Love in years, another great one.
I don't know the speaker size in the diagram, I just scraped something that looked reasonable.
At the risk of letting my imagination go too untethered, here is how I like to envision the interaction.
The Ox stood in the dimly lit pub with his favorite guitar tech and a few industry executives, his leather jacket creaking as he crossed his arms. He finished up his pint and slammed his tankard on the pub table. "Look, mates," he began, his British accent cutting through the smoke-filled room, "I've been lugging around your amps for years, and they're just not cutting it anymore. Every gig, it's the same story—distortion where there shouldn't be and my high end is practically non-existent. I need gear that can handle the raw power of rock and roll, something that won't crumble under the weight of a proper bass line. We’re talking about pushing some serious air. I need something that can keep up with Pete and I’ve been thinking about an approach I call Bi-Amping. If you can't deliver what I need, I'm afraid I'll have to take my business elsewhere. My fans deserve better, my band deserves better and I deserve better. Call me when you got something for me to test and we’ll work out the bugs.” The executives looked at each other with embarrassment written on their faces and one of them said “You got it mate; we’ll be in touch.”
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2026 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
Bi amping is even common in most powered studio monitors these days. I know mine are.
I almost missed this; thanks for pointing this out Brian.
Here's what my monitor owner's manual says.
The bi-amplified design, with individual power amplifiers for the low frequency and high frequency transducers, uses efficient high-output Class-D integrated power amplifiers to provide high SPL (sound pressure level).
I'm thinking there may not be an absolute straight line back to Enstwistle on this (digital switching vs analog) but I'd like to believe that there is at least some connection . . . not sure.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2026 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
We have a lot of options nowadays on how electronics are designed. Many if not most decisions revolve around cost. Bi-amping is a good and well-known solution to the sound pressure issue. There are other solutions that will work but cost more to design and implement.
The idea is to get the correct frequencies directed to the correct speaker and to drive those speakers hard enough to produce the sound pressure level desired.
The electronic components for passive crossover are pretty simple, being capacitors, inductors, and resistors. There are both component and design issues that define how well any of this works. More complex better designs cost more money to produce.
All very cool stuff if you have an interest in electronics.
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig? “Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
The electronic components for passive crossover are pretty simple, being capacitors, inductors, and resistors. There are both component and design issues that define how well any of this works. More complex better designs cost more money to produce.
All very cool stuff if you have an interest in electronics.
Indeed, this is all cool stuff. I'm always amazed at what can be done by controlling the "simple" electron and also the "humble" bit (in software).
Although this is not my domain, I've worked with many circuit designers over the years. This field is so large that there are several sub-domains where techs and engineers specialize in analog, digital, microcircuits, power supplies, etc.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2026 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 Mac Special Offers Extended Until May 31st!
Good news- we've extended our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac® special offers until May 31, 2026!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 is packed with major new features, enhancements, and an incredible lineup of new content! The program now sports a sleek, modern GUI redesign across the entire interface, including updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, a new dark mode option, and more. The brand-new side toolbar provides quicker access to key windows, while the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, creating a flexible, clutter-free workspace. We have an amazing new “AI-Notes” feature. This transcribes polyphonic audio into MIDI so you can view it in notation or play it back as MIDI. You can transcribe an entire track (all pitched instruments and drums) or focus on individual parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, and much more!
There are over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®.
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Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac - Special Offers End at 11:59pm PDT on Friday, May 15th, 2026!
Order before 11:59pm PDT on Friday, May 15th and SAVE up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® version 2026 for Mac Upgrade packages... and that's not all! With your version 2026 for Mac purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks... that's 222 NEW RealTracks available with version Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac!
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202 New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2026!
With Band-in-a-Box® 2026, we've released 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 468-488) in a variety of genres—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Funk & World (Sets 468-475):
Our new jazz, funk & blues RealTracks include a groovin’ collection of RealTracks and RealDrums! These include more requested “soul jazz” RealTracks featuring artists Neil Swainson (bass), Charles Treadway (organ), Brent Mason (guitar), and Wes Little (drums). There are new “smooth jazz” styles (4), which include a RealTracks first: muted trumpet, as well as slick new smooth jazz brushes options for drums. Blues lovers will be thrilled—there are more “classic acoustic blues” styles, including guitar (5), bass (4), and drums (10) with blues master Colin Linden, featuring understated and tasty background acoustic soloing, plus brushes drums and acoustic bass. There are also new electric blues RealTracks, including electric blues with PG favorite Johnny Hiland (3) and soulful electric slide guitar from Colin Linden (4). If you love funk & gospel, there are great new options this year, including gospel organ (3) from Charles Treadway, as well as new funk, tango, and rock ’n’ roll drums (3) and bass (1). And for big, bold arrangements, we have uptempo soul horns (4) featuring a three-part hip horn section with options for a full mix or stems of each individual horn — plus an accompanying rhythm section (4) of drums, bass, guitar, and electric piano!
Rock & Pop (Sets 476–482):
Our new rock & pop RealTracks bring a powerful mix of requested favorites, fresh genres, and modern chart-inspired styles! We have more of our popular “Producer Layered Acoustic Guitars (15)” featuring Band-in-a-Box favorite Brent Mason. We’ve continued our much-requested disco styles (10), and added new Celtic guitar (5) with a more basic, accessible approach than our previous Drop-D or DADGAD offerings. There are also highly requested yacht rock styles (17), inspired by the smooth, polished soft-rock sound of the late ’70s and early ’80s — laid-back grooves, silky electric pianos, warm textures, elegant harmonic movement, and pristine production aesthetics. Fans of heavier styles will love our new glam metal (13), capturing the flashy, high-energy sound of ’80s arena-ready guitar rock. We also have a set of rootsy modern-folk rock (18), with a warm, organic sound combining contemporary folk textures and driving acoustic strumming. And we’ve added lots of new modern pop styles (16) — the kinds of sounds you’re hearing on the radio today, featuring exciting new drums, synths, and cutting-edge RealTracks arrangements.
Country, & Americana (Sets 483–488):
Our new country & Americana RealTracks deliver a rich collection of acoustic, electric, and roots-inspired styles! We have new country pop (9) with legendary guitarist Brent Mason. There is also a potpourri (14) of bouzouki, guitars, banjo, and more, perfect for adding texture and character to contemporary acoustic arrangements. We’ve added funky country guitar (5) with PG favorite Brent Mason, along with classic pedal steel styles (5) featuring steel great Doug Jernigan. There are more country songwriter styles (8) that provide intimate, rootsy foundations for storytelling and modern Americana writing. Finally, we have “background soloing” acoustic guitar (12) with Brent Mason — simpler, but still very tasty acoustic lines designed to sit beautifully behind vocals or act as a subtle standalone solo part.
And, if you are looking for more, the 2026 49-PAK (for $49) includes an impressive collection of 20 bonus RealTracks, featuring exciting and inspiring additions to add to your RealTracks library. You'll get new country-rhythm guitar styles from PG Music favorites Johnny Hiland and Brent Mason, along with modern-pop grooves that capture today’s radio-ready sound! There are also new indie-folk styles with guitar, bass, 6-string bass used as a high-chording instrument, acoustic guitar, and banjo. Plus, dedicated "cymbal fills" RealDrums provide an added layer that work very well with low-key folky styles with other percussion.
The 2026 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2026 49-PAK!
2026 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
With your version 2026 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
Playable RealTracks Set 5
RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
iOS Android Band-in-a-Box® App
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
XPro & Xtra Styles PAK Sets On Sale Now - Until May 15, 2026!
All of our XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs are on sale until May 15th, 2026!
It's the perfect time to expand your Band-in-a-Box® style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs. These additional styles for Band-in-a-Box® offer a wide range of genres designed to fit seamlessly into your projects. Each style is professionally arranged and mixed, helping enhance your songs while saving you time.
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Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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