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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196 |
There have been a few individuals expressing the opinion that there needs to be a “rethink” about BIAB or even a “rewrite”. And it seems to me therefore trying to make BIAB into something it was never designed for. I’d say the majority of users in this forum are quite happy with the program. I certainly am and don’t care what the interface looks like – its fine the way it is. I’ve used it for many years now and it does exactly what I want it to do. Generate without much fuss an amazing skeletal framework of backing instruments which I load into SONAR 8 in my studio and from there I can add my East-West sample libraries to generate anywhere from a full 60 piece orchestra, to a full choral or rock assembly or just about any genre.
Here’s my advice to those complaining - Use BIAB in the way it was meant to be used as a phenomenal piece of engineering to generate backings in several clicks instead of spending hours doing it from scratch. Experiment what works and doesn’t work. With patience (I cannot emphasize this enough – learn to walk before you can run) you’ll finally achieve a very satisfying result. If you want more you’ll have to then add sample libraries as I have into a DAW to extend BIAB to even greater heights.
And here’s my advice and wish to Pgmusic - stick with the knitting lads and concentrate on giving us even more Real Tracks with greater variety instead of wasting too much time on trying to gild the lily.
SALISBURY:
Therefore, to be possess'd with double pomp,
To guard a title that was rich before,
To gild refined gold, to paint the lily,
To throw a perfume on the violet,
To smooth the ice, or add another hue
Unto the rainbow, or with taper-light
To seek the beauteous eye of heaven to garnish,
Is wasteful and ridiculous excess.
Shakespeare's King John,
Last edited by FrankK; 06/03/11 01:27 PM.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179 |
I agree with most of that ... except the 'smooth the ice' part. Up here we skate on it and play hockey on it; smooth is good!  I see what you mean though. Don't wreck a beautiful thing (to many) trying to please everybody. It's a tough decision for a company; continue to excel at what they do, or become more 'mainstream' to gain volume. .. if only there were a program that could do what BiaB does AND act like a DAW .. so users could do both
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,504
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I agree also .... but to a point. I do understand what some of the other want, and have debated this waaaay to much. I am all for growth and progress, but think while Biab get gentle growth, and refinement. Maybe a mixer and a synth rack to satisfy those who want to use more than one synth, and want to have a tad more control over levels.
It is time for Rb and PT to take off and fullfill what folks want. Take Rb to the next level, add volume envelopes, refine midi, and audio editing a bit more, finish the VSTi coding so it uses all VSTis, even the ones with time adjsutment like jamstix, and rework the ASIO implimentation a bit more, so that ASIO is more usable than WDM. Make it so folks think long and hard before draging files to Cubase, Reaper, Sonar, whatever. It really is not that far away.
Last edited by Robh; 06/03/11 09:01 AM.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 507
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 507 |
Quote:
.....to paint the lily,
.....
Is wasteful and ridiculous excess.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." -Hamlet
I'm so glad that, generally speaking, PGMusic's reach exceeds its grasp. ("...or what's a heaven for." -Browning)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,333
Veteran
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Veteran
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And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remember'd;
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition:
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
"What we have we have, and it is good,
We shall rejoice in it anon,
And view our songs as they might be,
The dew from heaven,
And thus the gentle unknown drops
We all see in the morn,
Strains from some great scene,
At once silent and still,
Swelling and full,
Like the gentle dew from heaven,
Loved and as loved,
In vast green fields.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,026
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Joined: Jan 2011
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I would like more real tracks as well ,I already have several DAW'S to mix with . There are some of free DAW's if you don't have them . I love real tracks ,but feel like when I bought biab 2004 and needed the mega pack a week later. Amazing software as is ,just need more of it !
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
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Joined: Apr 2010
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As a new user, I would have to agree with the OP. BIAB is an excellent program, and does what it does quite well. Trying to compete with dedicated, established DAW's like Cubase or Sonar would probably detract from development of more viable features (i.e. more tracks/styles, better ASIO support).
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 589
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 589 |
I guess deep down most users would like certain things added to BIAB I do.. my wish is more real tracks and more guitar solos.But looking back PG has added more things as it evolved so I would say be patient unless that is you are in your late 90,s Frank
AMD Athlon 7550 dual core
processor 2.51 ghz
1 87 gb ram
windows 7 Ultimate
yamaha rev 500 effects
tacam DP-24 DAW
Samson Resolv NF monitors
Yamaha PSR-620 Keyboard
Fender semi accoustic guitar
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196 |
Quote:
.. if only there were a program that could do what BiaB does AND act like a DAW .. so users could do both
So are you saying rharv that REALBAND doesn’t fill the gap for you ?
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179 |
No, I meant that was exactly what it does.
My sarcasm can be missed at times if you don't know me. I think Realband can get the job done 99% of the time for most users. It does for me. Way more powerful than most users realize.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179
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Quote:
Take Rb to the next level, add volume envelopes, refine midi, and audio editing a bit more
What do you feel is missing?
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,276
Veteran
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,276 |
Quote:
No, I meant that was exactly what it does.
My sarcasm can be missed at times if you don't know me.
I caught the tounge-in-cheek immediately. I guess I know ya... 
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,058
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
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With all the advice Rharv has given as a cheerleader for RealBand, it was pretty clear to many regulars on the forum, and he even gave a gracious clarification in case it wasn't. He's the man.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2009
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Well my 2 cents worth is that PG hardly ever bring out or redesign's a program. They just "add pieces on" Probably makes things a lot easier in the coding department
Nothing wrong in that I think except maybe in the programming department and especially in the end user one, where I would think (even though I'm not a code wrtiter) this is responsible for all the time lags in realband where biab can do certain common features a lot quicker than RB can.
eg opening the style picker. I would also have expected a quick preview of styles in the realband stylepicker by now but no such joy. I have added it to the wishlist though but not expecting any miracles.
That saying both programs are 2 of my favourites.
musiclover
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Posts: 8,504
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I agree with Rharv that RB is far more powerful than most folks give it credit for, there are not as many missing pieces as one might think. It has a ton of Midi tool, maybe not crazy midi filters and stuff that a Sonar and or Reaper have, but it is very usable. It's audio editing is really quite good you can double click and open the audio editor, or cut and paste right in the track in tracks view. You have to setup Reaper for that with a pile of mouse modifiers.
What RB needs to be a very solid contender is simple:
1. Finish the VSTi coding so that timing sensitive plugs work like Jamstix and such
2. Update the ASIO so that it is as useful as WDM
3. Add an automation/envelope system like cakewalk with nodes and such that can be added to control volume, panning and effects.
4. tidy up the coding so that some of the aforementioned lagging is cleaned up.
5. Make it have more than 48 tracks
Do this and you have a solid full featured product. It already does things the others do not do.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,122
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,122 |
Would I like a bicycle? Will it get me where I want to go with a minimum of fuss? A light would be nice for night riding. Maybe a basket. A luggage rack on back? Mmmmmm okay. How about a shock fork, well if ya gotta real need I guess. How about 3 speeds, or 7 or 10, heck lets make it 18 or 21. We can upgrade the tires and saddle and add a horn or a bell. Wait what about a three wheeler? no wait that would be a tricycle. How about one of those peddle carriages that seat four with the fringe on top? Hmmm that's not really a bicycle either. If you really want to get there faster why not a motorcycle? But then again if I want a motorcycle, what am I doing at a bicycle shop? Because what I really wanted to begin with was a bicycle for not too much money, that does what I need it to do and doesn't pretend to meet every transportation need that I may have for the rest of my life. Is this not the bicycle forum? Oh well, just apply it to BIAB and there ya go. Rob
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,706
Veteran
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Veteran
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Posts: 6,706 |
Quote:
With all the advice Rharv has given as a cheerleader for RealBand, it was pretty clear to many regulars on the forum, and he even gave a gracious clarification in case it wasn't. He's the man.
Yes but it's still his fault!
Later,
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 378
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 378 |
"You have to setup Reaper for that with a pile of mouse modifiers"
Let's keep it real. That is not necessary in reaper for editing. I do all my editing with traditional mouse usage.
I'm a real track user exclusively at the moment. When it comes to biab, I believe PG did a great thing with elastique. Although I don't have 2011, I do use elastique in reaper and it is very powerful. I'm quite certain it serves real tracks very well in biab 2011. So that's a huge development for biab. The only other thing I'd appreciate, for someone like me who uses biab merely for chart writing and having real tracks follow that chart, is either a smarter engine or a way to choose fills and sections manually as well. The auto generation of real tracks can be hit or miss when it comes to giving you exactly, or close to what you're looking for. And although I like auto generation and think it's an integral part of what biab offers with real tracks, manual choice for advanced users let's say, would be great as well. It would cut down on editing after the fact and give the user that much more control in a biab session. That's a tall order. For drums it should be simple enough. For other instruments, that's quite a challenge to put together and organize. But for me, I'd like a further option beyond the 'pot luck' of auto generation. Or like I said, a more refined and intellegent brain assembling real track parts behind the scenes- I mean the software, not the people lol!
As for real band, only a few things make an otherwise not bad daw fall short for me. Latency for all movements within the program, lack of envelope automation, and the lack of typical cursor behavior, and seriously long waits to save while in progress. I view real band as a work in progress and maybe the vision will never be to make it a serious contender to the majors. I don't care really. It does what I need it to do and I'm fine with that. I've always been one to use different tools for their strengths, so I have no problem software hopping, and even hardware hopping, to get the jobs done.
Dan
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 196 |
Quote:
With all the advice Rharv has given as a cheerleader for RealBand, it was pretty clear to many regulars on the forum, and he even gave a gracious clarification in case it wasn't. He's the man.
So Matt why do you specifically use SONAR (as I do) instead of Realband. ?
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,058
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Easy: because I learned SONAR years before RealBand was available. I tend to stay with tools I know well. As a comp sci prof, I had to work with a lot of software, and there's enough to remember without adding to the task. If I were starting now, the decision might be different.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
The 2025 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2025 49-PAK!
Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
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