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I made a single midi strumming guitar track out of 4 separate BIAB styles. It sounds great with SampleTank3. Imported the the midi file to Reaper. I hear clicking or snapping sounds in a few places. I think I hear the annoyances at the beginning of where I changed styles. In Reaper Piano Roll I see vertical lines in a few places, maybe where the style changes are. Has anyone run into this kind of thing? Any solution?
Last edited by Tobias; 10/29/16 08:20 AM.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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Tobias, This might help. Reading between the lines, it sounds like you don't have Reaper set-up to reflect BIAB's bar numbers. When bar numbers align between the two applications, it's easy to isolate this kind of thing. For example, say you hear the sound in bar 36 in Reaper. Have a look at the song file in BIAB and see what's happening at bar 36 The below pdf, which I recently prepared for a friend, explains how to get bar numbers aligning. It's not all that hard. Setting up Reaper so bars align with BIAB (link to pdf)Regards, Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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I'm already set up that way in reaper and I don't hear clicks in 2 BIAB generated midi strings tracks (with no style changes) I imported to reaper. They both lined up instantly on import. The basis of this song started with a BIAB song file with 5 instruments. I then used the same BIAB song file to create the strings tracks by selecting a style and making slight changes to the chords; holds in different places is about it. My Strings MIDIs imported perfectly, no clicking. I then started over with the original BIAB song file. Made style changes and a few chord behavior changes for acoustic guitar strumming. BTW, the new style picker was fantastic at this task. I have around 12 style changes but only 4 different styles.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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How do you import the audio into Reaper? Is it drag and drop or do you save it and then load it into Reaper as an independent step?
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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The same way I brought the BIAB generated .wav files. I saved the midi file in a directory then drag it to Reapers TCP and let go. The other midi tracks with no style changes were done the same way with no issues. It does not appear to or sound like it has alignment issues.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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Hi Tobias,
Thanks for the update. What does TCP stand for? Even though I've been using Reaper for a number of years, I haven't yet come across that term so I'm not quite sure how to interpret what you wrote.
What I'd be doing is to solo each track in the mix and then listen within the vicinity of the click. That would narrow down which track(s) are responsible. Once the track or tracks are identified, problem solving can then begin.
Regards,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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Track Control Panel. A few of the Kenny Gioia tutorials call it TCP. I drop them in a blank area just below the Volume Slider in the track control panel.
I soloed the tracks and tried other things to narrow down the issue prior to starting this thread.
I think it might be a "tics per beat" difference between BIAB and Reaper. I'm trying some things with that now.
Last edited by Tobias; 10/29/16 06:42 PM.
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I think I got it fixed. Although it was not a mis-aligned bars issue as all the strums and chord changes were happening in the right spots and in time. Your tutorial did gave me some clues in the right direction. I have BIAB set to 240 tics per 1/4 beat and Reaper was set to 960. I simply set Reaper to 240 tics per beat, deleted the track, inserted a new black track and drag/dropped the same midi file from my directory to the TCP again.
No more clicking sounds. At least for now. I'll have to check it thoroughly after I wake up.
Thanks for your help.
Last edited by Tobias; 10/29/16 07:51 PM.
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Tobias That's excellent. Thanks for passing on the solution, too. It would never have occurred to me that ticks per beat could have done this. If you have a fairly recent version of BIAB, it's possible to set the ticks per beat to 960, too. Simply enter into preferences and follow the 1, 2, 3 on the below image.  This might be useful to try. Regards, Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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240 X 4 = 960. I wouldn't think there'd be an issue with that. However, the Reaper preference setting is this:
"Ticks per quarter note for new MIDI items: [240] (default: 960)"
Since I imported it as a pre-made midi file perhaps Reaper added resolution to the file and then hiccupped on the interpretation. As in; maybe some midi notes were partially overlapping some of the added ticks that did not exist in the original file. And, Reaper hesitated when it was then forced to choose a nearby tick for some notes. Maybe this happened on slight note overlaps since this is a down-up-down-up strumming acoustic guitar midi file where some notes are sounding and then sound again where there is no gap or where there is slight overlap.
This may explain why it did not occur on my 2 string midis which also came from BIAB. The strings are mostly long notes/chord that hold for entire measures.
Also makes me wonder if there might be issues if I ever use pre-made third party midi files of unknown resolution.
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What would be a reason to go with really high tick resolution on a MIDI file? Seams it was, for unknown reason, important for Reapers default to be 960.
Last edited by Tobias; 10/31/16 10:16 AM.
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What would be a reason to go with really high tick resolution on a MIDI file? For a MIDI file, 960 tick resolution generally isn't necessary, but it will give you better resolution of glissandos or very fast notes (64th or 128th notes) Also, if you use audio or render MIDI to audio, you will get more head room for slicing and dicing the audio. As far as MIDI is concerned, I believe the standard BIAB resolution of 120 is too low, because once you divide a note to 64th notes, the program has to decide whether to use 7 ticks or 8 ticks, since it splits at 7.5. Likewise, if you go to 128th notes (maybe a harp glissando), then at 240 ticks, it would also have to decide whether to split the 7.5 at 7 or 8. Resolution - Ticks to represent the noteResolution - 960 - 240 - 120 1/4 Note - 960 - 240 - 120 1/8 Note - 480 - 120 - 060 1/16 Note - 240 - 060 - 030 1/32 Note - 120 - 030 - 015 1/64 Note - 060 - 015 - 007.5 1/128 Note - 030 - 007.5 - 003.75 (I apologize that the table doesn't line up - the forum collapses multiple spaces into a single space). That's why I believe the default 120 resolution that BIAB uses is too low. At least RealBand supports the higher resolutions.
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How fine the resolution resolves is related to the Tempo. 120 Resolutions is finer (timewise) at Tempo 132 than at Tempo 96 .. so there can be a bunch to consider. I always prefer 960 minimum and usually 3840. It helps a TON with audio edits in RB.
As for the Reaper issue; I'm guessing when you brought in 240 Resolution MIDI, and the new Resolution is 960, if the on/off (duration) of each Event didn't change, you could have ended up with a bunch of chopped up MIDI .. which may cause some synths to behave differently than others.
Or maybe indeed you did confuse Reaper's MIDI engine .. but I'd think that would be less likely of an issue than the synth actually making the sound.
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BiaB's default of 120ppq IMHO is too small.
I think 240ppq should be the minimum and 480 adequate for most applications. 960 works even better than that, but is an overkill for most things. Still it's good to have.
If I were to import something into BiaB, I'd probably convert it to 120ppq first. It seems to me that would head any trouble off.
Depending on the instrument, I also filter out any non-necessary MIDI data. For example, if I use my wind synth to make a guitar part, I'll filter out breath data (continuous controller #2) before I import it into BiaB. Why give BiaB something that is not appropriate to a guitar part. Pitch bend for a piano would be another example.
Of course, there may be a reason why you want pitch bend on a piano, or some other non-native effect to an instrument, and they would be the exceptions to that rule.
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