I have been enjoying my BIAB 2017 experience so far, but I have a couple of questions about things which are not intuitive to me, and I am hoping someone can help steer me in the right direction
1 ) I seem to have lost a couple of instruments in one of the "bluegrass" style. I was fiddling around with switching out realtracks to get a new blend of instruments, but now when I go and select the style, some of the instruments no longer play (even though it looks like the right realtrack is selected, and it displays green). I click "regenerate realtrack" but still nothing - my guitar and fiddle apparently are gone forever.... Does anyone know what I should do?
2 ) I am having a tough time directing a song in terms of repeating sections. The way the program seems to present everything is as a single chorus which is repeated N times, then an "end". How do you change the song form so I can have verse/chorus/verse/chorus/bridge/chorus for example?
thanks all!!
BIAB user since Feb 2017 Songwriter for far too long
I don't know the answer to #1 but I'm sure someone here does.
For #2; if you like working 'linearly' like this you may like Realband better. You probably already have it (included with BiaB) and may want to try it.
For me it makes more sense to work in the linear way you describe and I find RB more flexible (and designed for this), but there is a way to 'Unfold' a song in BiaB also, so hopefully someone else chimes in soon on how to do that. Then the song becomes linear in BiaB and you can work with it as such. Like I said; RB behaves this way from the git-go, so I'm more comfortable in RB (for this and many other reasons).
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome Make your sound your own!
I don't know the answer to #1 but I'm sure someone here does.
For #2; if you like working 'linearly' like this you may like Realband better. You probably already have it (included with BiaB) and may want to try it.
Thanks! I am going to try it right now!
Hoping someone can come in and get me my mandolin back (it is
Mandolin, Rhythm Bluegrass Ev 130 Mandolin background strumming. Try the demo song for _BG_Band.STY to hear an 'all-RealTracks' Bluegrass Band. For best results, use over maj/min/dom7 chords. Tempo range: 115-170 Style suggestions: SLAWTERS, BG101_D, BAGWELL, J_CASH, SKA_1, AG_JUMP, SKA_FUNK )
BIAB user since Feb 2017 Songwriter for far too long
Are your instrument tracks muted or volume down too far? Are those instrument tracks set to midi and frozen? Not sure what you did but I don't think you accidentally deleted any RealTracks from the BIAB RealTracks folder. Not sure if this will work but here's an idea; Save your song. Hi-lite all the chords in the chord chart. Right click. Copy. Open a new song blank. Right click on the first bar. Paste. Set your tempo, repeats and style. See if all your instruments play now.
There is also a preference setting that allows you to have more than one instance of BIAB open. There you can copy/paste side-by-side.
I prefer to use BIAB linearly too - i.e - have the whole song run down the page just as it is actually played. See attachment - change "Choruses" to 1 from the default 3 and I also untick the "loop". Then simply extend the number of bars as you progress entering your chords until you finish. Remember that if the chords repeat per verse or chorus, you can use copy and paste to save a lot of input time. HTH Ian
Old Guys Rule.The older I get,the better I was! BB2023 ULTRA, 1013, Win 7 and 10
Ian is correct. The only other thing I do in addition is to select song settings and uncheck the box for < Generate 2 bar ending for this song >
Unchecking the box removes the ending and you have to complete your own ending, such as creating a fade out or similar.
I have had your question #1 situation happen to me on occasion and can't recall the fix at the moment.
I will try to duplicate it later today and return with my findings if someone else hasn't jumped in by that time.
In the meantime, you may want to select a completely different style, generate it, then return to the original style and I'm thinking that will in a sense, do a hard style reset and your style's Realtracks should be back to normal if I've guessed correctly.
In the meantime, you may want to select a completely different style, generate it, then return to the original style and I'm thinking that will in a sense, do a hard style reset and your style's Realtracks should be back to normal if I've guessed correctly.
thanks guys -
I did try this fix, also closing the song and reopening it (without success). I know the volumes are good, because I even use the "solo" option and I cannot get anythign to come out.
I will try a full copy-paste to new song tonight.
As for the "Realband" option. I did open it up, and it seemed incredibly slow to me - First I tried to open an existing song (took about 5 minutes to open and wouldnt play any music). i then tried making a new song and similarly got no sound. I have a feeling its because of the audio setup (which I dont ever remember being prompted for in the main BAIB software). This is a spinoff topic, but since you guys have probably seen it happen before, I am hoping someone could come in on this!
Just a bit of background - I have been recording music for 20 years - I play mandolin, guitar, (tenor) banjo. I have gone from magnetic tape recording all the way through to digital recording. I have used professional studios, Fostex standlone systems, Cubase, Mixcraft, Reaper. I still find BIAB a very compelling tool - why? Becuase it can "play" instruments I can't - even the session musicians do a better job of the Tenor Banjo and Mandolin than I can, even though I have been playing both in a band for years. As far as I am concerned, Realtracks are a game changer.
The only thing I am asking myself though is "where is the spark?" - if you assemble a song from all these prerecorded elements, how do you keep a song original ? Your own lyrics and chord choices dont *quite* seem enough. Perhaps this is a question for the general topic rather than extending this topic!
thanks again all - hopefully someone has some new insights!
BIAB user since Feb 2017 Songwriter for far too long
Here are some ideas for issue #1, instruments don't play.
Use your computer browser to find the style you used in the song then see if the file date has been changed. For example you listed the style _BG_Band.STY. I did a search for that file and saw the file's last modified date is January 22, 2008. Obviously if the date was February 23, 2017 there is a good chance you accidentally messed up the file. You could contact PG Support and they could work with you to get a copy of the original file.
Create a new, test song. Load the style you're having trouble with and visually verify the instruments load. If they do, type a few chords into the chord sheet and regenerate. Do all the instruments play? If they do the style is okay and your BiaB settings are okay and the song file is corrupt. Sometimes it's easier to start over than to figure out how the song file is corrupt. If not then provide as much information as you can (what style, what instruments, RealTracks, midi SuperTracks, midi, etc. If midi is involved what are you DXI / VST settings? Do you have a an external sound module and so on.
#1. When all else fails...reboot. I sometimes have to do a hard boot. My interface looses communication and sync.... the only fix is a reboot. Shut everything off...with 5 seconds, turn it back on.
#2. Unfold the song. I got tired of trying to make BB follow the road signs of the musical kind.... Unfold into one linear song and edit as needed. I work 100% of my songs in this manner.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
#1. When all else fails...reboot. I sometimes have to do a hard boot. My interface looses communication and sync.... the only fix is a reboot. Shut everything off...with 5 seconds, turn it back on.
the reboot fixed it, thanks!!
BIAB user since Feb 2017 Songwriter for far too long
As for the "Realband" option. I did open it up, and it seemed incredibly slow to me - First I tried to open an existing song (took about 5 minutes to open and wouldnt play any music). i then tried making a new song and similarly got no sound. I have a feeling its because of the audio setup (which I dont ever remember being prompted for in the main BAIB software). This is a spinoff topic, but since you guys have probably seen it happen before, I am hoping someone could come in on this!
Just a bit of background - I have been recording music for 20 years - I play mandolin, guitar, (tenor) banjo. I have gone from magnetic tape recording all the way through to digital recording. I have used professional studios, Fostex standlone systems, Cubase, Mixcraft, Reaper. I still find BIAB a very compelling tool - why? Becuase it can "play" instruments I can't - even the session musicians do a better job of the Tenor Banjo and Mandolin than I can, even though I have been playing both in a band for years. As far as I am concerned, Realtracks are a game changer.
The only thing I am asking myself though is "where is the spark?" - if you assemble a song from all these prerecorded elements, how do you keep a song original ? Your own lyrics and chord choices dont *quite* seem enough. Perhaps this is a question for the general topic rather than extending this topic!
thanks again all - hopefully someone has some new insights!
The first time you open RB it takes a while since it's setting everything up for the first time. After that, it's a bit faster. Certainly less time than it takes a studio musician to come in, unpack, tune up, and get ready to record.
Next, just like in BB, you need to set up a default synth... use the same one you used in BB, so it can give you sound.
Where is the spark? How does this work to make magic?
Glad you asked. Open the song project from BB and let it populate the tracks. If you used a style in BB which uses real tracks they will come in that way automatically. I try to use RT styles exclusively in BB. If not, if the project is 100% midi.... you will need to generate the real tracks. Once you have a full RT in the project, you can then select it, and then click on a blank track to generate a new, different RT.
In BB lets say the style is hard rock. Bass, drums, and 2 guitars, maybe a B3. 5 tracks total. RB will generate those tracks for you. Lets say you want a mandolin and a dobro and a fiddle and maybe a steel in there as well. Select one of the existing tracks, and choose GENERATE a Real Track and select the track for fiddle that matches close to tempo and style. repeat that for the rest of the tracks.
Export the waves you created to the DAW of your choice for editing. This is exactly how I do all the songs I write and record using BB/RB. I add my live tracks and vox in the DAW.
As my latest song Whiskey for Breakfast shows, if you can imagine it, and a player can physically play it, you can recreate it with these programs. While you are working "in the box" you simply have to think "out of the box".
Hope this helps.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
Are you the same Herb Hartley who has done a couple of collaborations with Pat Bishop from Houston? If so, Hi!
Yes indeed. Who are you? Where are you from and how do you know Pat and me?
Pat and I are having a hard time getting on the same page at the same time with some new material. Likely just plain old laziness.
BTW: On my music page you will find a number of our collabs.
In A World Without You
Footsteps in the Hall
Come & Go
That Ought to Count for Something
Give Me A Chance
Something to Die For
I Will Run To You
Your Love
That's the Way the Cowgirls Dance
With God All Things Are Possible
Just To Love You More
Merry Christmas From Kandahar
I hadn't realized that we had written that many songs.... I knew it was a few.... and I think there's a bunch that didn't make it out of the discussion stage.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
#2. Unfold the song. I got tired of trying to make BB follow the road signs of the musical kind.... Unfold into one linear song and edit as needed. I work 100% of my songs in this manner.
100%. Thats why I went that way in the end. And I found doing it this way so much easier to squeeze in a say a fresh instrument in, say, the second "verse" and then take it out again than messing with Tags etc and getting really confused. I doesnt take a lot! Ian
Old Guys Rule.The older I get,the better I was! BB2023 ULTRA, 1013, Win 7 and 10
All the advice here about unfolding is sound and well expressed. I have a slightly different take.
The song structure BiaB uses and expects is:
1. Introduction (no repeat) 2. Verses (with repeats. Variation in middle choruses.) 3. Ending (2-bar, 4-bar and tag endings are available. No repeats)
I suggest you learn to use all the different endings, especially tag endings. Using the repeats and tags makes for a much more compact and efficient display on the screen.
Analyze some the demo songs to learn how BiaB thinks about song structure. Then experiment until you know how to make the tags work. There is a lot speed, convenience and power in these tools.
Flatfoot sez: Call me when 'Talent-in-a-Box' is ready to ship! -- [8{>
Just as another data point: I have tried to use RB to see what the fuss is about. It opens (eventually) but opening up a song created in BIAB crashes the program. I have a pretty beefy machine, so not quite sure what's going on, but it's why I've stuck with BIAB for now.
------------------------- PC: Win10 Pro 64 32GB RAM + Two 250GB SSD + Two 4TB Externals Software: BIAB 2017 / Reaper / Sonar / EZDrummer 2 / EastWest Composer Cloud / Amplitube 4 Guitar: Gibson SG T Heritage Cherry
Have you updated RealBand to the latest build? If you just tried to use the one that came with it, there are probably some bug fix updates since then.
Also, make sure you didn't install it to the "Program Files (x86)" folder, which Windows protects.
You probably might want to also set it to run as administrator.
I'm not saying that it won't crash occasionally, but using the latest updates seems to be pretty solid now.
Also, be aware, that unlike BIAB, it doesn't start playing right away. It has to fully generate the entire arrangement for all tracks before you can play. You just need to be patient.
It's also possible you need an update sound driver, as that can sometimes cause problems (and that can be on any audio program).
And were you using ASIO and which ASIO driver were you using? If you use ASIO4ALL and have multiple sound interfaces on your computer, ASIO4ALL sometimes chooses the wrong one and you have to go into he A4A control panel and set it to the correct one.
If you have a lot of DX/DXi plugins, sometimes an ill-behaved plugin can cause problems (as can some VST/VSTi plugins).
Just a few things to look at to hopefully make it work for you.
John
Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 12TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 12TB SATA
Just as another data point: I have tried to use RB to see what the fuss is about. It opens (eventually) but opening up a song created in BIAB crashes the program. I have a pretty beefy machine, so not quite sure what's going on, but it's why I've stuck with BIAB for now.
FWIW last night (and the previous few Wednesdays) we've been testing RB as recording software. We are only doing about 2 hour sessions, but they are writing sessions and we are recording a lot. We'll record 8 tracks at a time for 10-15 minutes a pop, save it and start another. At the end of the night we listen back and listen and decide which we want to keep/pursue.
This is on a machine not quite as powerful as yours. RB 'should' run on it. If you want to pursue the issue I'll try to help. Below are a few things to check before trying to open a BiaB file. First, of course is make sure you have the latest update. Post your version here if possible. Also make sure RB is Activated so you eliminate any licensing issues. This can be found in the Help-Utilities menu (check before trying to open a BiaB file).
1. Is RB pointed to the correct location for the Realtracks and Realdrums (and basic styles)? To check this click the 'Prefs' button and check the 'Song Generation' tab. Even if you think they are correct it may be worth using the Browse button and locating the folder and re-saving it to be sure. Note that this can be different than the root folder mentioned below)
2. Are BB and Realband installed in the root folder? By that I mean it should be installed to C:\bb and C:\Realband .. if it is in a different location consider changing this. RB relies on being able to find some files in the BB folder so this can be important.
3. If you experience crashes as you describe; before launching Realband, launch Task Manager and look on the procceses tab for either FP32 or bbw or bbw2 running (before you launch RB and knowing BiaB is closed). If they exist 'End Task'. If RB crashed previously one of these services may have been left running, which may make subsequent sessions have problems.
After doing the above, right click your Realband shortcut and select 'Run as Administrator'. You'll likely get a security pop-up when you launch it that you can click OK to. If this fixes the problem there are ways to make that one popup go away.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome Make your sound your own!
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MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
Playable RealTracks Set 5
RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
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Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
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