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#45975 12/02/09 06:15 AM
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I would like to see an effective Play List function in PT Pro. I use the old Cakewalk Professional on stage because it has an excellent Play List function and window. This is invaluable for live performances and allows me to easily skip around in the playlists to respond to requests or just change my mind about what songs I should be playing for the particular audience. Each play list in Cakewalk Professional allows up to 128 songs, but I would think the number of songs could be unlimited, as could the number of playlists. The feature allows the option of the next song being started by a keystroke. For ease of operation only a single key, preferably the space bar, should trigger playback. Using a two key trigger, like shift-F1 for example, is not practical for some of us who have our hands full with a guitar. A trogger for the next song is very helpful since I often like to talk to the audience between songs and I do not want the next file to start automatically. The feature should allow for easy loading and reordering of songs on the list. The lists should not be tied to an alphabetical arrangement or playback sequence, but should play back in the order they are entered in the playlist to allow customized playlists. Thank you very much for considering my wishlist suggestion. Scott

Traphillman #45976 12/03/09 04:39 AM
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Glad to see your post. I have been using same program for 10 years or so. The old virtual jukebox. I have posted my wish for a playlist like this at various times in tip and tricks, but really got no help.Got some ideas but found nothing that will replace VJB. I even wrote to programmer who worked on it for cakewalk. He said they retired program some years ago and Cakewalk does not seem interested in upgrading it.
I will continue to use VJB I don't think we have a choice. If the good folks at PG took a look at vjb I know they could come up with something that would be just as good and add to it capabilities of using DXi synths and the like.
Smokey


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zokk #45977 12/03/09 09:05 AM
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Why not a separate program designed around just the features needed for Live Performance of the files?

Lean and mean, it wouldn't need to address all the extraneous Recording features and be dedicated to the required task.

I should think that this would be your ultimate answer. It also seems to me that pgmusic development already has all the core engines for the task, but its never an easy job to roll out a new one. With enough interest to justify it, they just might consider that, though. A program designed around intelligently handling the files you've made with other pgmusic products in performance with all the bells and whistles you want. And only those bells and whistles.

I'd even be willing to bet that a websearch just might turn up some things already out there, but I'm not a betting man.



--Mac

Traphillman #45978 12/04/09 07:56 AM
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Thanks, Mac and Zokk for your input. I wonder if the best place to add such a play list feature would not be in the BIAB/Real Band upgrades?
Zokk do you use a universal audio-midi interface to play mixed audio and midi files on stage? I think I am going to go from all midi files to the real band stuff as soon as BIAB 2010 comes out. But I think many, if not all, of the files will have midi and audio tracks and I have been told that an interface is the way to split them out before running them into my little one-man-band mixer. I am looking at the Roland/Edirol interfaces. I use a SD-20 Edirol sound module for the midi and it works very well for me.

Traphillman #45979 12/04/09 09:39 AM
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I have found empirically that there is no need whatsoever to lug the extra outrigger sound device to the live gig.

Today's laptops have very good Audio Output and converters are frankly good enough for the live gig playback. Take the noise level of the typical live audience as one reason. The other reason is that any laptop sold since maybe around 2006 has come with output side audio that is pretty clean due to the wide customer base interest in playback of audio and video files.

So you can keep things simpler on the gig and just use the Earphone output of the laptop as a Line Output to a stereo line input on your pa. All you need is the proper 1/8" stereo plug Y cable that terminates in two RCA phono plug males at the other end, most PA systems today have at least one stereo pair input for tape decks or cd players and it works fine with this output.

Headphone Output IS Unbalanced Line Level Audio ("consumer level" at -10dBmm exactly the level those two red and white RCA jacks on the PA were designed to accept). Electrically speaking, there's a period at the end of that sentence. The only difference is the doggone label.

One thing, make sure you open the Windows Playback mixer on the lappy and turn the Volumes in use, including a Master Volume Fader if there is one for your onboard sound, ALL THE WAY UP. Drive the line hard like that for best signal to noise ratio and full sound. Set the level over at the PA.

One more thing, most laptops also have buttons for Volume on them that control the Master Fader. Make sure they are also all the way up and use them wisely on the gig. If the sound level should drop, think that one of those keys may have gotten hit inadvertantly and go for the UP arrow key first.

Works a treat here.

Of course, for *recording* soundfiles at home for use on the gig, an aftermarket sound device should be used, because the recording and input side of laptop internal soundcards just hasn't caught up yet. This is again driven by customer base. Not enough of us demanding recording quality inputs and converters for the laptop mfr's to take notice. More customers prefer paying less money for the laptop. Most laptops still don't have a proper stereo line input on the built in sound device, either. Boo.


--Mac

Mac #45980 12/06/09 06:03 AM
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Thanks, Mac. I have found the PG staff so excellent and friendly in providing help over the years, and I have noticed your posts are always in the same vane. I really appreciate the help. I started using computers very late in life. I used to just perform with two drum machines and guitar. I think I have had BIAB and PT since 2004, maybe a little before. Now I plan on changing to BIAB 2010/Real Band as soon as it comes out.
I want to buy a new lap top and just use it for my music but I don't know what the best laptop options are as far a speed, RAM, sound card, etc. I am sure I will be running files that are solely midi, solely audio, and files that have both midi and audio tracks into my mixer. Eventually I will probably try to teach myself to burn CDs with my own music for sale at my jobs. I would love to hear your advice on what I need in a laptap and whether or not I need some kind of external disc mastering and making device list (something from Fostec or Boss) or if the disc-making features in BIAB/Real Band or PT are sufficient to do the job.
As for the play list function. I plan to try to set up a folder with files in play list order and put numbers before the file names, i.e., 001AngleFly, 002America. Do you think that will work?
Thanks again, Mac. Scott :

Traphillman #45981 12/06/09 08:51 AM
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BIAB, RB and PT are very forgiving as to laptop choice and these kind of music making programs.

That said, I wouldn't recommend the bottom-end stuff, nor the top-end $$$ stuff.

Plenty of folks around here are VERY satisfied with the LENOVO laptop line, BTW.

Our own Bob "Notes" Norton recently posted his experiences with them and their support, having recently gotten superb support and warranty repair for one of his road laptops that he's had for years. Lenovo.

As for burning CDs to sell on the gig, been there, done that and here's my advice:

*Don't even try to use a home consumer CD burner to make CD copies for sale to your audience.

It is slow.

It is unreliable. -- The CD will likely not play on different players and that makes the audience -- your customers -- angry, and can create problems for you that you just don't need.

Artwork is always problematic with home burned CDs. -- Paper stickon labels are pretty, but all too soon come unglued and jam somebody's CD player. Don't. Bother.

***Instead, use your home burner only to make your CD Master Copy and a backup or two. Then send that Master Copy off to a CD publisher. These days that has become a cottage industry, websearching should bring up literally hundreds of them. The last service I used for getting CDs to sell on the gigs was available thru Musician's Friend website. Good prices, Good quality and I could order -- and re-order to keep in stock with little trouble. They publish the whole situation, the packages offered, the fees and the artwork stuff. Check it out. These will be Redbook Spec CDs, pretty much the same as you would buy in a CD store, they play on just about every player made, the artwork looks pro and you can -- and should -- even get a album specific barcode imprinted at the same time.

Don't forget the Copyright Office. If in the US of A, the process has never been easier due to the new website. All questions answered there, in the new FAQs.

http://www.copyright.gov/

Bookmark it now.

If you are making a CD of all cover songs, go for a "mechanical copyright" of the entire album, about $40 covers the one-shot. Then you visit the Harry Fox agency website to take care of the royalties situation, which has never been easier also. You simply keep track of your sales over time and then send in a very small fee to Harry Fox licensing and they take charge of distributing to the copyright owners. There. Is. Nothing. Like. Being. Entirely. Legal.

Ten bucks each, it is amazing some nights when somebody wants to buy all 6 or all 10 available. Happens often, actually. This is a tourist town, may have something to do with it. But also some locals who just want to support musician. Good people.

My only problem is that the wifey sets up the table and sells the CDs while I'm up onstage slaving away behind the keyboards.

And she keeps the munny....


--Mac

Mac #45982 12/06/09 08:52 AM
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BTW -- Most of my CDs for sale at the gig were also recorded on the gigs.

Saves time, but also can yield a realistic live performance CD.

We can talk about the methods of doing that at a later time.


--Mac

Traphillman #45983 12/16/09 03:14 PM
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Thanks Mac!

You are just full of great advice! I will follow it all, i.e., copyright office, Harry Fox Agency, CD making, etc.

I also tried setting up all 500 of my files in play lists, as was suggested on one of the other forums, and entering numbers in front of each file (001, 002, etc.). It seems to have worked. I have them all in the order of my personal "fake book" (I can't remember all the words anymore without it!!

Now if I only lived in a resort town and could find more work! People come up here to visit and live in the summer but it is absolutely dead in the winter. So I just work on the music in the winter. This year I have BIAB 2010 and Real Band to work on - I have never used audio tracks - just midi.

I really can't thank you enough for your friendly advice!!!!!!

Scott

Traphillman #45984 12/21/09 04:12 PM
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A CD service that I have used at least 20 times for myself & others has been Kunaki. They have recently dropped their prices to $1.00 a cd, for up to 10, and then the price varies with the demand.

These are burnt, not replicated, but I and the folks that have used them have had no problems whatsoever. Full size CD case, full color printing on the Disk, Tray Card, and Insert, and a nice selection of services overall.

Hope this helps!


i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
Traphillman #45985 12/21/09 06:23 PM
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Thanks JSCPro40!

I will look into the Kunaki Company. I really appreciate the advice. Scott

Mac #45986 12/22/09 08:16 AM
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Hi Mac,

I got another reply recommending Kunaki as a CD publisher. Have you any idea as to their reputation? They ask you to download software to get registered and apparently only charge $1 a CD (but I don't know how many you have to order).

I went to Musician's Friend looking for the CD publisher you said you use and even sent Musician's Friend an e-mail requesting their help but I have not found anyone that way. Would you give me the name or a link to the CD publisher you are using?

Will my new 64-bit Sony with a Vista OS produce a quality master - or is it better to use the PG Music CD-maker set-up OR should I buy some stand alone product to make a good quality master. I plan to record in my basement - probably running the mixer out put directly into whatever I use to produce the master, but - of course - I have never done it and am completely ignorant about the process.

I have had three people suggest that a hardware midi player is much better and more reliable than using the headphones jack output, but based on your recommendation I am still going to try it soon. Have you had any cracking or other electrical interference or sound drop out problems on any of your jobs just using the headphone jack output to your board? And what driver and sound plug in do you use in the PG programs to play both MIDI and audio at the same time out of the headphones jack?

Thanks. I hope you are all ready for Christmas and didn't get too much snow. We got about 14" on our land and were snowed in for a day. Regards, Scott

Traphillman #45987 12/22/09 08:31 AM
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I have never dealt with Kunaki. Doesn't mean anything either way that I haven't, though.

CD burning and replication bidness has become a cottage industry.

Just be a careful shopper and get those recommendations and give it a go.

I never order a huge amount anyway, preferring to purchase as-needed or maybe a wee bit more at a time.

That way, should quality level start to fall off or anything like that, I can switch to another duplication service (haven't had to do so but...) and all I'm out is the initial toolup fee.

--Mac

Mac #45988 12/22/09 08:52 AM
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Thanks, Mac! I would love to see your ideas on the other questions I posed in the last msg when you have time. Happy Holidays! Scott

zokk #45989 12/26/09 10:56 AM
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Hi, Smokey!

I thought you might like to know that I have created my own Playlist Folders in My Music. I created several, but one Master with all the songs I currently take to a job (about 500). I arranged them in the order they appear in my song/fake book. I did this by first saving all the finished files to a new folder. I then renamed each of them by adding a number in front of the file name, e.g., 0001 for the first song in my song book - Angel Flying Too Close to the Ground, etc. My song book is not strickly in alphabetical order. Files with extra solo verses (that I use when people are dancing) start with the number 3001. My original songs start with 5001.

I set my Real Band to always open in the last used folder. When I start a job I open the Master Playlist folder, load the song, and play. After the song is over, I click open and I am back in the Master Playlist folder and ready to select the next file - from anywhere within the folder. Of course the song doesn't start until I hit the space bar so I have the option of talking to the people before I start the next song and the whole selection process is almost as fast as the Cakewalk Pro Playlist function - especially since with Cakewalk's Playlist you can only have a max of 128 songs in a single playlist.

It was a lot of work to set up. With 500 songs it took me part of three or four days. I also later had to go back and reset some bank changes for some unknown reason. But I only had six songs for that step.

Someone suggested the new features in the Conductor function were helpful in setting up a playlist but I have not had time to check it out yet. What I have done seems to work fine so far. Of course I have back-up files where each song is still listed alphabetically with the original file names.

My wife and I honey-mooned in St. Thomas, Frenchmen's Reef, in 1985. I suppose the 14th hardest working band on St. Thomas knows all the places to play!

Have a great New Year! Regards, Scott

Mac #45990 12/26/09 11:02 AM
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Hi Mac,

I thought you would like to know that I finally got my new computer set up and was able to use the TTS-1 synth to play great sounds through my headphones jack into my mixer and across my stage speakers. I turned off my wireless connection first, as someone suggested on one of the forums, and it sounds just great!

I have an important audition coming up after the holidays and I plan to use this set-up, just as you advised.

I hope you had a great Christmas. Happy New Year! Scott

Traphillman #45991 01/03/10 05:35 PM
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Happy New Year right back at you Scott,
Honey mooned in St Thomas ? I knew there was a connection. My girlfriend and I came here in 1979 and honey mooned in St John in 1980 ( when we finally got time off our jobs, it was kind of a crazy time). We are still hanging out, still crazy, just a little different crazy, Bizness, home ownership, life in the new century ( 10 years old already, sheesh) not to mention my obsession with music.
I think I was a little confused as to what you were using as a list. I have Master song file and then build song lists with Virtual Jukebox, found under tools in cakewalk I don't know if they still used it with Cakewalk Pro Audio I stopped at Cakewalk 9. It seems that if you had earlier versions of CW Virtual Jukebox traveled along with up grades.
I have done the list thing but i prefer setting up 20 songs or so in a set. We do 3, 45-50 minute sets at a gig and I go from quieter (dinner) to more lively sets. With VJB you can drag from File into list which makes it fast to build a set and now I have a bunch of sets in setlist folder so I can pull them up.
I think I said before it's a great tool but you cannot use virtual instruments, its either straight out midi to sound module or audio ( plays wav files ).
Have you tried this ?
All the best
Smokey
We know all the best and the rest of the places to play.......................


hp envy I5 6 gigs ram 2012.5 biab sonar x2 in studio
2 Blue Shoes Band 14th
hardest working band in St Thomas"
zokk #45992 01/04/10 08:02 AM
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Hi, Smokey,

Yes, we honeymooned in St. Thomas in February 1985. We got married in Nov 84 and then went to St. Thomas in Feb 85 and got married again! Ha! My wife has been after me to go back but after we both retired we bought 40 acres in North Carolina and it is almost impossible to leave the dogs, cats, chickens, and guineas for more than part of a day! So my wife will drive to her home in Maryland or to visit her sister in Florida once in a while and I babysit the animals.

I guess I was not clear about my set-up. I have my music on three different computers now. I have a PC with Windows XP and VSC3 where I have done all the work on the midi files others make and my own from BIAB and PT for years. I then transfer the files via floppy to an old lap top with Windows 98, Cakewalk 3, and VSC, which I use on stage through a SD-20 sound module because I love the play list function in Cakewalk 3. I can have up to 128 songs in a playlist. I have several main lengthy play lists and then some short ones I've made up for individual jobs.

Now, finally, I have decided to incorporate audio. So I bought a high-speed, new laptop and BIAB 2010/RB. I have had nothing but trouble with the laptop. Sony put a new mother board in it ten days after I bought it. I upgraded to Windows 7 because I got a free upgrade from the Vista 64-bit it came with. The Windows 7 upgrade disk came fully equipped with three viruses and I lost all my music and some of my programs before getting it all corrected.

I got Music Creator 5 in order to get the TTS-1 virtual synth that everyone is raving about. It has awesome sound and I loved it until I started playing through the 500+ songs in my play lists and discovered that something, apparently the TTS, was causing strange problems - like tracks set for a guitar part sounding like a drum when played, with individual notes sounding like a piano when you use the transmit button to sound them in the events list. Kent, from PG Music, is helping me work on that problem now.

I have also found that when the pitch bend entries in a file do not end with a "0" I often get a high-pitched sound, or other problem, at the start of the subsequently loaded file - like a hung note. But there is no hung note in the file. When I go back to the previous file I usually find a pitch bend string that does not have a "0" entry at the end. I add the pitch bend "0" entry at the end of the last pitch bend on each instrument and a controller 64 "0" entry and the subsequent file's sound usually disappears. I don't know for sure what it is but it seems like the TTS sounds are so intense they have unexpected effects. I seem to recall, years ago, having similar problems when files did not have a cc 64 "o" entry at their end and beginning.

The master play list I made in the new computer has all 500+ songs I take to a job in a single play list/folder - all in the same order they appear in my song book - because I renamed the files with numbers at the beginning starting with 0001. I can go from one to the next with Shift+F8 in Real Band. Or I can jump to any of them by clicking 'Open" and then the file name. It seems to work very well since I like to do requests whenever I have the music. But with the "TTS" problems we are working on I have not had the confidence to take the new laptop to a job yet.

It is 11 degrees here this morning and I sure wish I was in the islands!

My e-mail is traphillman@charter.net if you want to by pass the forum with any personal communications.

Stay cool! Regards, Scott

Traphillman #45993 01/04/10 08:18 AM
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Smokey,

On a strictly technical note, you asked me if I have tried just playing .wav files. I have not. I am just learning about audio-.wav and the like. I thought I read that anytime the PG programs opened a midi file they also opened a .wav file.

If I set my midi output to an ASIO driver (which I never have tried) and unclick the box for the virtual sounds, then open a strictly midi file, will the ASIO driver play the midi file? If so, does it need to go through my sound module or can it just go straight into one of my mixer channels?

Right now I am running the TTS sounds out of my computer headphones jack into my mixer channels and I love the sounds. Will the ASIO driver produce a similar result with midi or midi+audio or midi+.wav sounds?

Thanks, Scott

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Quote:

Why not a separate program designed around just the features needed for Live Performance of the files?

Lean and mean, it wouldn't need to address all the extraneous Recording features and be dedicated to the required task.

I should think that this would be your ultimate answer. It also seems to me that pgmusic development already has all the core engines for the task, but its never an easy job to roll out a new one. With enough interest to justify it, they just might consider that, though. A program designed around intelligently handling the files you've made with other pgmusic products in performance with all the bells and whistles you want. And only those bells and whistles.

I'd even be willing to bet that a websearch just might turn up some things already out there, but I'm not a betting man.



--Mac




One thing that PT does well is assign MIDI tracks to ports, and it allows multiple ports. This allows it to be a great control program for MIDI-implimented efx devices, guitar multi-efx pedals, DMX lighting---whatever. The jukebox feature is TOO textbased to match the other capabilities of PT on the live stage. Try inserting a song called during another song---the stuff that really happens live. TOO texbased.

Paj
8^)

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Band-in-a-Box 2024 for Mac includes over 50 new features!

Watch our Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® Boot Camp: Working with the Newest Features video, and follow along as we demonstrate how to create a new song from scratch using some of the major new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac®, like the Chord Progression Builder, the new MultiPicker Library Window, and the new Tracks Window!

Watch: Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® Boot Camp: Working with the Newest Features

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® Videos: One-Stop Shopping!

With the release of Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac®, we're adding new videos to our YouTube channel. We'll also post them here when they are published so that you can easily find all of our Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® videos in one place!

The Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac videos released as-of June 28, 2024 are:

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® - Everything you need to know in under 8 minutes!

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® - The New Tracks Window Explained

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® - RealCombos Booster PAK Styles Demo

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® - 49-PAK Overview

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Mac® - 222 New RealTracks Overview

XPro & Xtra Styles Sets On Sale Until July 31st!

Save up-to 40% when you purchase XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs before July 31, 2024!

The most recent XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2023 or higher include additional Styles for Band-in-a-Box® that work seamlessly with your project. We offer XPro Styles PAKs that work with ANY Band-in-a-Box® package, and Xtra Styles PAKs for UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile users!

We recently released a combined total of 300 new Styles in XPro Styles PAK 6 and Xtra Styles PAK 17!

Each PAK can be purchased for $29: Order XPro Styles PAKs | Order Xtra Styles PAKs

The 100 new styles added with XPro Styles PAK 6 include 25 Rock & Pop, 25 Jazz, 25 Country, and 25 Progressive Rock! These add styles like funky soul jazz, uplifting pop-rock, 12-8 country ballads, hard and heavy progressive rock, '70s funk, dubby reggae jams, driving country rock, synth-heavy prog rock, and many more! Video: XPro Styles PAK 6 Demos

Xtra Styles PAK 17 adds 200 new styles to any Band-in-a-Box 2023 UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile installation! You'll find 50 each for Rock & Pop, Jazz, and Country. What about the remaining 50? We've added them with a new category: World 1! In Xtra Styles PAK 17, you'll find styles like: laid-back pop country, mellow smooth jazz, '80s new wave, Caribbean reggae, '90s alternative pop, modern jazz fusion, funky Texas blues, Afro-Cuban grooves, and even mariachi-infused Motown... and more! Video: Xtra Styles PAK 14 Demos

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