|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33
Enthusiast
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33 |
Hello;
I am looking into purchasing new P.A. speakers and I am looking for advice. I would like speakers with 12” woofers to be used for vocals and BIAB background tracks.
Currently, I have an older pair of Yorkville Pulse PL12’s. 150w. They have served my needs but are in need of repair. I like the fact that they are not too heavy.
Any ideas on what might be a good unpowered replacement? Typically, I’m filling a space not bigger than 50’ x 50’.
Secondary Question:
The PL12’s sound fine (IMHO) for vocals and e.g. acoustic guitar but seem thin when playing recorded music. Even when paired with a sub, the PL12’s sound a bit hollow for pre-recorded music.
I’ve experimented with some newer speakers and the newer speakers seem to have much more midrange. They sound “fuller” when playing recorded music but don’t seem to have as much definition for vocals.
I am wondering if newer speakers are tailored more towards the midrange or if older speakers lose their midrange over time.
Thanks in advance for your ideas.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
Plenty of choices, some just OK, some better, and some excellent. The most salient question would be - what is your budget?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33 |
Up to $1000 for the pair. Not sure that I can justify a Bose system given the amount that I play. Currently, I've been considering the Yorkville NX35. http://www.yorkville.com/loudspeakers/nx/product/nx35/I've been told to save money and buy them used from a music store. Not sure if that is a good idea or not. Thanks for the time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
Wattage of your power amp at 8 ohms - program and peak?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,738
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,738 |
First question.... when you say the PL12's sound thin on pre-recorded music .... are you talking about commercial CD's from the major artists or are you talking about YOUR pre-recorded musical tracks? Note: I had never heard of Yorkville until now, and I have been playing music since the 70's. Along the way, I discovered that many of the off brands I encountered were of lesser quality and the sound suffered as a consequence. One band I was in even had a custom sound reinforcement shop build some cabinets for us. What a waste of money that was. They worked OK for mid cabs but not for anything else. When you say they are in need of repair...what does that mean? Bad speakers? Cosmetic repairs? Sometimes it's best to sell them to startup bands strapped for cash and go buy some better gear. Depending on how old the technology in them is, it may well be worth looking into some new self contained and powered speakers. I looked them up and saw some on E-bay..... I'd personally recommend selling and moving on. In a small combo or solo performer situation it's worth the time to make the gear as compact and easy to move as possible. I'm seeing a number of smaller performers using the powered speakers and sub combo. Back in the day it used to be huge speakers, racks of amps, crossovers and then spending lots of time not only setting up gear but even more time to get the crossovers set properly for sub, mids, and highs so that the music didn't sound hollow or out of balance in any way. If I were to get back into playing live now, I would probably opt for something like this>>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/behringer-eurolive-b215d-active-pa-speaker-system#productDetail This particular speaker system includes everything in one package. Matched amp to the speaker, crossover, and the enclosure. And certainly leaves some money in the $1000 budget you mentioned for other accessories. I see quite a few churches using this kind of speaker (even this particular brand) in their sanctuaries due to the quality of the sound and the self-contained aspect of the speaker. A pair of these matched with a self powered sub should rock any place you are playing and with the sub, you're probably right around that budget number.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 07/20/14 05:34 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33 |
I have a 300 watt Fender power amp; I'm guessing that means around 100 watts per side with a peak of 150 per side.
Having said that, we never have to push the amp to fill our venues.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33 |
I find that commercial CDs are the ones that sound thin on these speakers.
I can see the advantages of self-powered speakers but I'm not sure if they are for me. If I understand correctly, I would have to run both power and speaker cables to these bins (as opposed to just speaker cables) and if one dies at a gig you're in more trouble because you can't just flip around an unpowered monitor and use it as a main to get through the night. Yes?
Thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
I have a 300 watt Fender power amp; I'm guessing that means around 100 watts per side with a peak of 150 per side.
Having said that, we never have to push the amp to fill our venues.
300 watts really isn't much juice. Most newer passives are rated higher than 100 watts. Might be time to upgrade the amp. You might also want to check out the Yamaha CM-12V. They are billed as monitors, but they do well as small mains, and have pole mounts. They are rated for 350 watts, but if you don't clip them, you should be OK. If you want a lot of pro advice, you could register and post this question on the PSW site. Those guys are all pro SR guys, and are current on all of the newest gear. http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.phpp.s. I would avoid anything that has "Behringer" on it. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,738
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,738 |
I find that commercial CDs are the ones that sound thin on these speakers.
I can see the advantages of self-powered speakers but I'm not sure if they are for me. If I understand correctly, I would have to run both power and speaker cables to these bins (as opposed to just speaker cables) and if one dies at a gig you're in more trouble because you can't just flip around an unpowered monitor and use it as a main to get through the night. Yes?
Thanks.
If the commercial CD's sound thin, I would suspect that the speakers themselves are to blame, or perhaps the EQ settings. I can think of a number of things that could cause that. One immediate thing would be that the home-spun tracks are EQ'd wrong and are bass and mid heavy resulting in properly EQ'd commercial projects to sound weak by comparison. Gear failure on a gig. Been there many times. Had main amps quit, monitors, guitar amps literally burn up, and of course, an exploding flashpot whose concussion wave literally ripped speaker cones from their baskets on the second set of the night. Things can and will happen on a gig. You simply find a way to cope. Run the entire system on one amp (in our case) or turn the monitors toward the audience or turn the PA stack so the band can hear something. We lost half our lights at one club when the roadies plugged into the club's 240v outlet without checking the actual voltage. There was a 208 high leg that was wired by the electrician by mistake. So eliminate the preventable by always checking so you don't lose gear needlessly. I would think you would have 2 speakers for the crowd, and one or more for you on stage. Chances of more than one failing at a time are remote so yup, flip one around and keep going. You can carry spares if you have enough money and space but mostly it's more of a case of, you do what you have to do when you have to do it to get the gig done. Since any and all gear can, and will fail at some time..... just buy the gear that you like, and sounds good and go play. Deal with the bumps in the road when they happen. I have gear now, setting here in my studio that I used...and abused.... for years live gigging that NEVER FAILED and still run perfectly to this day. EDIT TO ADD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDeF4sbhS1M this was found shortly after I posted here..... and went to another music site. This guy says in the first 2 minutes what I spoke about in the first paragraph above.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 07/21/14 05:32 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913 |
I have a 300 watt Fender power amp; I'm guessing that means around 100 watts per side with a peak of 150 per side.
Having said that, we never have to push the amp to fill our venues.
300 watts really isn't much juice. Most newer passives are rated higher than 100 watts. Might be time to upgrade the amp. You might also want to check out the Yamaha CM-12V. They are billed as monitors, but they do well as small mains, and have pole mounts. They are rated for 350 watts, but if you don't clip them, you should be OK. If you want a lot of pro advice, you could register and post this question on the PSW site. Those guys are all pro SR guys, and are current on all of the newest gear. http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.phpp.s. I would avoid anything that has "Behringer" on it. I agree with this post nearly 100%. Best to ask your question over at PSW. Is weight a concern at all, transportability, etc.? I've done a boatload of A/V system deliveries from a huge variety of brands - I've seen issues with them all at times, from cold solder joints on speaker leads inside cabinets to improperly attached pole mount pockets, etc. I have to believe that there isn't an affordable PA speaker company that does 100% QC checks these days.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,722
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,722 |
Jally,
I have been very fortunate over the years with little to no equipment failures, maybe an amp issue or two in more years than I care to remember, or can remember lol. In fact I have been playing so long that most bands I played with back then did not even have a PA system, every musician carried a little amp to each gig instead, even the horn men.
Re: the PA or speaker question, my rule of thumb is always pack a little more power than you think you will need. I know you said Bose is not on your short list, but I am using a Bose LII now and absolutely love it. With that said my second choice are my Mackie 15" powered speakers with a non-powered mixer. I am thinking these are 300 Watts per giving me plenty of clear clean power. In fact I have used them in outdoor park settings with great clear sound. But as stated they are in the attic as I may never use them again because I love the Bose so much.
Best of luck!
Later,
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 33 |
Thanks for all of the ideas.
I have been reading a lot of the old posts in the PSW site and a lot of the same ideas keep appearing so I think I have a better handle on things.
Thanks for the tips.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows Special Offers End Tomorrow (January 15th, 2026) at 11:59 PM PST!
Time really is running out! Save up to 50% on Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® upgrades and receive a FREE Bonus PAK—only when you order by 11:59 PM PST on Thursday, January 15, 2026!
We've added many major new features and new content in a redesigned Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
Version 2026 introduces a modernized GUI redesign across the program, with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, and a new Dark Mode option. There’s also a new side toolbar for quicker access to commonly used windows, and the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, making it easier to customize your workspace.
Another exciting new addition is the new AI-Notes feature, which can transcribe polyphonic audio into MIDI. You can view the results in notation or play them back as MIDI, and choose whether to process an entire track or focus on specific parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
Upgrade your Band-in-a-Box for Windows to save up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade packages!
Plus, when you order your Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade during our special, you'll receive a Free Bonus PAK of exciting new add-ons.
If you need any help deciding which package is the best option for you, just let us know. We are here to help!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® Special Offers Extended Until January 15, 2026!
Good news! You still have time to upgrade to the latest version of Band-in-a-Box® for Windows® and save. Our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® special now runs through January 15, 2025!
We've packed Band-in-a-Box® 2026 with major new features, enhancements, and an incredible lineup of new content! The program now sports a sleek, modern GUI redesign across the entire interface, including updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, a new dark mode option, and more. The brand-new side toolbar provides quicker access to key windows, while the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, creating a flexible, clutter-free workspace. We have an amazing new “AI-Notes” feature. This transcribes polyphonic audio into MIDI so you can view it in notation or play it back as MIDI. You can process an entire track (all pitched instruments and drums) or focus on individual parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
There are over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
When you order purchase Band-in-a-Box® 2026 before 11:59 PM PST on January 15th, you'll also receive a Free Bonus PAK packed with exciting new add-ons.
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® today! Check out the Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
Happy New Year!
Thank you for being part of the Band-in-a-Box® community.
Wishing you and yours a very happy 2026—Happy New Year from all of us at PG Music!
Season's Greetings!
Wishing everyone a happy, healthy holiday season—thanks for being part of our community!
The office will be closed for Christmas Day, but we will be back on Boxing Day (Dec 26th) at 6:00am PST.
Team PG
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: The Newly Designed Piano Roll Window
In this video, we explore the updated Piano Roll, complete with a modernized look and exciting new features. You’ll see new filtering options that make it easy to focus on specific note groups, smoother and more intuitive note entry and editing, and enhanced options for zooming, looping, and more.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: AI Stems & Notes - split polyphonic audio into instruments and transcribe
This video demonstrates how to use the new AI-Notes feature together with the AI-Stems splitter, allowing you to select an audio file and have it separated into individual stems while transcribing each one to its own MIDI track. AI-Notes converts polyphonic audio—either full mixes or individual instruments—into MIDI that you can view in notation or play back instantly.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Bonus PAK and 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®
With your version 2026 for Windows Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
- RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
- SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
- Android Band-in-a-Box® App (included)
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums57
Topics85,830
Posts796,715
Members39,968
| |
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean