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FWIW - I think we have to stop worrying about how people currently use BiaB. Some of the outstanding suggestions along with accompanying mock-ups are radical changes from the current GUI. If we keep worrying about the current GUI/workflow then nothing will change. We all are capable of change. IMHO if this is going to happen lets do it right the first time.
That is just my opinion and other may not agree with me. I absolutely agree. The program really (and I mean, really) needs a complete GUI redesign. This has been discussed here extensively, at least for the last ten / fifteen years.
Last edited by Cerio; 01/23/25 03:12 PM.
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......................................
Yes, I was trying to make it less intrusive and less of a change for people used to using the cord track. That is why I suggested the grid only shows up when entering in chords for a particular bar. I also think 1/8th is enough granularity. FWIW - I think we have to stop worrying about how people currently use BiaB. Some of the outstanding suggestions along with accompanying mock-ups are radical changes from the current GUI. If we keep worrying about the current GUI/workflow then nothing will change. We all are capable of change. IMHO if this is going to happen lets do it right the first time. That is just my opinion and other may not agree with me. I would tend to agree however, to be clear, I would embark on a complete parallel rewrite including a new UI. I did it 3 times in a in a 30-year carrier and each was huge leap in UX. I have also watched and work with PGM for over a decade. They will take small steps and add things, but rarely will they replace something. My suggestions are all doable in 2025.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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FWIW - I think we have to stop worrying about how people currently use BiaB. Some of the outstanding suggestions along with accompanying mock-ups are radical changes from the current GUI. If we keep worrying about the current GUI/workflow then nothing will change. We all are capable of change. IMHO if this is going to happen lets do it right the first time.
That is just my opinion and other may not agree with me. I absolutely agree. The program really (and I mean, really) needs a complete GUI redesign. This has been discussed here extensively, at least for the last ten / fifteen years. Agree. +1 However, likely it will be a challenge to do it all overnight. Even big companies with very deep pockets do it in parts. I would rather see a few most supported big concepts done very well, and if successful (cheering crowd), continue the trend going forward, than see something mediocre done as a whole.
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Meanwhile back to what we agree upon.
1) Higher resolution for a bar.
2) Resolution that marches time signature.
3) Some way to easily enter chords up to 1/8 on the chord sheet.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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I think the changes in Chord Sheet are very important. You can directly refer to the most popular DAWs, such as STUDIO ONE, CUBASE. You can create a "Chord track", below is the instrument VST, PIANO ROLL, Audio track. After establishing the concept of chord track, we further refined the chord track. For example, it is more convenient to input content. It is changed into multiple small grids. We removed the micro chord function. I have never used micro chords. We directly subdivided each bar. I talked about this issue a few years ago. https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=744720#Post744720
Last edited by babymusic; 01/23/25 06:21 PM.
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Everything shows an unfolded view. What about multiple choruses, tags, repeats? Band-in-a-Box has humanizing selections that are invoked when these features are used.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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@MarioD,
Current users of BiaB, should really have no problem adjusting to the new GUI even if it is radically changed, and any new users should find it easier to use than it currently is.
There, will be a learning curve, and all good software has a learning curve.
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@MarioD,
Current users of BiaB, should really have no problem adjusting to the new GUI even if it is radically changed, and any new users should find it easier to use than it currently is.
There, will be a learning curve, and all good software has a learning curve. That was my point.
I got banned from Weight Watchers for dropping a bag of M&Ms on the floor.
It was the best game of Hungry Hippos I've ever seen!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Suggestion: Pure contextual menu for Chord Sheet. Simplifying it to just the chords, bars and progression improve the user workflow. ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=30080&filename=BB chord context.png) Everything else is a distraction and better belong somewhere else.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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......................................
Yes, I was trying to make it less intrusive and less of a change for people used to using the cord track. That is why I suggested the grid only shows up when entering in chords for a particular bar. I also think 1/8th is enough granularity. FWIW - I think we have to stop worrying about how people currently use BiaB. Some of the outstanding suggestions along with accompanying mock-ups are radical changes from the current GUI. If we keep worrying about the current GUI/workflow then nothing will change. We all are capable of change. IMHO if this is going to happen lets do it right the first time. That is just my opinion and other may not agree with me. My mockup was a radical change, compared to the original solution for micro chords. I like and agree with MarioD ideas as well.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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"Song Master Pro, is a beautiful example of how different views can be integrated in a single screen in a really intuitive way:"
"You can also move chords directly from the main screen, just by draggin them. Note that the chords will move accordingly to the snap setting, so it's possible to insert up to 16 chords per bar from here (no need to use commas, carets, or that counterintuitive "Micro chords" feature)"I saw Chord Sheet improvements in the Forum Tittle and I thought I would post about having the chord entry in the Tracks View and how you can zoom in to enter chords on any beat resolution without the comas and micro chords, BUT you did already, and not only that but this awesome looking and incredibly well designed GUI. RapidComposer would enter chords the same way depending on what the snap resolution was set to, drag and resize chords. I will have to go check this out ! thanks Cerio ! Why design all views independently, forcing the user to choose between the ‘Chords’ view OR the ‘Tracks’ view? Wouldn't be much better if we had a main screen where the user could simultaneously see all the most important views (chords, tracks, lyrics, sections, the whole song's structure...) and edit any of them from a single place? Take a look, for example, at Song Master Pro, is a beautiful example of how different views can be integrated in a single screen in a really intuitive way: ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=30014&filename=1 Main.png) First, you always have a view of the whole song structure, you can navigate to the different parts directly from there, and you can also zoom in/out directly from there: ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=30033&filename=2 Song.png) Then, you have different "Tracks" (Views) that you can show / hide as you wish. No need to see the "Sections" or the "Lyrics" track? No problem, just hide them: ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=30032&filename=Hide.gif) Want to use the mixer or any other tool? Just click on the tiny icons at the top right to show / hide the tools / browser panels: ![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=30031&filename=Panels.gif)
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I am partially color blind and can't tell many colors. In some threads I have to highlight some areas as I can't read them. Thus any color theme in BiaB must have the option to adjust or change any color.
I got banned from Weight Watchers for dropping a bag of M&Ms on the floor.
It was the best game of Hungry Hippos I've ever seen!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I am partially color blind and can't tell many colors. In some threads I have to highlight some areas as I can't read them. Thus any color theme in BiaB must have the option to adjust or change any color. Yes/+1.
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Summary of input on Chord Sheet:
OP: This thread is for suggestions regarding the Chord Sheet view.
This is for specific suggestions only, not general comments.
Text about Arrangement/Arranger Track:
Supporters: robertw, jpettit, Charlie
More granularity in Bars/match signature/Integrate Micro Chords:
Supporters: Matt Finley, jpettit, ~Rustyspoon#, MarioD
One Main Screen with Panels: (most popular in original UI Thread)
Supporters: robertw, Cerio, jpettit, Rustyspoon#,musocity
A bit OT: This challenges the need for a Track view and a Chord View
Editable Chords Track
Supporters: jpettit, babymusic, Cerio, musocity
A bit OT: This challenges the need for a Track view and a Chord View
Improved (clean to the context) and more context menus
Supporters: jpettit
A universal input.
If PGM really wants input form customer and want to know how popular the idea is the need to turn on voting capabilities in the Forum.
Tendency to divert from the OP and minimal customer input are common with just open-ended conversations.
Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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Improved (clean to the context) and more context menus
Supporters: jpettit
A universal input. +1000 to context menus, which are an essential to improve discoverability > ease of use > better user experience. https://www.uxpin.com/studio/blog/discoverability-in-ux/In Reaper, for example, right clicking on almost any element opens a menu with options about that element, so the user always know what is possible to do with that. Super simple, super intuitive and super effective: https://youtube.com/shorts/OKIASspvNgs?si=0MuBZOsp_l_sji9b
Last edited by Cerio; 02/05/25 11:45 AM.
Latest BIAB version, latest build.
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"In Reaper, for example, right clicking on almost any element opens a menu with options about that element, so the user always know what is possibler to do with that element. Super simple, super intuitive and super effective:
https://youtube.com/shorts/OKIASspvNgs?si=0MuBZOsp_l_sji9b
"I posted a video on [R*****] menus to give ideas but it just got deleted.
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Studio One (latest version), Win 11 23H2 , i9 -10940X 3.3 GHz, 32GB Mem, a 4K 40" monitor, PreSonus Studio Live III Console as interface/controller. secondarily test on Reaper, Cakewalk, and S1 on Surface Pro 3 Win 10 (latest versions).
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I posted a video on [R*****] menus to give ideas but it just got deleted. Reaper has one of the best, well thought, user interfaces I have ever seen. I remember very well, 15 years ago the day when, working in the middle of a production, I moved all my projects from cubase to reaper after installing the program and testing it just for a few minutes. After a couple of hours of use I felt way more comfortable with Reaper than after years and years of using Cubase, Logic or Protools. And the reason of that was simply because, despite having a zillion of features, everything I needed was exactly where I thought it should be, and everything worked exactly how I thought it should work.
Last edited by Cerio; 02/05/25 12:05 PM.
Latest BIAB version, latest build.
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In Reaper, for example, right clicking on almost any element opens a menu with options about that element, so the user always know what is possible to do with that. Super simple, super intuitive and super effective: Precisely that is done in an awful lot of software and it works well. If the software starts out with that philosophy, then it stays solid and consistent as it grows and evolves.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
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Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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"Reaper has one of the best, well thought, user interfaces I have ever seen....."
You can't improve Biab unless you study [R*****], I have spent so much time over the years posting things to make Biab/RB/Plugin better by showing examples in [R*****], whether it's Instant Gen Play Direct, Live Arranger or so many other things.
The trouble is so many like to criticize and are offended with me posting all this info as they have not or will not try things so remain in the past. This is like the numero uno thing that keeps these products way behind other software. It's so good to see those here that understand and don't knock or delete. For me to take on the establishment has by no means been an easy thing.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
The 2025 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2025 49-PAK!
Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
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