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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 60
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OP
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 60 |
Using _PJONPB2.... simple country ballad.
I used Melodist to generate a quick song. I noticed that some notes just cut off randomly, especially at the beginning of a new chord change. Is this normal?
The Lead Sheet/notation shows say, it's supposed to be two half notes... but they play staccato.
Don't know if this is normal (this is with a RealTrack, piano)... but it certainly does not sound very professional, as advertised.
Been messing with the program all night... trying to figure it out better.
Thanks!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,793
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,793 |
Using _PJONPB2.... simple country ballad.
I used Melodist to generate a quick song. I noticed that some notes just cut off randomly, especially at the beginning of a new chord change. Is this normal?
The Lead Sheet/notation shows say, it's supposed to be two half notes... but they play staccato.
Don't know if this is normal (this is with a RealTrack, piano)... but it certainly does not sound very professional, as advertised.
Been messing with the program all night... trying to figure it out better.
Thanks!
It will take a lot more than a night to figure this program out. Really! it is that complex. I did listened to the RT you mentioned. When I added a new track via melodist, I remembered immediately the strengths and limitations of this feature of BIAB. Never actually used it much. The melodist creates a midi file (computer generated) with a patch (distorted guitar) which I didn't bother to figure out where it was coming from. That would explain the "sound quality". The notation to the midi track was interesting but I did notice the staccato which was not surprising given the midi source. Were you expecting to make you next song based on a computer generated midi melody track? Then you likely have heard enough from the Melodist. But, If you were interested in seeing how phrasing and styles could be adjusted to create ideas for your melodies than you will want to spend more time in the Melodist feature. Either way, good luck.
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,793
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Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,793 |
Don't know if this is normal (this is with a RealTrack, piano)... but it certainly does not sound very professional, as advertised.
We should clear this up. Maybe I missed the whole point here.  I am certain that the melodist track is not playing the midi lines via a Realtrack. That is not how it works. The real tracks I listened to sounded "professional, as advertised". I thought it was the melodist track you had a problem with?? And regarding the notation some RT notation is "as played" and other are notated after the fact. Is this the problem.
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
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Dan is correct, the Melodist is producing MIDI and is not related to RealTracks. BIAB does have the ability to edit the whole MIDI track for note length, if that's the question. Maybe even adding some reverb to that track will help. The patch (instrument) is critical; a guitar will fade quickly. And we need to know what is playing your MIDI, since MIDI has no sound at all - it's just instructions.
Dan is also correct that the notation for RealTracks is of differing accuracy (I did a few of these) but that is not relevant to the Melodist.
Once we get the basic concepts down, then we can hone in on the solutions needed.
And Dan is particularly right about learning the program. I learn something new every day after using it for 25 years.
So let's try again. Tell us exactly what you did, what it did, and why that's different from what you expected. Also tell us what your Preferences, MIDI driver, Output is set to.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 60
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OP
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I understand what you guys are saying, but it was actually the main piano part, in the RealTrack. It wasn't just the Melodist. I only used the Melodist to generate a song/chord progression. But the piano part, I thought, was supposed to sound flowing, as it was a rhythm part, and not a lead part.
Thanks for any additional advice!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,449
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Ok, very helpful.
Forget all that about MIDI.
What is the number of the RealTrack (you can see that in the Mixer)? Did you turn off Natural Arrangement?
RealTracks are what I call 'audio snippets' that may be anywhere from one to eight measures long. Sometimes the voice leading is smooth, sometimes less so. You can freeze the other tracks you like and regenerate/play the song until the piano backing may improve.
What are the chord changes?
And, there is a small possibility that this one RealTrack may have a programming error if this is reproducible, especially if it is a new RealTrack. That can be fixed by PG Music.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,697
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The biggest problem with all the piano RT's is the lack of sustain between chords and there's nothing that can be done about it.
A piano has a sustain pedal that the player uses to smooth out chord transitions. Another technique is to use your fingers to hold down the common notes between two chords so only those notes sustain. What do those two techniques have in common?
THE PLAYER KNOWS WHAT CHORDS HE'S PLAYING AND WHAT IS COMING NEXT.
RT's are prerecorded phrases. The player does not know what chords a user is going to use therefore it's impossible for all the chord changes to have proper sustain between the chords unless somebody actually records every possible combination of all the chords both major, minor and all the common extensions and sustains all those combinations IN ALL KEYS or at least the minimum needed for an RT. Short of that, if you put in two chords that were not recorded together originally, you're going to hear the first chord chopped off.
This is one of the really big tradeoffs between the Real Tracks and midi. With midi it's easy to simply write in those sustains after the fact but to do that with an audio file? It's like listening to a chopped guitar chord on one of your favorite CD recordings and thinking how cool would that be if he held that chord? How can you sustain a chord on an audio file after it's been recorded?
This is complicated stuff and it's amazing to me it works as well as it does.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
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This is complicated stuff and it's amazing to me it works as well as it does. Yes, I could not have summed it up more perfectly. Some very clever algorithms must be involved to create the subtlety we actually experience.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2003
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........
This is one of the really big tradeoffs between the Real Tracks and midi. With midi it's easy to simply write in those sustains after the fact but to do that with an audio file? It's like listening to a chopped guitar chord on one of your favorite CD recordings and thinking how cool would that be if he held that chord? How can you sustain a chord on an audio file after it's been recorded?
This is complicated stuff and it's amazing to me it works as well as it does.
Bob
Excellent points Bob. FWI - There is one way to make an audio file piano sustain if one has a 64 bit DAW and Melodyne 4 Editor. You bring the RT wav into Melodyne, highlight and extend the notes you want to sustain. It is is very time intensive exercise but the results are excellent. I have done this a couple of times using Sonar and Melodyne. I also have changed chords in audio. For example if one played a Gm and we wanted a G in Melodyne I move the Bb up to a B.
Principal: Your child always causes trouble in school.
Me: My child causes trouble at home, do I ever call you?
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2005
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True but Mario, we're not talking about spending another $500-1,000 for more software here. Sure, lots of things are possible if money and time spent learning it is not an issue.
If Major7th is willing to do that, we can certainly discuss it in more detail. Maybe if he gets good enough at this he'll get a promotion to Major9th...
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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