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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,100
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Thanks Bob for the input
........
As mentioned: I really do think this should NOT have stopped the volume slider from doing anything at all. Why couldn't the volume slider for the track change the volume on channel 8 & 9? After all, they are just 2 channels on the same 'Track'.
Trev Trev here is my opinion based on a similar situation on my DAW. There were two volume controls trying to control the gain of one track. It doesn't matter what channel or channels are involved it is still only one track. So the software sees the first channel's volume control then ignores the rest. If it didn't there would be constant fighting between the two volume controls and the track would use both, causing the volume to jump all over the place. For both volume controls to work all of channel 8's data should be on one track and channel 9's data on another track. By data I mean notes, volume and whatever else was used in the channels. This is just my opinion and if it is wrong would someone please explain the real reason to me.
Doc-take it easy John this is just a sharp scalpel. It will not cut deep so don't worry.
Me-I'm not John
Doc-I know, I am!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,693
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Since you're saying this isn't an original MacKenzie midi file but another user, the file itself could still be messed up. As I said earlier I have some files in a test folder going back years that I'll play with from time to time just for fun. Or more aggravation, ha. So far no matter what I do they simply will not play correctly and I don't know why. I did the same thing you did, I put them in RB and used every trick I know to manipulate them and got squat.
I was thinking it could be the synth but you initially said you're using the Forte Dxi and we all know it responds to the volume slider just fine. It's some of the other synths like Garritan or Sampletank that don't.
I dunno boss, I would usually ask you about something like this not the other way around...
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,286
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Hi Bob
Re: "Since you're saying this isn't an original MacKenzie midi file but another user". There might be some confusion. I'm very sure this is a Doug McKenzie file, but I think he produced it from the Nord output, not BiaB output.
What is confusing with BiaB is that the VU meter level in the Mixer reacts with the notes in the music perfectly. If I lower the volume, the VU meter level also visibly lowers. If I raise it, the VU meter level increases. But the entire time, the output volume never changes.
The way I see it is that whatever is on that track should change. I compare this to mixing desk where the sound engineer has two separate audio sources connected to one track. Just because there are two inputs shouldn't mean that the mixer volume cannot be adjusted. After all it is controlling the audio level of downstream equipment, not the upstream source.
And the BiaB VU meter does change, indicating that it is recognizing the adjustment somehow.
Anyway, I know how to resolve now. And I definitely agree that MIDI can be troublesome, especially with the virtually unlimited variations in file content.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
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I dunno boss, I would usually ask you about something like this not the other way around... I'm going to use this tomorrow .. some way, some how /thanks
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2011
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The file may have used two midi channels to independently record left hand and right hand playing.
Midi files with each hand on a different channel use to be common. It is easier to step sequence and correct playing mistakes during file creation. During playback the hardware does not need to play as many notes at one time and the voicing can be set up differently between the two hands to enhance the audio performance.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
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OP
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Good point Jim, and I did expect that was the case, however, when I studied the data, this did not make sense as there was no clear separation. The same notes appeared sometimes on channel 8 and sometimes on channel 9.
And I'm sure this wasn't step sequenced, because there is a video of the performer playing this live.
Very strange.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114 |
Hi
Just a final thought on this one.
Some midi files and daws use automation tracks to control fade in and out by controlling the mixer.
So let’s say you had a piano on track 8 ch 8 track volume 64
Automation for that could be on track 9 it would have to be ch 8 to control the same piano.
Now if some had used cc7 volume events instead of cc11 expression, to make a fade up to say 100 that is what the piano would play at, .its last received value for that channel.
Cc7 is a continuous controller that is the last value sent holds until it gets a new one.
However the tracks are read in order the high number being the last read is the last value sent to the channel
In this case what ever you sent to track 8 would be overwritten by the info on track 9 which has sent a volume vale of 100 in this example
Don’t want to muddy the water but worth a thought
Best regards
Mike
BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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OP
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That would explain it, except as mentioned there were absolutely no CC messages in the file. Changing the channel 9 data to channel 8 resolved the problem.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,114
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Dec 2015
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Hi
Yes I see. in that case track9 must have sent a volume level to ch 8 in the header information that you cant see .
You only see cc sent to a tracks later , you can not see the opening value in the header except that it sets the initial value for that track / channel
Just another thought,
Mike
BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 201
Apprentice
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Apprentice
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 201 |
I just popped in here to ask a similar question, but in RealBand. I couldn't find how to lower a MIDI Supertrack volume in the Mixer or Tracks windows. For anyone that it might help, I hit the 'fx' button, got into the synth controls and used the 'trim' button as the volume control, which worked well. Feel free to tell me an alternative control! Thanks.
Best, Warren
Warren A. Keller- Woodwindist/Producer
Spontaneous Groovin' Combustion
Tune 9 Music- SESAC
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
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Band-in-a-Box 2025 Italian Version is Here!
Cari amici
È stata aggerate la versione in Italiano del programma più amato dagli appassionati di musica, il nostro Band-in-a-Box.
Questo è il link alla nuova versione 2025.
Di seguito i link per scaricare il pacchetti di lingua italiana aggiornati per Band-in-a-Box e RealBand, anche per chi avesse già comprato la nuova versione in inglese.
Band-in-a-Box 2025 - Italiano
RealBand 2025 - Italiano
Band-in-a-Box 2025 French Version is Here!
Bonjour à tous,
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 pour Windows est disponible en Français.
Le téléchargement se fait à partir du site PG Music
Pour ceux qui auraient déjà acheté la version 2025 de Band-in-a-Box (et qui donc ont une version anglaise), il est possible de "franciser" cette version avec les patchs suivants:
BIAB 2025 - francisation
RealBand 2025 - francisation
Voilà, enjoy!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 German Version is Here!
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Video: Summary of the New Band-in-a-Box® App for iOS®
Join Tobin as he takes you on a tour of the new Band-in-a-Box® app for iOS®! Designed for musicians, singer-songwriters, and educators, this powerful tool lets you create, play, and transfer songs effortlessly on your iPhone® or iPad®—anytime, anywhere.
Band-in-a-Box® for iOS® :Summary video.
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