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Hope I'm just missing something here,but. This is my goal. I want to control program changes on my VSTi while it is inserted into an audio track of Realband. Specifically- I open am audio track, insert Amplitube 3(which allows program changes though MDI)and I can find no way to change the programs from inside the track. I can do this easily in Cubase 6, the patch list comes up in the menu and I can change them at will, so I know it CAN be done. I.ve tried also creating a MIDI track as a "control" track, but it seems I cannot "insert" Amplitube 3 (or probably any other "audio" type VSTi) into a MIDI track. That makes sense, but had to try. I've also tried controlling the VSTi "externally". which is the way I control my DMX lighting and vocalist, but no joy controlling Amplitube, GR4,Pod Farm,etc that way. (although it SHOULD) Searched the forums and could find no help, hoping someone can chime in to let me know how or if it even feasable in Realband. I'll keep pecking away at ideas and let you know what else I find. This to me would seem to be a very basic feature. thanks for any help 
Last edited by bob1474; 08/09/11 04:32 AM.
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Little triangle below track # ,edit dxi/vsti ? Maybe control midi in piano roll >view edit > program ? Audio uses piano roll too for fade ,pan ,aux sends. Hope this helps ,not sure .
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I'm going to guess a little here. I have AT3 it's fairly complex in it's midi setup and the manual is real vague. The guess comes from the fact that RealBand does not support advanced VSTs so do not think it would controll the AT3. If it wasn't so complex i'd give it a whirl. I will try to find out the answer though as to whether it will or won't. That way if it does then you can at least play around and see.
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Chiming in here just to watch for replies - I have a similar need - want to control 'wah' via automation and/or midi.
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Quote:
Specifically- I open am audio track, insert Amplitube 3(which allows program changes though MDI)and I can find no way to change the programs from inside the track.
If I'm understanding you, can't you access whatever you want from the plug-in interface when you click on it in the plug-in window (hit the little triangle 'Edit DXi')? I use Sampletank for example and it has all kinds of various effect controls on the screen. I can change those all I want and those settings are saved by hitting "save as preset".
Are you talking about changing presets live via midi while the song is playing? I don't know about that one, never looked into it.
Bob
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Here's how I work around that issue. It may be doable and I just don't know how .. but,
I copy the different sections to new tracks and use the desired preset(s) for that track. There is probably a way to do this, but I'm drawing a blank right now. Maybe it was possible using MIDI Yoke or some other faux MIDI port. In the back of my mind I think I remember a way, but found it easier to just put the deired sections on seperate tracks.
If you're changing the FX sound, might as well have full control. By that I mean if the new (different) effected section is on a different track, I now have the option to really make that track how I want it by using 3 other effects too (on its own track, it gets its own set of 4 plugins). So I accepted the adjustment in method and kept on tracking.
That may not have been clear, so methodology is -
Set up first section effects.
Cut/Paste second section to new track, set up effects
Same for the rest of the sections. Of course, if first section repeats just leave it, copy any second sections parts to the second section track, etc. Simple and efficient, and offers more options.
Last edited by rharv; 08/10/11 06:06 PM.
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Yes he wants to control the VST in real time with midi data from a track. The problem here is that I want to find out from Peter or someone if this is even possible. AT3 has a VERY complex MIDI setup and the manual is very vague even to me. I just don't have the time right now to figure out AT3 only to find that it can't be done with RB. If I find out it can then I'll play around with AT3 midi setup.
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With other DAW software, it's very easy to do this with automation curves. Any control in the plugin that has MIDI controllability is shown in a list - for example, the tone controls in amp settings in AT. You pick that control for automation and you get a 'curve' that you can modify throughout the length of the track, just by modifying the curve. Automation curve controls are available in the cheapest to most expensive DAW software on the planet.
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I'm not real experienced at this aspect but I did do some experimenting. I first used MIDI OX & MIDI YOKE. I told one of the controls in AT3 to learn. I sent CC7 to it and it learned fine. This is with the standalone version of AT3.
I then opened RB and using the event list I created some CC#7 changes on a midi track. If I clicked on transmit in the Event list AT would change accordingly. If I played the track nothing happened.
As far as using the VST version I could get nothing to happen.
May be just my understanding or lack there of of how to set up AT3.
Scott if you tell me how you set AT3 up as an automated VST maybe I can get it to work. Just realized that if you have AT3 you must have tried it yourself with the same results.
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Per Peter it can't be done.
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John,
First of all, I'm not using PTPA.
Second, I'm not using MIDI - but rather automation controls.
I'm doing this in Tracktion. In Tracktion, with any plugin - if that plugin has automatable controls - they are immediately visible to Tracktion when you instantiate the plugin on a midi or audio track.
Tracktion has a little 'A' on each track and when you click it, you can see all of the controls for the track and the plugins for that track. Sometimes, this list is HUGE for one particular plugin. I don't have AT3, but rather AT1. From memory, I know I can control the gain settings, the overdrive amount, the tone controls, I believe the amp type and cabinet type, reverb setting, etc. with automation controls.
There MAY be Midi CC values assigned to these - I'm not sure - I don't really end up with a need for doing Midi CC because I can do it all with automation control curves.
Automation control is something that's been fairly standard in even the least expensive DAW software for the last 8-10 years at least. You really need it for stuff like this. PG better get it in place (if it isn't) because more and more users are going to expect it. It's one of the reasons I quit using and updating PTPA/RB. Expected plugin functional support gets farther and farther behind.
I'm still hoping that will turn around - there are features that I do miss (notation for example), but they haven't been as big as what I use on every single song I do. I do automation in every song, whether it's fader settings, reverb sends, filtering, VST/VSTi automation, you name it. It's just part of the mixing activity for me now.
I do agree with rharv that if it's simple preset change through the song, then there are other easier ways to control this - just set up multiple instances on different tracks and set the different song sections on the different tracks, with the different presets enabled.
Like I said, the only stuff I do with automation as it pertains to guitar amp/signal simulation is filter kind of stuff: Wah, overall filter bandwidth and resonance automation; sometimes reverb send stuff (like making it sound like I'm walking away from the amp at the end of a song by adjusting the wet/dry mix for reverb as a faded situation).
-Scott
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Yea I played with AT3 in Sonar using the normal automation curves as you say. The new AT3 can also be controlled via MIDI. Not that difficult if your using the standalone and some sort of HW midi controller or even a software controller. As far as using MIDI to control the plug as a VST in the manual all it says is "talk to your DAW people. Paraphrased. That I did with no luck. May be a way.RB & PT don't support automation except of there on mixer controls.
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Thanks everyone for all the input. I've had my head buried in this trying to come up with a solution and have found exactly what I wanted to accomplish. Yes, my main goal was to process program control changes to my VSTi (namely Guitar rig 4) so it would change programs in a a "live" situation so I wouldn't have the distraction of stomping pedals. Really did not care if I accomplished this through the VSTi as an insert or external. Got hold of NI tech support and found the perfect solution.(I guess GR4 is a little teste with what one wouold call "normal" MIDI input) They suggested a little MIDI program called LOOPBe. (free on the net). It creates a virtual MIDI connection between programs. Works like a charm. I assign a MIDI track in Realband, routed to LOOPBe out, use my GR4 as a standalone, using LOOPBe as the MIDI input. I can now change presets at will. I've been using the event editor to enter the program changes I want when I want them. Much joy.
So this for me is working great- I can now cotrol my DMX lighting, Guitar rack, and I've just aquired the new Digitech VL3D vocalist, which is completley controllable through MIDI. So now, after programming everything, I have absolutely NO pedals or settings to change during performance-lights, guitar sounds (keyboard is a no brainer), vocal harmonies, all done through MIDI control-now a robot to actually do the gig, but that would take ALL the fun out of it.
I really do appreciate the help and wanted to share my findings with all.
SOOOO-is it possible to turn the internal effects on and off during plyback through MIDI commands? I would think one couild use CC commands, but there is no indication of this in the help files. Gues one could just use mixer automation in a pinch (?)
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Quote:
Thanks everyone for all the input. I've had my head buried in this trying to come up with a solution and have found exactly what I wanted to accomplish. Yes, my main goal was to process program control changes to my VSTi (namely Guitar rig 4) so it would change programs in a a "live" situation so I wouldn't have the distraction of stomping pedals. Really did not care if I accomplished this through the VSTi as an insert or external. Got hold of NI tech support and found the perfect solution.(I guess GR4 is a little teste with what one wouold call "normal" MIDI input) They suggested a little MIDI program called LOOPBe. (free on the net). It creates a virtual MIDI connection between programs. Works like a charm. I assign a MIDI track in Realband, routed to LOOPBe out, use my GR4 as a standalone, using LOOPBe as the MIDI input. I can now change presets at will. I've been using the event editor to enter the program changes I want when I want them. Much joy.
So this for me is working great- I can now cotrol my DMX lighting, Guitar rack, and I've just aquired the new Digitech VL3D vocalist, which is completley controllable through MIDI. So now, after programming everything, I have absolutely NO pedals or settings to change during performance-lights, guitar sounds (keyboard is a no brainer), vocal harmonies, all done through MIDI control-now a robot to actually do the gig, but that would take ALL the fun out of it.
I really do appreciate the help and wanted to share my findings with all.
SOOOO-is it possible to turn the internal effects on and off during plyback through MIDI commands? I would think one couild use CC commands, but there is no indication of this in the help files. Gues one could just use mixer automation in a pinch (?)
You said you wanted to control it while inserted into a track. If you had told me the right, using the standalone, info I would have told you how. I already do this. program and CC changes on a track. I use MIDIYoke. It's better.
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Silvertones-thanks for the reply-sorry I wasn't clear enough, just wondered which method would be most workable. I'll give MIDIyoke a try later on. Also- running live vocals through a mono audio track using on-board dx insert effects. any way to control these effects through MIDI commands (mainly on-off function) ?
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Unfortunately RB does not support any advanced DXi/VSTi features. This has been a wish list item.
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