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Fender buying Studio One certainly brings back memories of Gibson and Sonar.
I never used the Studio One forum, but its closure has caused some concern for some people.
I would most likely still be using Sonar if it had not gone away.
I have never liked Real Band very much or several of the other DAWs I have tried.
I don't have any real reason to think there will be any problem with Studio One.
If it did die for some reason and I had to make a change again, I would not be sure where I would go.
Pro Tools seems like it is still the industry standard default major DAW, but I have always found it hard to learn how to operate. Pro Tools is most likely the best DAW for live recording, especially for live drums, but I never considered it best for what most of us here do with a DAW.
Where would you go next if your favorite DAW were to go away and why?
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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Billy. je t'aime rb. the key to rb is to dig into it and its unique features. does it have 'quirks' ? sure. but so do many music apps. there are many of us rb users that grew up on pg powertracks like myself...so...rb learning cycle is lessened. imho Rob Helms (also a rb user user) said it best ie its lack of 'familiarity' that keeps some away from rb. without bias i can say awhile back i tried various demoes of various daws but came back to rb time and again even though there are some very nice ones out there. frankly for me after trying all those daws the ones that still crank me up are... 1..reaper version 2 which ived used with rb and bb for years and with powertracks before that. ie www.reaper.fm still offers version 2 i believe. and.. 2..mtstudio by bremmers.... https://www.multitrackstudio.com/if you doubt me re mtstudio heres the forum where its fans hang out. https://www.multitrackstudio.com/forum/as you can see...tons of posts on the mts forum. you might ask why those two particularly ? answer is simple...as a tech i like them for... 1..they are both small lightweight exe's. 2..as an ex programmer in my early days years ago i like apps that do a lot with few computer resources needed. 3..both are very 'nimble' and will even run on the most clunky pc's at the same time tho' neither offer auto accompany of course. so of course its understandeable that rb is a larger exe. and there you have it. what i find testing lots of daws these days is as we used to say in the poor london uk area where i grew up...lol.. 'lots of flash'. whereas rb isnt flashy but offers one heck of a lot of features. sometimes the beauty of an ugly duckling is underneath... haveing said above there are various features i would like in rb. have a great merry xmas and a fab 2025 Billy. om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/22/24 07:48 PM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs(90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
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I want a DAW to be powerful yet easy to use. I hate manuals so I need plenty of You Tube "how to" content, friendly forums and Facebook activity. A clean, logical well designed interface where I can work quickly and efficently. It comes loaded with all the plug-ins one needs including melodyne and a stem splitter. It is also very reasonably priced. Mixcraft ticks all my boxes yet remains a mystery why it is largely ignored and unloved in general. I've used and discarded most of the popular daws over the years for various reasons. So Billy, give Mixcraft a look.
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Izzy.
i would just with respect like to point out one of many advantages of rb viz traditional daws.
lets take this scenario....
its 3 am and this has happened to me many times.
..i get a song idea...(and make a cuppa tea...lol.)
..if i open up reaper version 2 which i like or another daw its gonna take me awhile to enter all the audio and midi tracks ie record them whereas..
..all i do in rb is (as i like rock genres) choose such a style and enter my chords.
et voila i got my backing band fast to lay down my vocals.
in summary rb lets me get my song idea down FAST with actual realistic session musicians so i have a realistic backing to my song.
i dont (like i used to do in commercial studios)
have to bring in a group of session players either.
i ve used traditional daw software many times in the past. but keep on coming back to rb.
you said you dont like manuals and i dont either but once one reads the rb manual (its on line also here at pg plus faq's) one will i hope realise the many plusses rb has over the traditional daw.
i agree more you tube vids are needed re rb.
and yes i agree Mixcraft is a very nice daw.
ive tried it. but i keep on coming back to rb.
lets remember rb is free also.
ps i'm haveing lots of fun with the new stem splitter included in rb for 2025.
have a grrreat xmas.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/23/24 09:43 AM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs(90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
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I didn't know S1 closed their forum... Now I know what the fuss is all about. I was considering it to replace Cakewalk, but now seeds of doubt had been planted...
Bandlab is definitely not Gibson, the owner has enough cash, however recent "subscription only" new Sonar tipped the scale for me after 25+ years. I decided to give them till summer of 2025 (full year after Sonar anouncement) to come up with perpetual licenses. If that will not happen, I will start transitioning to another DAW. S1 was a no brainer choice, but now I will have to investigate more.
My other choices were:
Cubase - (thankfully they got rid of USB dongles). Full featured DAW, that has a good overall track.
Mixcraft - pretty nice DAW for the price. Has a lot of potential.
Reaper - very flexible and affordable, but lacks a particular comping / take lane feature, touch navigation and a few others that I am used to.
Billy, I agree with your view on Pro tools.
-------------------
Bottom line, out of all DAWs I 've tried in the past 3 years (most of them). Cakewalk has most preferred workflow for my use. Specifically automated take lanes with individual mutes and solos, automation of these take lanes. Touch navigation and zoom. Sonar pioneered that technology about 10 years back. No other Daw came remotely close, even Bitwig which supposedly made with touchscreen in mind is far away. Multi Tool that is fairly "intelligent" and lets you work without constant tool switching. GUI is likely the most flexible one out of most I've tried. Unfortunately I don't believe in "renting" software. While Cakewalk (not Sonar) is still free, they had a very specific line in FAQ about discontinuation, which they quietly removed when uncomfortable questions started pouring in. That was an evidence of their plans, and I doubt anything will change. I still have some hope boneheads some people at Bandlab marketing will change their minds about perpetual licenses of this great software.
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I also use BIAB to generate Ideas for a song. It is great for that.
Very few people who I know are using only 0ne DAW.
I would not know how to use RB to record a drum kit, for example, with eight or ten microphones plus triggers.
I am not looking for speed but quality.
I am happy enough with Studio One Pro 7.
My question was, if your favorite DAW, RB, for example, went away, what would you go to next?
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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Just so you know, I own Reaper, Pro Tools, Sonar, Studio One, Ableton Live, and, of course, BB.
I have not experimented with Cubase, but many people I know use it.
I am not fond of renting software but sometimes it is the only way you can get it.
Like everything else, this music hobby is getting more expensive every day. Service is not easy to access in many cases, especially for non-professional musicians.
I can also say that getting service on anything at any price has been very difficult in the last few years, not to mention the expense. I had an electrician over this morning for thirty minutes and paid $250 cash! I knew how to do the electrical work, but I am too old to be calling around the attic!
Any of the companies that sell DAWs can go on a subscription basis at any time. They can also sell the company. There is no real protection, no matter who you buy from.
Billt
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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I tried a bunch when it looked like SONAR was ending. I landed briefly in Mixcraft then shifted to Studio One by Presonus. That was an easy choice because 1) it integrates the control software with my Presonus hardware (see signature) and I’m a beta tester for Presonus Notion.
I’m not concerned by Fender buying the company. Tremendous resources went into Notion Mobile that is free and runs on anything including iPads with pencil for handwriting scores. I think the new forum will get sorted out.
Studio One notation is improving rapidly. All I can say is, there is a plan and like BIAB they don’t give out plans in advance.
Protools at one point was used by professional audio engineers as a standard, which helped in exchanging files between studios. I’ve fought with it in the studio and I’m grateful to not use it at home.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Problem with Bandlab, they potentially CAN deactivate existing Cakewalk by Bandlab (not renew activation) and one will be stuck with 2017 last paid version if they have it of course. On their once great forum, they kill threads within hours that raise legitimate questions. If they had publicly said that a user will be allowed to keep last published version of Cakewalk, it would be a totally thing, but they keep on playing their dark games.
My take on the whole (music) software (for Windows) thing is this. Once you buy a software, it should work for at least 5-7 years. Renting software... I don't know. Not my thing.
Ohh, BTW. I had good experience with buying a few "pre-owned" legit licenses (transfers) at very deep discounts on Knobcloud. Sellers usually have history / feedback, so easy to spot fakes.
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Presently Cakewalk by Bandlab (CbB) is my DAW of choice. If it was no longer available I would switch to +++ Multitrack Studio or (MTS) +++. MTS has built-in midi instruments that were updated in June, 2024; supports the midi 2 Note On Orchestral Articulation profile; supports VST2, VST3 and CLAP plugins, has a great user forum, small footprint (Download size is approx. 12 MB) and is not a resource hog.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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That’s one I did not know, Jim.
Sounds good for someone starting out. All DAWs do basic functions, so someone beginning should try all the demos and choose the one that ‘feels’ right. Once you get the basics down and know specific features you need, review the choices again.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Jim.
i'm glad you echo what i said upthread about MTS.
i mention it sometimes to people with no interest in session muso track generation and they go...'what ? never heard of it'....and think i'm nuts till i point them to the MTS user forum.
but to be fair lets also mention some of the free daws out there.
eg podium and traction waveform and others.
not to be sneezed at. but i come back to rb cos of its session muso and other features.
Charlie also made some great observations re advantages of rb re auto accompany in rb.
for someone totally new to music production though not interested in auto accompany etc.
my 2 top suggestions are...for reasons i mentioned upthread...
1..reaper version 2. which reminds me in some ways of the big multitracks we used to use in commercial studios but with the advantage of
plugin support. its so simple to use.
2..MTS as you mentioned. like reaper excellent value for money.
i used to use reaper more but with recent feature
upgrades its rb for me as i can do all i want in rb tracks view. (which is why i would like to see bb's new track view be like rb ie a musos work center with audio/midi daw like editing.)
ps Billy re recording multiple mics at a time (eg drums) you might find rb users rharv comments in the rb forum topic 'how do you use rb' of use.
you can record multiple tracks at a time in rb.
assuming you have the appropo sound interface.
merry xmas to all.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/23/24 12:45 PM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs(90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
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I have reaper the lastest version, Mixbus 32 last version, and have RB i love them all for different reasons. I use RB the most because of exactly what JAOM said quick fast creation. I used Studio one for 3 versions and it is a great software, no complaints. I just like having all my toys in one place. I also had MTS MultitrackStudios version 1 thru 6 it is a powerful simple and unique program. I spent years with cakewalk products. Version 2 home studios on floppy disk back around 1998. bought the music creator 2 thru 5 and then Sonar Pro Loved them but found a few things that bugged. Tried Logic on a small mac and loved it but my old Mac would not upgrade anymore. So i have settled into RB for the most part. Having done around 125 projects in it i find it simple and complete. If i need a bit more fancy slick editing i can jump over to Reaper. I used to jump to Mixbus 32C but Now i have the Mixbus 32 C channel strip working in RB along with the SSL channel strips. Pretty power mixing done with Analog Legendary feel and sound.
Bottom line they all work, and all get it done. Find what make your job easier and run with it. If you have not tried MTS i suggest trying it.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Hi Om
I do use and enjoy RB ocassionally. Also I have used Powertracks since Adam was a lad. Depending on the task at hand.
Hey OM
Why don't you post your songs on the showcase any more? I really enjoyed them!!
Merry Xmas & a great 2025 to you and yours
♬♩♪♩ I҉z҉z҉y҉ ♬♩♪♩
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Reaper - very flexible and affordable, but lacks a particular comping / take lane feature, touch navigation and a few others that I am used to. Misha, The take/Lanes/Comping feature in Reaper has been hugely upgraded over the last two iterations. Check out Kenny G's youtube tutorials to see if they meet your requirements. https://www.youtube.com/@REAPERMania/search?query=takes%20Reaper7
Cheers
rayc
"What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
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...
I would not know how to use RB to record a drum kit, for example, with eight or ten microphones plus triggers.
I am not looking for speed but quality.
....
Billy I can help with that if you ever decide to try RB. We do it quite often. The 'quality' part comes from the hardware and artistry, not a particular DAW, FWIW
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Well said Sir RHarv. Like I said above i have used Just about all of them and they all do a great job. They all get the job done. It really comes down to what you like it to look/work/and feel like. Your not going to get a full drum kit on separate tracks with a built in sound chip. You need a proper multichannel interface. Or ..... Wait for it .... BiaB or RB! just added a 12 stem drum track in RB generated in less that 15 seconds.
Last edited by Rob Helms; 12/24/24 06:44 AM.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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If Studio One suddenly went away I'd give Reaper a strong look.
They seem to have a large and loyal following, I like Kenny G's videos, development appears to be steady/continuous, it appears to be here for the long haul and Reaper has a "roll-your-own" programming feel to it which tells me it's very flexible.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
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Izzy. (re my songs. thanks for the comment appreciated...more songs are in my sig from rock to country etc...but note flag song is 'rough' as i was far from home with no gear to speak of just junk few buks mic/beat box etc as i was showing a relative interested in doing songs. props to Mr David Cuny for helping cleaning it up...fyi ive done so many songs ive lost count useing pg apps.) All. heres a interesting daw noone mentions in the spirit of being unbiased. check it out... https://www.zrythm.org/en/index.htmlfranklly rb is getting so good for me that i dont need anything else. Mcity i know likes the bb plugin/reaps approach. but for years ive been flitting tween pg music apps and reaper ..(since reaps came out) so i'm tired of 'flitting' like a honey bee going from flower to flower. i just want ONE music app which is my center for song creation. and with recent rb feature additions its floating my boat. i know some users like the new bb plugin but the prob for me is i cant do 'on the fly' track editing within it after track generation. WHEREAS in rb i can gen tracks and edit to my hearts content. and do all sorts of fancy tricks with drums. fwiw. merry x to all. om
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs(90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
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I never jumped into RB, most likely because of my general thoughts about BIAB. In the beginning, I also used Sonar ten times more than BB, so I think everyone uses what we know the most about.
As time went on and I used other DAWs, RB became less trouble to understand. Every DAW has something to like.
In general, I have always considered BB to be an arcane, hard-to-learn software program with many nonstandard features. Not that Sonar was easy, or any music software for that matter.
As time went on, I became more used to BB and its quirks. On a general note, I curse the lack of standards across the board. How the hell is the United States basically the only country in the world not on the metric system for example?
Truthfully, if any DAW that I use today were to disappear, that would not cause that much of an issue.
I could move to number next with a lot less trouble than in the past. Perhaps a temporary bit of yelling and screaming...lol
Well, Obviously, any DAW is just one part of what is, in truth, a pretty complex system for sound recording. Microphone selection and placement alone require the understanding depicted in "forty-pound" books...lol.
I assume there is nothing to be concerned about with Studio One. Changes in pricing are already being complained about, and the new owners will only do what they think is best for them. Nothing new about that.
Cheers,
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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"What do you think the future of the current DAW software is?" I just hope the trend towards AI slows .. not much musicianship in that and learning actual music (theory, discipline, etc) has so much to offer to people. /awaiting the inevitable 'what are you doing here then' remarks .. //having a song, structure, concept already in mind and using RTs to help fill it in is much different that just pushing a button and having it all done for you .. // I fear we are headed toward the latter where no knowledge of music is needed, which would be a huge loss ////puts tinfoil hat back on 
Last edited by rharv; 12/24/24 11:40 AM.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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LOL. It seems impossible to get past the AI influence on any question at the moment.
Today, at my house, we sat around and played some live Christmas music on acoustic piano and guitar with the neighbors. There was no DAW, no AI, and no electronics at all.
Whatever the future of the DAWs or other things, we can choose to involve ourselves in those issues or not.
I can tell you that my use of advanced technology and ancient methods of doing things are not mutually exclusive.
Once, I lived in a tree on a small island for a couple of months. I got there in a jet airplane. It is possible to use and enjoy both.
I hear all the expressed fear about AI. The truth is the airplane could have crashed, or I could have fallen out of the tree and killed myself...lol
Life is not dangerous; it is terminal, and no one lives through and gets out alive...lol
Happy Holidays,
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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Ray,
Thanks for the video links. I keep track on advancements that I am looking for in Reaper (and other DAWs). Yes, Reaper's take lanes getting better, but still not there yet. I've actually had a conversation with a few Reaper die hards very recently about these. Good thing that there are so many good options!
If I had a chance to cook a DAW today, I would get: workflow and touch ability of Cakewalk, features of Cubase, flexibility of Reaper and Piano Roll and midi handling of FL Studio at Mixcraft price point.
P.S. To my surprise, FL Studio made some incredible advances. Definitely not what it used to be. Check it out Billy, maybe it will move you.
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Thanks, Misha, for the heads up. I think the Christmas turkey has turned my brain to mush and a nap may be all that can save me from myself...lol
Actually, FL Studio has been on the far, very bleeding edge of my software radar. There are just not enough hours in the day...
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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I use Reaper and doubt it's going away.
But I've dabbled with a number of DAWs before, and there are a whole range that cater to different needs. They all need to do roughly the same thing, so I'm sure I could get by with whatever - even RealBand.
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My point was I hope DAWs start teaching music more instead of leaning toward not needing musical ability.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Sonar is still available and they (Bandlab) are still keeping it updated. They have a subscription model but I have the off line version on my machine. It seems to work well.
I tried Real Band way back in the early years just to see what it could do. It's a basic DAW that will get the job done.
If I recall, the one thing it didn't do at that time was Busses and something about the way it handled some plugins was not to my liking. In addition, using envelopes was kind of cumbersome and as a result I used it solely to create the additional tracks I was seeking for the styles that didn't have the extra instruments in them that I wanted to use in my songs. With the advent of the plugin version of BB, there's actually no longer any need to use Real Band at all. At least that's been my experience. Using the plugin now is easier and eliminates a step or two in the process for me.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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With the advent of the plugin version of BB, there's actually no longer any need to use Real Band at all. Blasphemy! On Christmas, no less.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Hardcore Cubase user here because it's probably the best DAW for MIDI + VST instruments.
And the developers seem to be as wired as I am, I rarely need the manual, even for complex things.
If it ever goes away, I'll switch to Reaper, I already have a full license because I want to support the developer.
But changing the DAW (or the GFX or video software) is always a PITA that I try to avoid.
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Herb RB does automation busses and VST3. It has come a long way since those days.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Rob.
yes its come a heck of a looong way.
just one example of many...show me another daw where i can generate oodles of tracks useing real session musicians. eg lets say i want various takes of a violin solo (like we used to do in studios) and then want to comp down parts of each track to a final one.
or lets say one wants to stack session musos and lots of take etc etc..
lets not forget powertracks for someone not needing session muso generation.
long term hard core ptw users i'm sure will agree with the following.
..its a bargoon for the paltry price pg asks for it...ie a couple of burgers.
..for someone just starting out doing songs (or seasoned people even) with no money and its great for song production.
(i would argue one could even do a hit song with it....limited by only ones imagination.)
..i did a slew of songs with it years back when i was working with tape based 24 track machines in studios.
one major reason i like apps like bb/rb/ptw and bremmers multitrackstudio (as well as reaps) is no intrusive security measures.
so if a music app is overly intrusive i simply refuse to work with it.
i dont want the added worry about such things.
ive seen what some people go through.
(see gearspace.com for threads/posts.)
in my recent review of daws i also noted how easy it was to try a trial without haveing to go through some rigmarole like being forced to set up registration and/or giving emails and/or personal info.
for example bremmers (and reaps) are a breeze
to trial.
eg with bremmers includeing going on the site, downloading (i dont have fastest net where i live) installing and booting up mtstudio and seeing its main screen , it couldnt be any faster or simpler,...just a few minutes.
a major refreshing difference compared to some trials that took too much of my time.
i also like pg's 30 day approach.
ps ...lol...my wife got me a stocking stuffer sign that ive hung up that says...
'my neighbors are listening to great music whether they like it or not' ho ho ho.
happy new year to all.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/25/24 05:52 PM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs(90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
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...Pro Tools seems like it is still the industry standard default major DAW, but I have always found it hard to learn how to operate. Pro Tools is most likely the best DAW for live recording, especially for live drums, but I never considered it best for what most of us here do with a DAW....
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Today, at my house, we sat around and played some live Christmas music on acoustic piano and guitar with the neighbors. There was no DAW, no AI, and no electronics at all. I sometime imagine a group of people sitting around a camp fire, trying to get a signal.  There's no substitute for being able to make music for oneself. Clapping and singing with others is a better experience than listening to [insert popular contemporary singer here] on a mobile phone.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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[quote=Planobilly].............................................
There's no substitute for being able to make music for oneself. Clapping and singing with others is a better experience than listening to [insert popular contemporary singer here] on a mobile phone. Exactly. That is why BobH and I get together on Sundays and just jam. Some we post but most we don't (that could be a song!) because they are covers.
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I think I'll just use this as my Studio One is not working anymore: Download PT ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=29982&filename=Rea-Pro-Tools.png) ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=29983&filename=Rea-Pro-Tools-Mixer.png)
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After viewing both of these I thought of PGM and how they resemble Pro Tools, i.e. lack of keeping up with the times and an old man's program. I really hope PGM can change a little and be around for a very long time.
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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This is what the producer in the above video produces.
Death Before Dishonor
[Album1585331]
. . . .
Artist 2 Pistols
Type Album
Released 17 June 2008
RYM Rating 2.38 / 5.0 from 25 ratings
Genres Gangsta Rap, Southern Hip Hop
Pop Rap
Descriptors crime, vulgar, urban, hedonistic, sexual, violence, boastful, male vocalist
Language English
These videos, like many videos, were produced to be contentious and used as clickbait to promote himself.
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig?
“Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
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After viewing both of these I thought of PGM and how they resemble Pro Tools, i.e. lack of keeping up with the times and an old man's program. I really hope PGM can change a little and be around for a very long time. I do all I do because believe in Biab how it gives top session musicians for your DAW (not as an auto accompaniment app). PG tends to put things off and makes do with old ways rather than aiming for excellence. Like how could PG use a modern DAW or other modern software then go to BB/PT/RB and say this is fine ? wouldn't you want to strive to make your product modern. Using BB/RB since 2009 I tried to get PG to make them better to no avail, but then I found Reaper that I could totally integrate with BB/BB Plugin. I tried it with Studio One as it has scripting but zero information on it, I did make a few scripts to import BB Chords. Reaper is the only DAW the gives full control of anything you want to do layouts/themes/menus/toolbars. I did go through so many DAWs but it was the only one that could fully integrate with Biab/BB Plugin giving full editing control that you don't have with consolidated wav files dragged into any other DAW.
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Don't care about PT—never did. I got into Performer when it was the GUI for Pro Tools—but you needed the hardware. Then Digital Performer became a DAW without the PT hardware and it worked great. So, when PT became a DAW that functioned without any AVID hardware, I was waaay past giving a damn and that's where I am still. Although I work with clients and collaborators using all of the major DAWs, DP is still the one I like best. "What do you think the future of the current DAW software is?"
I just hope the trend towards AI slows .. not much musicianship in that and learning actual music (theory, discipline, etc) has so much to offer to people. Got some bad news for you, then. I had long meetings with Muse Group at NAMM last week where they pretty much confirmed their goals of dominating the world music scene. Audacity and MuseScore will be getting major AI boosts soon and will remain free — you won't be able to enter the Muse Group Universe without them. The real money is in Publishing and Performance Rights; Audacity and MuseScore will be the gateway drugs. As it was put to me: We want them to be the absolute best out there— free will be the icing on the cake. They were a bit surprised when I laid out what I expect to be their 5 Year Plan. It's the only thing that made sense when they shelled out a few Billion$ for Hal Leonard 13 months ago and J.W. Pepper recently. Hmmmm... Muse Group bought the world's largest music publisher and the world's largest sheet music vender for cash... I wonder where this is going?
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac
24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
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When my DAW came to an end I went with Reaper. I have 2 or 3 others but Reaper is the one I used the most. Personally, I don't think it's going to matter much in the future. This is my prediction. The future of all DAWS - First you'll pull up your AI to write the lyrics and music for you, then hit your AI button to arrange it all for you, next you'll add your preferred AI vocal(s) to sing for you, then you'll hit the AI mix and master buttons so that's done for you, after that you'll of course hit your AI button to choose your AI generated artwork with your name prominently displayed. And finally you'll press the AI button that quickly and easily uploads it to all the relevant places you want it posted/released. There will also be AI generated video available too and AI will upload that for you as well. You'll make sure your AI DAW subscription fees are up to date along with any extra charges you incur and then you'll call it done in an hour (or less). Take a break - who knows maybe get out and go play a few games of pickleball. Or maybe you'll decide you want to AI a whole album a day. Or AI a song an hour. Your full featured AI DAW will do everything for you.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
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XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
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Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
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These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
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Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
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- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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