Yes, I use it live in a contemporary praise & worship setting, lots of different styles. The songs are selected in advance and saved as Favorites and played using the Jukebox. Works great! I use RealTracks as much as possible, pretty much for everything but strings.
Jim Psalm 33:3 Sing unto him a new song; play skillfully with a loud noise.
Joden, I'm slowly moving toward that direction. I use a Tyros 5 keyboard at the moment, which is a superb arranger. For some songs, I will use BIAB backing tracks. The only drawback is the BIAB scores will be etched in stone. That is, if we have a full dance floor, my music partner can't all of a sudden send us back to a new chorus the way we can with the Tyros 5...unless someone has a way of changing that .
Yes, I use it live in a contemporary praise & worship setting, lots of different styles. The songs are selected in advance and saved as Favorites and played using the Jukebox. Works great! I use RealTracks as much as possible, pretty much for everything but strings.
Yes! It's funny about those strings. The midi strings are still far superior to anything available in RealTracks. The nearest I can get with RT is with Strings Rhythm Pop Country but they just don't sound right somehow.
Not that I have a use for BIAB in a live setting. But for recordings of myself playing; like you I prefer the Midi strings.
thanks guys...yeah I'm sorta getting tired of the whole create the song in BIAB then transfer to Sonar, then create MP3 tracks than transfer those to the stage laptop...and then is there is some level of effect that wasn't quite right live as opposed to in the studio, you have to "rinse and repeat" hahaha!...so yeah I'm thinking maybe just take BIAB out ther instead.
I tried the laptop routine, but, I don't lug it around anymore.
I have a pedal I can load the backing tracks into and start them in sequence. Or scroll through the songs and play them in any order I need. All of my songs are praise and worship originals. Usually just playing with another guitarist, and occasionally a drummer. Tracks have drums, piano/keys, bass, steel, sometimes harmonica, or cello. Usually mixed in RB with a short version and a longer version.
The sound guy likes the signal he gets from the pedal, it mixes the track, vocal and guitar levels and sends one signal to the board. I can change the guitar and vocal effects while the song is playing.
"When you help somebody else you are really helping yourself"
As Mac would say others mileage may vary . . . I love using my laptop on gigs. Especially since they are some great laptop stands that fit on Mic Stands these days, not to mention the smaller laptops themselves.
Maybe I am a control freak but I love having my entire rep just a click away, not to mention the the ability to make small changes even while the tune is in progress.
Later,
Last edited by Danny C.; 06/06/1611:47 AM. Reason: grammer correction
I use BIAB for Praise & Worship leading, as well as Southern Gospel performance tracks. I use BIAB to generate the individual instrument parts, and then drop those into Studio One (DAW) for editing, creating intros and endings and doing the final mix. Once it's in Studio One, I rarely go back to BIAB unless it's to generate a fill part. After mixing, I save the finished track as a WAV file and play it from my laptop on stage. I've tried other workflows, but this is definitely the best I've found for my needs.
Rich
Windows 10, 64 bit | BIAB 2019 PlusPak | Studio One 2 Artist
"my music partner can't all of a sudden send us back to a new chorus the way we can with the Tyros 5...unless someone has a way of changing that smile."
FF: Try the Condutor window...
Flatfoot sez: Call me when 'Talent-in-a-Box' is ready to ship! -- [8{>
Ummmm, no. I did quite a lot of that several years ago when I worked with a sax player and occasionally him and a singer. The saxman also fronted us and likes to talk and extend parts of tunes. The problem with the Conductor is you still need some warning that the vocalist or leader has decided to extend a verse or stops singing to talk to someone and I was expected to vamp. It was a near disaster several times. In the heat of battle neither one of them could give me any warning. They're used to bands and they just signal a vamp or take the bridge or whatever.
I finally had to get the guys to swear they would follow the song rather than try to lead it like they normally would. They kinda sorta did it but were not happy about it. They couldn't be themselves any more and it is a legitimate part of performing. It wasn't the sound quality, they loved that, it was the lack of control.
After a few gigs like that I broke out my Korg Pa1XPro arranger keyboard for the reasons mentioned earlier. I have total control that way even if the Korg's styles are not as good as Biab's. It does sound great though and if I had more time I could have created better song specific styles for it.
Playing Biab live on stage is fine as long as you're the leader, singer, whatever and if you have a partner they follow you. Then the Conductor can work.
Rich if you are just playing .wav files why do you need the laptop? Couldn't you just as well use a smartphone? or a tablet?
Yeah, I could do a smartphone or tablet, but the .wavs are already on my laptop and transferring tracks to a smartphone or tablet would be another step. My setup is to go from my laptop out to a USB Audio Interface and then to the Mixer. I also use a web-based app for playing the tracks. It stops at the end of each song and I just hit the enter key when I'm ready for the next song.
Last edited by Takamine; 06/07/1602:19 AM.
Rich
Windows 10, 64 bit | BIAB 2019 PlusPak | Studio One 2 Artist
Joden, I'm slowly moving toward that direction. I use a Tyros 5 keyboard at the moment, which is a superb arranger. For some songs, I will use BIAB backing tracks. The only drawback is the BIAB scores will be etched in stone. That is, if we have a full dance floor, my music partner can't all of a sudden send us back to a new chorus the way we can with the Tyros 5...unless someone has a way of changing that .
This and other Abelton vids I've seen are simply playing back static full songs, no different than rendering a Biab song to a wave file.
This thread is about how to rearrange a tune while it's playing like suddenly deciding to skip a verse, extend a solo or you decide to cut it short and jump to the ending.
I think Abelton can do that but I've never found a vid showing exactly how that could work plus Abelton is an expensive program, around $600.
" This thread is about how to rearrange a tune while it's playing like suddenly deciding to skip a verse, extend a solo or you decide to cut it short and jump to the ending. I think Abelton can do that..."
Yep. It does all that BB Conductor does and much more. Not only does it allow verse, chorus, bridge, intro, outro, etc live control, it will sync video and lights to your show. It brings the miracle of the click track to life....
This video gives a complete walk thru and demonstration of a live stage show using live vocals mixed with pre-recorded vocals, live instruments mixed with live instruments and how to flow into and out of the click track, how to use the click track in conjunction with a cue track.
At around the 52:45 mark, the speaker gets into how to re-arrange a tune while playing live. Everything you question in your quote above is addressed in this video.
Regarding the cost of the software package, you are investing in yourself and a professional career. It is a tool that is necessary if you want to compete at the level as the band in this workshop. That means to me me the same as if you play electric guitar, you also have to invest in an amplifier. So, a satisfactory compromise to me would be to purchase a $600 Epiphone knockoff rather than a $1800 Gibson and purchase Ableton with the money I saved..
In your case, as a keyboardist, if you have 4 keyboards, you may choose to sell one to cover the cost.
Thing I found with AL - is it is really tough to get audio parts to jump nicely without obvious artefacts. Although tbh I never used it with BIAB tracks. It (AL) worked well with MIDI files though.
I am using 100% realtracks and getting the segments perfectly aligned (without using bespoke audio loops, or painstakingly creating loops from BIAB RT's) in AL would be tricky and in some cases nigh on impossible I'd reckon.
I was thinking along the same lines. That is, I would not bring BIAB to the stage, just the exported wave files. I believe there are programs you can get where you can place markers at certain song points, and then skip to them at will. The Tyros 5 may already have that feature. Perhaps this is what Al does? And I quite agree, the skips would need to be seamless. Don't know if that's possible.
Just wondering, if you can control start and stop, choruses etc using midi in BIAB. If so, you could run it with a midi controller. I bought a neat software based midi controller, but I haven't had time to try it out yet.
Luckily I work on my own with BIAB box so I sort of follow my own plans. Certainly, I love having my effects units changing automatically using midi. Even then I get caught out by jukebox from time to time. Even when I write down the lengths of intros, where the solos are etc, in the heat of the moment it goes belly up as anyone who's seen me playing on streetjelly will know! :-)
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487 BIAB 2021 (Build 818) Intel(R) Core(TM), i3-4160, CPU @3.60 GHz RAM 16 GB, 64 Bit X64-based processor Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi) VoiceLive 3 Extreme, Sputnik Valve Condenser Mic
Thing I found with AL - is it is really tough to get audio parts to jump nicely without obvious artefacts. Although tbh I never used it with BIAB tracks. It (AL) worked well with MIDI files though.
I am using 100% realtracks and getting the segments perfectly aligned (without using bespoke audio loops, or painstakingly creating loops from BIAB RT's) in AL would be tricky and in some cases nigh on impossible I'd reckon.
There is a tutorial video (that I can't find quickly this morning) where the instructor builds a song specifically to be able to seamlessly jump from section to section.
He uses an original song (which he obviously knows the tempo and could just input that tempo) but -- to avoid glitches that you mention, he processes the song creating a tempo map that syncs the song with AL. The recorded song BPM is 130 but after the song is synced with AL, he changes the tempo to 132 for live use and the tempo map adjusts as well. He places markers to organize the song in AL and the markers are synced with the tempo map. Jumping from section to section is seamless.
Once a song has been processed, sections can be moved, deleted, copied and pasted, lengthened and shortened as desired.
I will search some more for that YT video and post here for those who may be interested.
An off topic piece - The syncing process to create a tempo map is similar to using the Audio Chord Wizard in BIAB to create an accurate tempo map.
That may be a tip to try that will help tighten up a song for those who may use the BIAB Conductor feature. The ACW creates a unique and accurate tempo map for any song and sync the tempo map to the BIAB chord chart. My thinking is that process should work the same within BIAB as it does in the AL instructional video.
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